Down Forum

Div 3 senior football

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You see I'd read them rules regarding qualification as being as if these teams were in the same group. In this case, the two teams involved aren't.

the_wanderer (Down) - Posts: 12 - 06/09/2013 09:14:03    1476229

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Except where provided for otherwise in County

Bye-Law or in Competition Regulation


key point ?

EIREANNACH (Down) - Posts: 241 - 06/09/2013 11:09:19    1476339

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Alterations may be considered only on an annual

basis.


Not during the competition......

EIREANNACH (Down) - Posts: 241 - 06/09/2013 11:38:00    1476381

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to me its cut and dried, but any legislation is ambiguous and open to interpretation, that is why we have the different levels of appeals and counter appeals at the CCCC.

Dundeal, I have read it and read it again but still come up with the same conclusion. happy to take you slant on it

Square ball (None) - Posts: 62 - 06/09/2013 13:46:37    1476539

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Its time to get the lawyers in.

My take is that even though the two teams were in different groups and could not therefore play each other in the competition - this rules out section 5 (c) (i) completely - that now the County Board will try to say that the whole competition was one big overall group - which moves us on to section 5 (c) (ii) and (iii).

Sections 5 (c) (ii) and (iii) - which focuses on scores - are being ignored by the county board because of the forfeited game.

This moves the County Board onto section 5 (c) (iv) the play off which is given some credence by the exception rule. This is the County Board preferred solution.

However the County Board would appear (we need to see this in writing) to have approved a +5 win scoring margin and this dictates that along with the two points for a victory comes this inseparable win score margin. If this subclause is written in the Down Competition Rules Book then this is the key point in all of this. All teams are deemed to know this and as nobody has raised an objection to this then it is the RULE to which everyone must abide. (I would hazard a guess that this +5 only came into existence so that the computer system updated the tables correctly. The system wasn't sophisticated enough to give a victory 2 points with an 0-0 to 0-0 scoreline as it needed something to definitively indicate a victory. If so all it needed to be was just +1 point winning margin - but even that creates the problem that we are in.

Going back to the GAA rule book and section 4 it clearly says that any rule agreed internally before a competition starts stands for that competition and any alteration to it must be only be done on an annual basis and therefore once agreed there can be NO CHANGES until next year.

We need to see the Down internal competition rules. They will have a big bearing on this. Has anyone access to these?

Still looks like Dromara are in and Drumaness are out because of the better scoring of Dromara. Drumaness effectively fought by the sword (the Rules Book) and now must die by the sword (the Rules Book).

A RULE CHANGE IS DEFINITELY COMING NEXT YEAR.

anduna (Down) - Posts: 210 - 06/09/2013 13:59:29    1476555

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I think we are just going to have to leave it to the clubs involved to make their appeals based on these complicated rules. However I do believe that where a team cannot field there was no problem with the 2 match points and 5 concession score points being handed to the opposite team, and the best runner up going through on score difference, ignoring all other rules or expected rules, as it would leave everything simple and the ordinary Joe Bloggs would have no problem knowing where things stand. Drumaness would have known that to progress to the semis, the 2 match points and the 5 concession score points would not have been enough and it would have meant Bright and Drumaness would have been able to come to some compromise about a rescheduled fixture rather than Drumaness holding out for a playoff based on an intepretation or misinterpretaion of an obscure rule. As I said before what has happened to the spirit and ethos of the GAA when rules are being picked over for ones advantage. We see it all too much with suspensions and lifting of suspensions and now this. A rule should be introduced where common sense should overrule all other rules. If in this case the best runner up is decided on score difference then that should prevail and it should be up to all teams to ensure where possible all games are played.
There is no doubt there will be rule changes for next year, but instead of adding more complicated rulings for different circumstances, I think the knockout was the best format for the championship, with all winning teams in the hat at each round and drawn randomly. A win then is a win.

Upyourgame (Down) - Posts: 15 - 06/09/2013 15:25:58    1476664

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I think the round robin works ok

just needs this forfeit result clarified beforehand.

better having 3 matches in the JFC rather than 1

the 4 groups of three is not the answer as it creates 'byes' and becomes protracted

EIREANNACH (Down) - Posts: 241 - 06/09/2013 15:37:51    1476677

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EIREANNACH what though is the point having extra match's where a team has no chance of progressing from and possibly had a huge beating in previous games. It does nothing for players motivation or the tournament. Maybe the reason why some teams didnt field in the last round of games.

Upyourgame (Down) - Posts: 15 - 06/09/2013 16:05:03    1476708

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The round robin format at present is also very biased towards the group which has one very weak team in it.

Upyourgame (Down) - Posts: 15 - 06/09/2013 16:09:41    1476712

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that's the luck of the draw

meanwhile on a side issue mitchels had another two sent off tonight from what I heard

drumaness beat them by 4 points so that's Mitchels season over

teconnaught hammered ballykinlar

aughlisnafinn beat st michaels

rest play tomoro

EIREANNACH (Down) - Posts: 241 - 06/09/2013 21:16:29    1476888

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Aghaderg are Div 3 champions Well done

anduna (Down) - Posts: 210 - 07/09/2013 18:38:04    1477241

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the county board in any county has the power to implement byelaws to ensure that competitions can start and finish without any problems.they organise fixtures without prejudice not when or when not other teams can field.where score difference cannot be used due to fixtures not being completed play off fixtures are only option.the +5 score for an uncomplete fixture is only used as a hypothetical figure for administrative purposes.is there a sub plot to this debate eireannach; an educated guess since there is a teconnaught viewpoint at back of this. is it a fear of possibly meeting drumaness in a junior championship semi final. lest not thou forget earlier in season in league game between drumaness and teconnaught in drumaness, teconnaught won match on night.for the duration of match teconnaught played an illegal player(a player who in previous 2 league games had been sent off twice getting 2 yellow cards).this offence means you are automatically suspended for next game.bringing balance to situation drumaness never pursued rules which would have meant teconnaught losing points and drumaness being awarded them a 4 point swing which would mean the second promotion spot effectively would be over now.

knowtherules94 (Down) - Posts: 24 - 08/09/2013 21:55:08    1477882

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knowtherules94

your post is rambling and am unsure why my moniker has been dropped in ??

This aside if teconnaught have indeed did what you alledge surely this will have been picked up by the CB and if not it will be now (if true).

dundeal has not clarified what salient point we have overlooked and this is awaited with baited breath....

well done aghderg on winning league, they could well do the double

EIREANNACH (Down) - Posts: 241 - 09/09/2013 14:17:09    1478293

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So the playoff for fourth spot in the semi finals is schedule for Sunday. Should be good to get it sorted and get the JFC going again

Giantlovepump (Down) - Posts: 23 - 10/09/2013 18:16:36    1479482

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drumaness and county board hold ur heads in shame
come on dromara
once again money talks??????

racing (Down) - Posts: 11 - 11/09/2013 18:16:18    1480275

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I'd love Dromara to win,

Giantlovepump (Down) - Posts: 23 - 11/09/2013 18:31:35    1480283

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I understand this game is in doubt. Dromara to take it all the way to Crome park?

CONFUSEDUS (Down) - Posts: 19 - 11/09/2013 21:16:37    1480404

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Croke even. Effing I pad spellchecker!

CONFUSEDUS (Down) - Posts: 19 - 11/09/2013 21:21:01    1480409

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Racing why would drumaness have to hold there head in shame? Drumaness couldn't field on the Friday due to a wedding that's the only reason why they didn't agree to getting the game changed

Jaydog (Down) - Posts: 2 - 12/09/2013 09:39:45    1480493

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I hear there was an update on the appeal last night, anyone know what happened?

Giantlovepump (Down) - Posts: 23 - 12/09/2013 09:46:14    1480500

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