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Back in 2011/12 we were rock bottom ( well we thought we were) narrowly avoiding division 4 and having been knock out of the championship in the previous two years by Fermanagh & Antrim. We had to rebuild basically from scratch using the successful U21 teams.In 7 of the 9 years from 2011 to 2019 we were knocked out of the championship by the eventual winners ie the best team in the competition,but also during this period we climbed the divisions,getting out of division 3 with a 7-0 record in 2014. I believe that the following 5/6 years playing division 1&2 football gave our young footballers invaluable experience,confidence and belief ,and these were the traits they called upon when the Monaghan & Down games in 2020 seemed to have passed them by.Unfortunately successive relegations has diminished this belief and lads are now afraid to play football instead passing the ball over and back to each other not wanting to be the person who makes the mistake. Playing the likes of Kerry,Dublin Mayo etc ever year gets players and supporters excited,it gets more young lads wanting to play and does more for the youth of today than any development squads could ever do.Yes Monaghan May not have won an Ulster since 2015, but they have recently competed in 3 minor finals in a row winning 2, what their effectively doing is building a future for Monaghan football.
aceofspades (Cavan) - Posts: 257 - 29/03/2022 15:12:19 2408131 Link 0 |
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Like every other county in Ireland
Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12494 - 29/03/2022 15:16:13 2408133 Link 0 |
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Correct me if I'm wrong but I think we beat Donegal in the Div 2 final and lost to Dublin in the league semi in Longford. Those years the top teams in the Divisions played for an overall league winner. We had the Dubs well rattled in the first half that day in Longford. We had a good team that time . Only beaten after a replay against Derry in the Ulster final 1976 and against Down in the Final in 1978. The St Pats team of 1972 supplied plenty of players to those years mixed with the experienced players we had already. Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 29/03/2022 16:00:57 2408152 Link 0 |
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Right you are. We won that Div 2 final, and then went on to lose to Dublin in the main playoffs. Weird set-up. I note the Leagues were very strangely setup those day. I think in the 70s, it was possible to get relegated straight to Division 3 if you finished bottom of Division 1 some years. I wonder do they count this Division 2 final win as a title? Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2488 - 29/03/2022 16:12:12 2408164 Link 0 |
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i repeat myself again the main problem is the coaching and reliance on stats men and the use made of these bull**** stats to decide how we and other teams who are all ways worried about getting hammered even by the poorest teams we play. The reason we had the great win in 2020 was that the game against Monaghan and Down were more or less lost at half time and stats and bull**** went out the window and the shackles were off and all the players knew that they had to go out and go for it in the second half forget about defensive set ups holding possession backward passing. Our players then showed us what they could do when their heads were free of bull. Againt Antrim the old failing returned we were more afraid of losing than actual having the belief that we could hammer Antrim and coaching and negative defensive football returned. By the time we reached the final we were in bonus territory Donegal had hammered us the year before we had played so badly in the first half against Down and Monaghan that we knew we had to start of well so again the shackles were off in a way there was no pressure on out players and they went out and played their own game with out the fear of getting tanked and delivered the best performance ever from a Cavan team agains 16 man Donegal. breffnibluewhite (Cavan) - Posts: 519 - 29/03/2022 16:34:20 2408182 Link 0 |
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Open to correction here Loughduff Lad but I think we won the division 3 title in Martin McHughs first season in charge (1995) when we finished top of the table ( no Final ) … but it would be great to win our first national title for 70 years…!!!! Roll on Saturday
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 4243 - 29/03/2022 16:54:51 2408192 Link 0 |
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I hate to be continually disagreeing with you but the talking up of the 70s is one of my pet hates. Ulster was dire in the 70s. Only Armagh made an All Ireland final in that decade and were hammered. So when we talk about Cavan having a great team back then, they didn't. They were in the worst province in Ireland and didn't win an Ulster. If this board were in the 70's Cavan Shambles and foreverblue would be going nuclear after our relatively successful run in the 60s when Ulster football was much stronger. For the record Dublin trashed Down 1-16 to 0-8 in '78 and Kerry bet Derry out the gate in '76 5-14 to 1-10. fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1485 - 29/03/2022 17:00:05 2408195 Link 0 |
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Excellent post…..
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 4243 - 29/03/2022 17:01:24 2408197 Link 0 |
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It's a debate forum. People reply to posts when they want to make a point. That's how this place works. Your views on the league belong in the 90s. They are totally antiquated. Sure, the league remains a secondary competition, but in recent years it's profile has improved immeasurably with teams putting far more emphasis on it than in previous decades, and for good reasons. Your dismissal of it just isn't in keeping with the times. Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 29/03/2022 18:33:36 2408216 Link 0 |
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I thought relative peace and good will had broken out from a few of the post promotions posts, only to come back today and see we were now arguing about Monaghan!!! Kiernan massive loss, great man to kick a long range score when others are futtering about.
Calving4Sam (Cavan) - Posts: 91 - 29/03/2022 18:46:17 2408220 Link 0 |
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Yeah we finished top of Div 3 that year, but they had a different system where top 4 in Div 1, top 2 Div 2, and top of Div 3 and 4 went into quarter final. We lost to Derry in the League quarters that year. So no league title that year by the looks of it.
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2488 - 30/03/2022 09:33:47 2408251 Link 0 |
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Yeah you're right there. We won that final, and that fed into the main playoffs then. Wonder is that counted as a League title seeing as we won a final?
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2488 - 30/03/2022 09:35:02 2408252 Link 0 |
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Of course it's a debate forum, but when you reply to me saying 'who's getting mad' when that wasn't even a reply to you, and then when you actually ignore the replies I do put to you, what do you want me to do with that? I'm not dismissing it. I know we've been bad in the league. What I'm trying to debate is: 1. Weirdly our Championship results have been good despite dropping like a stone through the divisions, and 2. I made an observation that Monaghan haven't been that good in championship despite being a Division 1 mainstay over the last 6 years, and tried to open a debate on whether they were peaking at the wrong time by focussing on League. Never said to do what we did though, just said maybe a middle ground where an odd relegation to rebuild, get up a head of steam with wins might be better. Nowhere did I say what we did was better or anything, clearly it's not. All I've said is previously is that it was not as important. And I like the league, I go to all matches and enjoy the games at the time of year, but until recently it wasn't as important. And anyone can see there was a huge disparity between our league and championship results, our manager said he wasn't targeting the League, and I was ok with that while results in championship were there, even if the relegations made me mad as hell. But that does all change now, seeing as Leagues are linked to Championship. We need to be in Division 2 consistently as a minimum. But I do not dismiss the league, we should be better and I want us to be better, I just saw Championship as more. And I certainly didn't call our Ulster win as a fluke based simply on our League results like some did, that's the issue I had with you guys Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2488 - 30/03/2022 09:50:08 2408256 Link 0 |
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For the record Dublin beat us by 15 points in an All Ireland semi in 2020 so nothing really change with the hammerings you talk about. But at least in the 70s we got to a league semi against the All Ireland champions put up a good show until we had a man sent off. I'd rather have players with the grit and determination that players like Ollie Brady, JJ Martin, Frankie Dolan, Sean Leddy Rip. And many more had than what we have today in Cavan or even Ulster. Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 30/03/2022 09:51:25 2408260 Link 0 |
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I think it was classed as a Div 2 north final. But those days all Divisions winners got to play for the main league title
Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 30/03/2022 09:52:59 2408264 Link 0 |
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If you Google the 1995 league season it shows us as Div 3 winners… interesting to see Monaghan were Div 4 champions that year… You are right with the knock out stages top 4 (Div 1) 2 (2) winners of 3/4 went into Q Final… Bonkers way of doing it.. current system is by far and away the best and fairest..
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 4243 - 30/03/2022 10:05:11 2408266 Link 0 |
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Spouting nonsense as usual
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 4243 - 30/03/2022 10:09:10 2408268 Link 0 |
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Yet more negativity here, this time about Cavan teams from the past. Why the constant and never ending negativity Fredflint? Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 30/03/2022 10:11:44 2408269 Link 0 |
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It's bonkers alright. Have you looked back at some leagues in the 60s and 70s? Some had you getting relegated straight down to 3 or 4 if you finished bottom of Div 1. It was definitely a weird setup, and I'm sure hindsight is 20/20 and all that. They had in place what they thought worked for the time. I kind of understand what they're trying to do by having an overall league champion where all 4 divisions get a chance, rather than 4 separate League champions. On that note, anyone think with the new system next year they should adjust the Leagues? Instead of 4 tiers, go back to 2 tiers with 1a and 1b, 2a and 2b? Just an idea, but basically means it's very easy to see who are the top 16 who get into Sam Maguire and who are the 16 who will get the Tailteann Cup. And it gives every team an opportunity that year to get promoted straight away and get into Sam. You'd need semis between the top 4 over Division 2 a and b to see who goes up, but you could also set out that the final winner is guaranteed to be in Sam (at the moment the promoted teams are not guaranteed - they will be ranked 15 and 16 and could lose out if any Division 3 or 4 team make their provincial final). Anyway just an idea, if they are linking league and Championship now. Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2488 - 30/03/2022 10:30:32 2408277 Link 0 |
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That's not a bad idea as it really gives 4 teams a good shot at nailing down the 2 promotion spots… Do you remember when the league was divided into 4 balanced groups for a couple of seasons I think… Kerry or another top team ended up in the same group as Kilkenny…which led to serious miss matches in every group… I think it might have been done in order to introduce the current system we have in place.. top 2 in each group were the following season's Division 1 teams and so on down the groups…to all the bottom 2 teams forming Division 4… If memory serves me right I think we ended up in Div 3 after that…
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 4243 - 30/03/2022 13:05:35 2408337 Link 0 |