National Forum

Football Is Finished

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post


Replying To Pericles:  "There were a few poor kick passes from both sides, particularly in the first 10 mins when things were settling down, but 90%+ found the man after that. Not sure what era you're hankering after, but every game played down the ages featured a level of inaccurate passes, both hand and foot, with that level of inaccuracy diminishing the more rosey tinted your glasses happen to be. No challenge on the possession thing... it's the whole philosophy of football currently.

I'd love to outlaw goals which aren't finished either directly by the foot or the deflection of a foot pass. That would include Cillian's first goal and the one the Dubs scored against Cavan. They're basketball not football."
Agree with all of this, especially the palmed goals. I think a closed fisted goal is acceptable, especially as you'll have those punched in from a high ball into the square, like Comer's against Dublin in 2018.
These palmed goals are terrible though. Players are basically volleyball slapping the ball in from passes across goal.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 1140 - 09/12/2020 14:53:56    2320682

Link

Replying To Pericles:  "There were a few poor kick passes from both sides, particularly in the first 10 mins when things were settling down, but 90%+ found the man after that. Not sure what era you're hankering after, but every game played down the ages featured a level of inaccurate passes, both hand and foot, with that level of inaccuracy diminishing the more rosey tinted your glasses happen to be. No challenge on the possession thing... it's the whole philosophy of football currently.

I'd love to outlaw goals which aren't finished either directly by the foot or the deflection of a foot pass. That would include Cillian's first goal and the one the Dubs scored against Cavan. They're basketball not football."
Yeah I agree on those goals although it'd cancel out a few famous important goals from over the years. I wonder as well how you could police it because I actually don't mind a big high ball in and the attacker fists it in ahead of the keeper and defender. Murphy I remember scored a point in the 2012 All-Ireland where he fisted a high ball straight at goal.

I think both Brogan's goals against Mayo in 2013 were with the hands as well weren't they. And Ryan McHugh's 2nd in 2014 semi final.

JoeSoap (Donegal) - Posts: 1230 - 09/12/2020 15:02:55    2320689

Link

Replying To catch22:  "Spoken like a true balooba.
Oh ! That Frank Fox is it ?
I never though he was the name on that yoke."
ha haha god one

rhudson (Galway) - Posts: 1334 - 09/12/2020 17:22:42    2320763

Link

Replying To catch22:  "Spoken like a true balooba.
Oh ! That Frank Fox is it ?
I never though he was the name on that yoke."
Whatever makes you feel better about yourself

If its insulting me then I'm happy I improved your day :)

Happy Christmas

galwayfball (Galway) - Posts: 1453 - 09/12/2020 17:42:52    2320776

Link

Replying To JoeSoap:  "Yeah I agree on those goals although it'd cancel out a few famous important goals from over the years. I wonder as well how you could police it because I actually don't mind a big high ball in and the attacker fists it in ahead of the keeper and defender. Murphy I remember scored a point in the 2012 All-Ireland where he fisted a high ball straight at goal.

I think both Brogan's goals against Mayo in 2013 were with the hands as well weren't they. And Ryan McHugh's 2nd in 2014 semi final."
Fisted goals I think are fine so long as the ball delivered in was kicked. I don't even mind palmed goals, just so long as the ball in was kicked. It's handpass, handpass, handpass and volleyball spike or palming (agree with Wanpintwin, it's volleyball finishes after basketball passing) that I can't stand. Whatever it is it's not football and it's time this was eradicated. I think it should be easy enough to police, since either the scorer or the provider of the final pass has to kick the ball.

Pericles (Mayo) - Posts: 2451 - 09/12/2020 19:14:46    2320815

Link

Replying To Fairplayalways:  "After trying to watch Dublin V Cavan, the word "turn over" word used yet and yet again, showing that Dublin may as well go and play rugby such is the fear of loosing posession, People will come on here and say they are great and professional and all that, and they are at the game they play, but they have football destroyed, I think even with a crowd in Croke Park this evening (where the game should not be played by the way as far as I am concerned) that game was as shocking to look at as any other Dublin game...rather than loose posession, they would kick the ball the whole way back down the field, again, fair dues its within the rules, but they are as boring as hell at this stage, the referee in the main "walking" around the field such was the time he had on his hands...I hope, for the sake of football, Mayo or Tipperary win, and if this crap Dublin are offering up continues and they continue to dominate as a result, the rules need looking at, as teams are genuinely going out to try and play against them (as Cavan did) but Dublin were more interested in just getting the ball, hang onto it for the 3/4 minutes it took to get into a shooting position (hoping to be fouled if possible)...if that is football, good luck, because I and I think may more are fed up with it..fair enough Dublin have it down to an "art" as people say, but the art is as boring, and over played now..thank God no other team has mastered it or we would be finished (Cork managed luckily to beat Kerry with it this year, and tried again unsucessfully against Tipp)....hopefully soon we might get two teams who will go out and decide to play football for the first time in years, because this is finishing football...Dublin winning 6 All Irelands possibly playing that type of "football"...let them off....hopefully football will be back in the years to come..."
Getting back to the original post. I agree, once Dublin get into a 5/6 point lead, which they inevitably do, it's game over. They just hold onto the ball for 3/4 minutes at a time until they've worked the ball into a scoring position from 20 yards out. They hardly ever lose "turn overs" (God I hate that phrase!) because they'd sooner kick the ball half the length of the pitch back to Cluxton than risk losing possession.

Not particularly exciting to watch, but it's the nature of football at the moment. Most teams do it or at least try to but Dublin are the best at it. It's one of the advantages of hurling, you can't "sit" on a 5/6 point lead by holding onto the ball for a couple of minutes at a time, you have to keep hurling for the full 70+ minutes. Plus it's easier to score goals in hurling to bring a team back into a match. Nevermind scoring a goal, try even working the ball into a goalscoring position against that Dublin team when they're 6 points up - be easier breaking into Fort Knox!

Solutions? Who knows. Maybe the introduction of a shot clock. I've seen the argument against it that it will bring all 15 players behind the ball until the other team have taken their shot but sure that's practically what's happening now anyway. Could possibly combine it with a limit on the number of players allowed in the defensive zone but would be difficult to referee. Anyway, football's problem. Hoping the final will be close and competitive although if Mayo defend like they did against Tipp they won't have a chance.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1178 - 10/12/2020 08:03:54    2320949

Link

Replying To ballydalane:  "Getting back to the original post. I agree, once Dublin get into a 5/6 point lead, which they inevitably do, it's game over. They just hold onto the ball for 3/4 minutes at a time until they've worked the ball into a scoring position from 20 yards out. They hardly ever lose "turn overs" (God I hate that phrase!) because they'd sooner kick the ball half the length of the pitch back to Cluxton than risk losing possession.

Not particularly exciting to watch, but it's the nature of football at the moment. Most teams do it or at least try to but Dublin are the best at it. It's one of the advantages of hurling, you can't "sit" on a 5/6 point lead by holding onto the ball for a couple of minutes at a time, you have to keep hurling for the full 70+ minutes. Plus it's easier to score goals in hurling to bring a team back into a match. Nevermind scoring a goal, try even working the ball into a goalscoring position against that Dublin team when they're 6 points up - be easier breaking into Fort Knox!

Solutions? Who knows. Maybe the introduction of a shot clock. I've seen the argument against it that it will bring all 15 players behind the ball until the other team have taken their shot but sure that's practically what's happening now anyway. Could possibly combine it with a limit on the number of players allowed in the defensive zone but would be difficult to referee. Anyway, football's problem. Hoping the final will be close and competitive although if Mayo defend like they did against Tipp they won't have a chance."
People think Dublin are out of sight of other teams, I don't think that's the case. Dublin don't do mistakes, other teams do and they're punished big time.Cavan are no world beaters but they gifted Dublin 5 or 6 points. When was the last time Dublin gifted any team anything? They play safe and and don't pass silly balls.

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 895 - 10/12/2020 21:10:30    2321193

Link

I hate sledging and diving and feigning injury,, horrible tactics used by immoral managers and players,, but as far as I see it as long as something is within the rules of the game its fine,,I'm pretty odd in that as much as I love open football,, I always enjoyed watching the blanket defence too,, seeing teams try to pry them open.
But i must admit the keep ball tactic is awful to watch,,and the only way to counteract it is to emulate it,, imagine two teams playing like that,, you could probably write off about 50 minutes of the game.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 936 - 10/12/2020 21:25:53    2321199

Link

so if Mayo win will they still want to Balkanize Dublin?

suckvalleypaddy (Galway) - Posts: 1510 - 10/12/2020 21:43:51    2321205

Link

Replying To Saynothing:  "People think Dublin are out of sight of other teams, I don't think that's the case. Dublin don't do mistakes, other teams do and they're punished big time.Cavan are no world beaters but they gifted Dublin 5 or 6 points. When was the last time Dublin gifted any team anything? They play safe and and don't pass silly balls."
Good point say nothing. Dublin do play safe and no kamakaze passing either. To do the simple things right.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2732 - 10/12/2020 21:47:28    2321209

Link

Replying To CiarraiMick:  "Good point say nothing. Dublin do play safe and no kamakaze passing either. To do the simple things right."
It's boring though,, tactically sound, sensible, conservative, mature, calm,, but boring,, and that matters.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 936 - 10/12/2020 21:56:45    2321212

Link

Replying To Galway9801:  "I hate sledging and diving and feigning injury,, horrible tactics used by immoral managers and players,, but as far as I see it as long as something is within the rules of the game its fine,,I'm pretty odd in that as much as I love open football,, I always enjoyed watching the blanket defence too,, seeing teams try to pry them open.
But i must admit the keep ball tactic is awful to watch,,and the only way to counteract it is to emulate it,, imagine two teams playing like that,, you could probably write off about 50 minutes of the game."
Agree, the other thing in the rules that is not helping is the mark. Teams can slowly build up until a opening appears and get a mark which is a guaranteed point. The back has no chance to tackle, block, or rob the ball of forward. I've seen our own Matty Donnelly standing still soloing the ball and as you say, it's awful.

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 895 - 10/12/2020 23:42:56    2321240

Link

Replying To Galway9801:  "It's boring though,, tactically sound, sensible, conservative, mature, calm,, but boring,, and that matters."
Dublin have good players but they are more mechanically programmed, well drilled athletes rather than superbly talented footballers. They know their jobs, can run, tackle and press for 70 mins but My God is it snoringly boring to watch at times. Their superior athleticism and fitness, in their excellent, professional facilities, eventually wears teams down and then they pull away. Anyone who says it's nothing to do with money and resources is deluded or thinks the earth is flat and the moon is made of cheese.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9424 - 11/12/2020 00:27:03    2321245

Link

Replying To Galway9801:  "It's boring though,, tactically sound, sensible, conservative, mature, calm,, but boring,, and that matters."
Do you think If Mayo or any other County won an All Ireland , " in your opinion " by being boring
they would give a monkeys ?

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2728 - 11/12/2020 08:42:18    2321258

Link

Replying To superbluedub:  "Do you think If Mayo or any other County won an All Ireland , " in your opinion " by being boring
they would give a monkeys ?"
You're not getting my monkeys.. .

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 6284 - 11/12/2020 09:45:39    2321263

Link

Replying To Ulsterman:  "Dublin have good players but they are more mechanically programmed, well drilled athletes rather than superbly talented footballers. They know their jobs, can run, tackle and press for 70 mins but My God is it snoringly boring to watch at times. Their superior athleticism and fitness, in their excellent, professional facilities, eventually wears teams down and then they pull away. Anyone who says it's nothing to do with money and resources is deluded or thinks the earth is flat and the moon is made of cheese."
+1


Tho Con O'Callaghan is the exception.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 4550 - 11/12/2020 09:49:43    2321267

Link

Replying To Ulsterman:  "Dublin have good players but they are more mechanically programmed, well drilled athletes rather than superbly talented footballers. They know their jobs, can run, tackle and press for 70 mins but My God is it snoringly boring to watch at times. Their superior athleticism and fitness, in their excellent, professional facilities, eventually wears teams down and then they pull away. Anyone who says it's nothing to do with money and resources is deluded or thinks the earth is flat and the moon is made of cheese."
That probably extends to cluxtons kick outs too when you think about it. He is sending the ball out to fenton, mccarthy, Howard, kilkenny etc. Them lads are kickout winning machines. Of course he is very accurate, but this undoubtedly helps his numbers.
Im not a big believer is the whole 'cluxton changed football' narrative personally. If he is playing for carlow or leitrim and has to face the likes of dublin, far more kickouts get turned over because the guy he is kicking it to just gets beaten to the ball.
He is great at what he does but what he does gets a bit blown out of proportion. He is similar to a very accurate free taker and there have been plenty of them down the years - nobody is saying they are the best players ever.

HardCase (USA) - Posts: 64 - 11/12/2020 09:55:34    2321268

Link

Replying To Ulsterman:  "Dublin have good players but they are more mechanically programmed, well drilled athletes rather than superbly talented footballers. They know their jobs, can run, tackle and press for 70 mins but My God is it snoringly boring to watch at times. Their superior athleticism and fitness, in their excellent, professional facilities, eventually wears teams down and then they pull away. Anyone who says it's nothing to do with money and resources is deluded or thinks the earth is flat and the moon is made of cheese."
I think your post is a gross insult to the other counties, especially those who consider themselves contenders. You are suggesting other counties have more talented players but are unable to get physically fit enough to compete at their max for 70mns. This despite the fact that counties like Mayo, Galway, Kerry, Tyrone and Donegal have no lack of resources. Indeed a couple of years ago a Kerry player was able to give up his job to concentrate fully on gaelic football, ironically the move to fulltime coincided with a downturn in his football career. And mechanically programmed, explain, are you suggesting the likes of Con O' Callaghan, Ciaran Kilkenny, Kevin Mac, are automaton like and predictable, I think many of the fine players that try to mark them would beg to differ. Sour grapes award of the week to you, for sure.

sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 383 - 11/12/2020 10:05:25    2321273

Link

Replying To cavanman47:  "+1


Tho Con O'Callaghan is the exception."
Nah Con is just another well drilled athlete :-)

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2728 - 11/12/2020 10:36:54    2321288

Link

Replying To Galway9801:  "I hate sledging and diving and feigning injury,, horrible tactics used by immoral managers and players,, but as far as I see it as long as something is within the rules of the game its fine,,I'm pretty odd in that as much as I love open football,, I always enjoyed watching the blanket defence too,, seeing teams try to pry them open.
But i must admit the keep ball tactic is awful to watch,,and the only way to counteract it is to emulate it,, imagine two teams playing like that,, you could probably write off about 50 minutes of the game."
Matters to who?

lilylanger (Kildare) - Posts: 757 - 11/12/2020 10:56:57    2321293

Link