National Forum

Dublin Vs Kerry

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Replying To oneoff:  "How long before we're treated to another classic Jimbo essay that doesn't actually say anything?"
I don't think we'll see him again for a few days oneoff. He's probably trying to figure out what collective training is.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 13615 - 20/05/2021 22:36:16    2343786

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Replying To lilylanger:  "With all due respect Mick I'd say we all thought the same until our own counties got caught. Like the Down manager said, he heard about all these counties training from their own county managers and didn't want to be left behind. Doesn't make it right mind you."
I understand suspicion Lilylanger but from my info Kerry did not train as a group and the Kerry management have been adamant they have nt. Just because a few were at it does nt mean all were. I just think it's wrong to accuse people of wrongdoing when there s no proof. The Kerry players were given programmes to train on their own and to my knowledge that's what they did. I just think it's easy to cast falsehoods about. One poster stated it was obvious Kerry were training and another stated they were lucky they were nt caught. That's like the kid caught smoking in school saying "but they re all at it when he knows it not to be true". Making false statements against any group is wrong. Most people don't do it.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2741 - 20/05/2021 22:43:39    2343791

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Replying To lilylanger:  "With all due respect Mick I'd say we all thought the same until our own counties got caught. Like the Down manager said, he heard about all these counties training from their own county managers and didn't want to be left behind. Doesn't make it right mind you."
Also Lilylanger. Peter Keane came out saying training during lockdown was wrong and they made a conscious decision not to do it and abide by the lockdown rules for the safety of everyone. Now unless Keane and one of the panel members are the biggest liars around I believe them. Now I'm not on my high horse giving out about other teams at alll but I'm a firm believer in the justice adage of "innocent until proven guilty".

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2741 - 20/05/2021 22:51:23    2343794

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "That's the point I was making, underestimating anyone in Ulster is a big mistake, Cavan deserved the win on the day, but we weren't prepared right and to me that's managements fault, if we had been right on the day we'd have beaten Cavan in my opinion.
I think we would have given Dublin a good game in the semi final last year, only way we'll get a crack at them this year is if we can make it all the way to the final, from the prelim round in Ulster that's a tough ask.
Of course if we progress in the league we may get to play them there, not that the league really matters."
I think you absolve the players a little too lightly there, a lot of young players on the Donegal team last year but also plenty of experience, players on the day made too many individual errors, never adjusted to the battle put up to them by Cavan, maybe a lesson learned.

sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 383 - 20/05/2021 23:50:40    2343801

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Replying To the_creeler:  "It certainly is easy to argue the Dublin team are not the greatest. They have never had to travel to play a tough championship game, are practically semi pro to professional in their outlook and get a vast amount of funding, so much that they don't have to fundraise!"
So creeler, you're arguing that if:
-Dublin had to travel, they wouldn't be or might not be the greatest of all time.
-Dublin weren't semi-pro to pro in their outlook, and
-Dublin didn't get a vast amount of funding, that they wouldn't be the greatest team of all time.

BUT,
-Dublin don't have to travel
-Dublin are semi-pro to pro in their outlook, and
-Dublin do get a vast amount of funding.

Thus, they are the greatest team of all time.

That's the simple corollary of your argument.

Here in the US, we don't really care how some team becomes the best. We recognize them as the best. And if another team wants to be better, it'd better break its [email protected] and try and get and do the things that the best team has.

We don't pander to losers or those who complain and self-pity about what they don't have compared to those who do have.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 699 - 21/05/2021 05:23:56    2343805

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Replying To AfricanGael:  "Can't see Kerry showing their hand too much in this game, they would be daft to do that. I'm leaning towards a draw in this one. Good chance this years AI final will double up as the Div 1 League final as well as I cant see a Div 1 final being played in June."
I'd agree to a certain extent. However, Kerry also need to becoming to a rather settled 15-20 players. The COVID league format doesn't allow much scope for experimentation with new players. So, I'd say about 12 of the team that Kerry puts out will also start in the championship. Same goes for Dublin.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 699 - 21/05/2021 05:37:53    2343806

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "Kerry never won an all ireland playing 2 matches and only once in my lifetime they played 3 matches. I think that was 1980.They normally played at least 4 matches to win Sam. Professional? Well yes Id agree in a way in that the players never wanted for anything."
As a matter of useless info, Mick, I think the honor of playing the least amount game time to win an AI belongs to Limerick hurlers in 1936.

Somehow, they got a bye into the Munster final, where they'd a big win over Tipp (I think).

10 minutes into the second-half of their semi-final with Galway a big row broke out and the game was abandoned. Apparently, Mick Mackey was going to town on the Galway lads, and they took exception to it. A few of them tried to poleaxe him, but Mackey doubled the lot of them into ball in the center of the pitch. He was a bear of a man, as well as being a great hurler. Limerick, 4-9 to 2-4 ahead at the time, were awarded the game and no replay happened.

In the final Limerick beat Kilkenny.

So, that was an AI won in about 3 hours of playing time. I am not aware of anything shorter, in either code.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 699 - 21/05/2021 09:07:01    2343811

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Replying To foreveryoung:  "
Replying To AfricanGael:  "Can't see Kerry showing their hand too much in this game, they would be daft to do that. I'm leaning towards a draw in this one. Good chance this years AI final will double up as the Div 1 League final as well as I cant see a Div 1 final being played in June."
I'd agree to a certain extent. However, Kerry also need to becoming to a rather settled 15-20 players. The COVID league format doesn't allow much scope for experimentation with new players. So, I'd say about 12 of the team that Kerry puts out will also start in the championship. Same goes for Dublin."
Yes, tactically I should have said. I just cant see Kerry adopting whatever plans they have if they meet Dublin in the Championship in a league game. We may see glimpses of it, but that's it.

AfricanGael (UK) - Posts: 1946 - 21/05/2021 10:04:26    2343820

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Replying To foreveryoung:  "So creeler, you're arguing that if:
-Dublin had to travel, they wouldn't be or might not be the greatest of all time.
-Dublin weren't semi-pro to pro in their outlook, and
-Dublin didn't get a vast amount of funding, that they wouldn't be the greatest team of all time.

BUT,
-Dublin don't have to travel
-Dublin are semi-pro to pro in their outlook, and
-Dublin do get a vast amount of funding.

Thus, they are the greatest team of all time.

That's the simple corollary of your argument.

Here in the US, we don't really care how some team becomes the best. We recognize them as the best. And if another team wants to be better, it'd better break its [email protected] and try and get and do the things that the best team has.

We don't pander to losers or those who complain and self-pity about what they don't have compared to those who do have."
Fair play to ye for all that- ye are a credit and we should really look to USA for examples shouldn't we!!!!!!!

You see the issue here is and you may not understand this but the body which is responsible for ensuring equality and fairness, ie GAA Headquarters are complicit in this by allowing them to play at home every time and also ensuring they get much more funding than anyone else, thereby allowing them to be semi pro.

So you can get down off your high horse my friend and stop lecturing from afar as you have no clue what you are talking about.

the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 21/05/2021 10:23:12    2343827

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "I don't think we'll see him again for a few days oneoff. He's probably trying to figure out what collective training is."
He does this regularly- gets asks questions with obvious answers that show up his ridiculous arguments and disappears for few days so that when he comes back he hopes people will have forgotten them. extremely childish and immature

the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 21/05/2021 10:24:59    2343829

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Replying To foreveryoung:  "As a matter of useless info, Mick, I think the honor of playing the least amount game time to win an AI belongs to Limerick hurlers in 1936.

Somehow, they got a bye into the Munster final, where they'd a big win over Tipp (I think).

10 minutes into the second-half of their semi-final with Galway a big row broke out and the game was abandoned. Apparently, Mick Mackey was going to town on the Galway lads, and they took exception to it. A few of them tried to poleaxe him, but Mackey doubled the lot of them into ball in the center of the pitch. He was a bear of a man, as well as being a great hurler. Limerick, 4-9 to 2-4 ahead at the time, were awarded the game and no replay happened.

In the final Limerick beat Kilkenny.

So, that was an AI won in about 3 hours of playing time. I am not aware of anything shorter, in either code."
Ah good man forever. Interesting story.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2741 - 21/05/2021 10:27:38    2343830

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Replying To tonguey:  "He does this regularly- gets asks questions with obvious answers that show up his ridiculous arguments and disappears for few days so that when he comes back he hopes people will have forgotten them. extremely childish and immature"
100%, he swoops in has a bit of a blow out and gone again to switch usernames, he said my post was all lies and I asked him to show me what part of my post wasn't a fact and then he was gone.

He'll probably be back on sunday when dublin win .

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 13615 - 21/05/2021 11:12:45    2343843

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Replying To foreveryoung:  "So creeler, you're arguing that if:
-Dublin had to travel, they wouldn't be or might not be the greatest of all time.
-Dublin weren't semi-pro to pro in their outlook, and
-Dublin didn't get a vast amount of funding, that they wouldn't be the greatest team of all time.

BUT,
-Dublin don't have to travel
-Dublin are semi-pro to pro in their outlook, and
-Dublin do get a vast amount of funding.

Thus, they are the greatest team of all time.

That's the simple corollary of your argument.

Here in the US, we don't really care how some team becomes the best. We recognize them as the best. And if another team wants to be better, it'd better break its [email protected] and try and get and do the things that the best team has.

We don't pander to losers or those who complain and self-pity about what they don't have compared to those who do have."
You said:
"Here in the US, we don't really care how some team becomes the best. We recognize them as the best. And if another team wants to be better, it'd better break its [email protected] and try and get and do the things that the best team has".

Are you saying things are black and white in the USA? No grey areas, no sporting chance, might is right .i. the mightily strong are the winners and to hell with the losers! So all the likes of Leitrim, Sligo, Fermanagh and probably another 25 counties has to do is break its rear-ends and they will beat the likes of Dublin or Kerry in an All-Ireland!
You said:
"We don't pander to losers or those who complain and self-pity about what they don't have compared to those who do have."
Is that what you call sport in America? Maybe you're right, maybe that's the reality of life in sport as in world affairs, e.g the USA's unflinching support for Israel's might against the poor Palestinians.
Humanity how are ye!

baire (Galway) - Posts: 1084 - 21/05/2021 11:38:45    2343852

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Replying To baire:  "You said:
"Here in the US, we don't really care how some team becomes the best. We recognize them as the best. And if another team wants to be better, it'd better break its [email protected] and try and get and do the things that the best team has".

Are you saying things are black and white in the USA? No grey areas, no sporting chance, might is right .i. the mightily strong are the winners and to hell with the losers! So all the likes of Leitrim, Sligo, Fermanagh and probably another 25 counties has to do is break its rear-ends and they will beat the likes of Dublin or Kerry in an All-Ireland!
You said:
"We don't pander to losers or those who complain and self-pity about what they don't have compared to those who do have."
Is that what you call sport in America? Maybe you're right, maybe that's the reality of life in sport as in world affairs, e.g the USA's unflinching support for Israel's might against the poor Palestinians.
Humanity how are ye!"
Haha I know- as if we should be following anything the USA does in any way, shape or form!! This poster must think (like many Americans do) that the rest of the world must look to them to see how to do things correctly.

I do not know if that is arrogance or delusion to be honest. How many times would you hear "here in America we do not do that" or "here in America this is what we do" etc. As if they are some shining beacon for the rest of the world. It is cringy.

Most countries strive to be better than America, which in fairness is not too difficult.

the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 21/05/2021 11:55:31    2343856

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Replying To foreveryoung:  "As a matter of useless info, Mick, I think the honor of playing the least amount game time to win an AI belongs to Limerick hurlers in 1936.

Somehow, they got a bye into the Munster final, where they'd a big win over Tipp (I think).

10 minutes into the second-half of their semi-final with Galway a big row broke out and the game was abandoned. Apparently, Mick Mackey was going to town on the Galway lads, and they took exception to it. A few of them tried to poleaxe him, but Mackey doubled the lot of them into ball in the center of the pitch. He was a bear of a man, as well as being a great hurler. Limerick, 4-9 to 2-4 ahead at the time, were awarded the game and no replay happened.

In the final Limerick beat Kilkenny.

So, that was an AI won in about 3 hours of playing time. I am not aware of anything shorter, in either code."
The ironic thing about Dubs saying Kerry won All-irelands by playing 1/2 games, something that's actually not true, is in the early days Dublin won All Irelands by playing 3 games and in cases were just awarded Leinster titles.

oneoff (UK) - Posts: 704 - 21/05/2021 12:26:23    2343867

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Replying To oneoff:  "The ironic thing about Dubs saying Kerry won All-irelands by playing 1/2 games, something that's actually not true, is in the early days Dublin won All Irelands by playing 3 games and in cases were just awarded Leinster titles."
And now they play maybe one in the final. The rest of them are a stroll.

Fair play for their huge army of volunteers anyway for doing this.

Wonder how many buses do they need now to bring all the backroom team members to games?? Maybe they hire the dart?? or two darts??

the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 21/05/2021 12:38:21    2343871

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "100%, he swoops in has a bit of a blow out and gone again to switch usernames, he said my post was all lies and I asked him to show me what part of my post wasn't a fact and then he was gone.

He'll probably be back on sunday when dublin win ."
Dear oh dear chief

You really do set yourself up for a fall time and time again

Where on earth did I say your post was all lies like you've stated above?

Go and look. It's all there in black and white

You finished that particular post by asking an open question... you even put in a ?

I answered that open question with my response.

I never said anything about your past being lies. Not one single word. I simply answered your open question.

As I said why do you even need an answer... just go with your usual. Spout a load of nonsense as fact and then when questioned on it, say you don't have to supply any sort of evidence.

Why bother even asking the question.. just go with your usual nonsense man :)

You've been spouting that Dublin have been collectively training for months as fact. I brought you up on it.. you refused to back up your claim with actual evidence. Just gave more spin and waffle

So please.. do try and keep up without needing things spelt out for you like a simpleton. Fire away though. . Go and have a simple look and it's quite clear I never said your post was lies. Not a single word..

I simply answered your open question.

If you need anything else explained let me know

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 21/05/2021 12:39:43    2343872

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Replying To tonguey:  "He does this regularly- gets asks questions with obvious answers that show up his ridiculous arguments and disappears for few days so that when he comes back he hopes people will have forgotten them. extremely childish and immature"
Oneoff

You've gone on quite the tangent about my tongue in cheek post about Kevin McStays comments

Why on earth do you think I was upset by his comments?

Think that thread went over your head a bit

I'm all for Kevin copy and pasting his usual hyping up Kerry offerings

Im all for the hyping of this Kerry side as I know well you Kerry folk hate the hype, with all the yerra stuff. Just a tongue in cheek stupid thread which rather confusingly you couldn't quite get your head around

Hope that's clearly explained to you..

But listen I'm here to help

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 21/05/2021 12:46:41    2343873

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Replying To baire:  "You said:
"Here in the US, we don't really care how some team becomes the best. We recognize them as the best. And if another team wants to be better, it'd better break its [email protected] and try and get and do the things that the best team has".

Are you saying things are black and white in the USA? No grey areas, no sporting chance, might is right .i. the mightily strong are the winners and to hell with the losers! So all the likes of Leitrim, Sligo, Fermanagh and probably another 25 counties has to do is break its rear-ends and they will beat the likes of Dublin or Kerry in an All-Ireland!
You said:
"We don't pander to losers or those who complain and self-pity about what they don't have compared to those who do have."
Is that what you call sport in America? Maybe you're right, maybe that's the reality of life in sport as in world affairs, e.g the USA's unflinching support for Israel's might against the poor Palestinians.
Humanity how are ye!"
Well, I don't mix sport and politics, and as this is a sports forum, that's the part that I'll comment on.

Did you ever see the likes of Barry McGuigan fighting Muhammed Ali? That's what you have when the likes of Leitrim play Dublin, and you've always had it, in the GAA. This isn't something new, only it's more highlighted now that Dublin has pulled ahead of everyone else.

How to fix it? Have senior, intermediate, and junior inter-county football grades. This system works well at club level. 10-12 teams per division. Scrap the league and run the championship and league together. Each team in the division plays each other once (home n away, every second year). Top 4 make semi-finals. Two up, two down. Every team is guaranteed at least 10 games, which is about what the weaker counties currently get. But, under my proposal, no team would be asked to punch above its fighting weight.

And scrap the provincial championships, and lots of the other nostalgia that's holding the games where they're stuck.

It'd also open up time for club games.

Will it ever happen? Not unless a forward-thinking American, like Larry McCarthy manages to light a fire under ye back there in Ireland. But I can't see change happening.

Btw, I do have certain sympathy for the Carlow's, Sligo's, Leitrim's, Louth's of the game. But it's the same sympathy that I had for them 20-30-40 years ago. Even if you pumped all the gold in Fort Knox into them, they wouldn't win Sam. They simply don't have playing populations.

However, I have little sympathy for the Cork's, Limerick's, Galway's, Mayo's, Kerry's, Meath's, Kildare's, Tyrone's and Tipperary's who have sufficient playing populations and who also have strong financial resources and backing behind them. Look at Limk n Tipp hurlers. Do those players ever lack for anything? Not at all. Then why should their footballers? It can be done.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 699 - 21/05/2021 12:50:53    2343875

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Replying To jimbodub:  "Oneoff

You've gone on quite the tangent about my tongue in cheek post about Kevin McStays comments

Why on earth do you think I was upset by his comments?

Think that thread went over your head a bit

I'm all for Kevin copy and pasting his usual hyping up Kerry offerings

Im all for the hyping of this Kerry side as I know well you Kerry folk hate the hype, with all the yerra stuff. Just a tongue in cheek stupid thread which rather confusingly you couldn't quite get your head around

Hope that's clearly explained to you..

But listen I'm here to help"
You're wonderful Jim Bod Dub! Is iontach an bod thú!

baire (Galway) - Posts: 1084 - 21/05/2021 12:51:13    2343876

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