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Replying To arock:  "Excellant discussion tonight on Sunday game re Dublin funding/state of Football, solutions are clear as daylight. Dublin have the solution, no one wants it!! We do favour identifying the problems of the games and correcting them no matter what they are. BUT unfortunately the traditional diehards and backwoods men in some county boards won't here of these solutions which invlove really harsh realities. Pat Gilroy articulated enthusiastically the issues and possible soultions and all the Meath lad had was a cap out looking for a a few bob as if that is going to do anything at all. In fact when Gilroy pointed out that these full time coaches are mainly in schools for their day job and they are recruiters for the GAA his response was well they coach the clubs, no they don't. GPO (means Games Promotion Officer) not coach, they usually recruit in the local schools (Na Fianna has six primary schools nearby numbering 600 per school) and 5five 2nd level schools with higher numbers still. He recruits new GAA members, if they don't they play soccer, rugby and have nothing to do with the GAA. GPO's usually run clubs nurseries that is their functions in Dublin. That won't work in Leitrim will it? Well with schools number 8 pupils that is not going to work so how is it to be addressed. What people seem to want is just moe money because they believe Dublin have buckets of it, but even if we do we spend it on the right things. Anyway there needs to be a proper fair discussion and quoting figures from 2015 is ridiculous (they where the only figures RTE could find). As Gilroy was saying if you bring in outside knowledgable people and they slay enough sacred cows, agree what the problem is, we can get a solution. But until the rest wake up and smell the coffee us Dubs have to listen to endless bellyaching."
Oh now you are another waffler- yes ye have spent the money well no doubt. Our issue is why do ye get that inordinate amount of money and the rest do not???? Nobody has answered that question yet. Why can Dublin afford to have all the structures in place and Meath cannot, Kildare cannot, Kerry cannot, Cork cannot etc etc. Yes it is because ye have got scandalous amounts of money to do so- why are other counties not getting it? If we were do you think we would not set up teh structures the same??

I genuinely do not know if ye are thick or do not want to see it. It is similar to comparing Man City/Chelsea to Luton Town! Why have Man City/Chelsea got better structures, better facilities etc??? Yes I am sure even you guessed it- they have more money that they did not generate themselves- it was handed to them. The very same thing is happening with Dublin right now.

the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 07/12/2020 10:53:34    2319674

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Pat Gilroy talked absolute ***** on tv last night. It's not even a case of funding, it's the population. They have a bigger pool to pick from. More footballers. How many of the Dublin footballers are travelling 50, 60 or even more miles to training after a days work and then travel back a couple of times per week. The fun is gone out of watching football. They will probably beat Mayo by 10 points in the Final. And then the management come out with *****, we have lots to work on. BORING....

Armchairreporter (Galway) - Posts: 25 - 07/12/2020 10:53:42    2319675

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Wait though lads. GAA is non existant between the two canals. So keep up the unfair economic doping of dublin.

Pat walked into 3 pubs on tue southside and nobody said hello to him. Yeh Pat they didnt want to talk to you.

daytona11 (Kildare) - Posts: 3963 - 07/12/2020 10:56:53    2319676

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Replying To lilywhite1:  "We can all enjoy watching the Dubs (and they are an excellent team) but the fact is the financial superiority that Dublin enjoy over every other county courtesy of Sean Kelly and his committee is now a monster that is destroying Gaelic football. The Dublin doninated GAA Croke Park establishment won't acknowledge this fact though Sean Kelly has finally acknowledged his part in the financial doping of Dublin to make Dublin essentially a professional outfit playing amateurs.
What a great Christmas present for the for the rest of us if Mayo can finally win an All Ireland after losing so many since their last win in1951."
Their defence want improved big time in 2 weeks

Gave Division 3 team 10+ goals chances yesterday

Cloon12 (Kildare) - Posts: 51 - 07/12/2020 11:01:01    2319680

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I found it interesting that Dublin offered knowledge and knowhow to our neighbour's in Leinster only to be given the complete cold shoulder.

While at the same time, the same heads in Leinster continually vote to keep Dublin in Croke Park.

Now can no one see how glaringly ridiculous that is?

Dublin seeked out the knowledge and knowhow of the brilliantly run Tyrone CB when they were in the need of such valuable experience and built up what they have now.

Knowledge is power.

There's a lot going on to this huge issue, there's an awful lot that could be done to improve things immediately though

1: Leinster Council Turkeys to stop voting for Christmas
2: Cancel the Spring Series
3: Give assistance to teams travelling costs from Central funding and allow those savings to go into games development in the same counties to promote the development of young players.

That's is very doable with not much fuss

It's not going to rectify the glaring problems that have existed from the very offset but it would help to address certain aspects very quickly and then give a proper in depth review across the board of what can be done long term.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 07/12/2020 11:07:35    2319683

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Gilroy clearly went out to throw out absurdist arguments in order to drag the whole discussion into farce last night. It worked and Andy McEntee was not capable of dealing with it.

However he did make one telling point. That is, the success of Dublin is really built on the voluntary efforts of non-Dublin people living in the city getting involved in the clubs. That rings true in places like Ballyboden, Cuala, Brigids, Kilmacud. If you left it up to the 'real Dubs' living between the canals you would have much less going on.

There was mention of a 'granny rule' also. I think there is something to explore in this, but in the opposite direction to what is used in soccer.

Cap the eligibility of first generation players to play for Dublin, either by a quota system or at individual level. Allow all first generation players to be eligible for a parent's county at the same time. It would have the dual benefit of increasing the talent pool in counties affected by migration, and also it would make it easier for 'real Dubs' to get a game with the county team built by their country cousins,

Eddie the Exile (Monaghan) - Posts: 861 - 07/12/2020 11:43:36    2319695

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I thought Pat Gilroy was making sense, McEntee seemed out of his depth and was repeating the same thing about funding but couldn't really explain what he was trying to say or address what Gilroy was saying,
The Championship has to be restructured and the county set up as is will not work unless we go for a junior, intermediate and senior All Ireland series, and that might be the simplest answer,
I can't see counties wanting to amalgamate and lose their identity so the tired system has merit.

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 1801 - 07/12/2020 11:45:55    2319697

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Replying To jimbodub:  "I found it interesting that Dublin offered knowledge and knowhow to our neighbour's in Leinster only to be given the complete cold shoulder.

While at the same time, the same heads in Leinster continually vote to keep Dublin in Croke Park.

Now can no one see how glaringly ridiculous that is?

Dublin seeked out the knowledge and knowhow of the brilliantly run Tyrone CB when they were in the need of such valuable experience and built up what they have now.

Knowledge is power.

There's a lot going on to this huge issue, there's an awful lot that could be done to improve things immediately though

1: Leinster Council Turkeys to stop voting for Christmas
2: Cancel the Spring Series
3: Give assistance to teams travelling costs from Central funding and allow those savings to go into games development in the same counties to promote the development of young players.

That's is very doable with not much fuss

It's not going to rectify the glaring problems that have existed from the very offset but it would help to address certain aspects very quickly and then give a proper in depth review across the board of what can be done long term."
But hang on jimbo, that's if you blindly believe Pat Gilroy, who knows what was actually offered if anything.

Now I normally have time for Pat Gilroy but he was wired to the moon last night, he forgot to stop talking and Des Cahill done a downright useless job of controlling the situation.

Also while information and knowledge is great if you don't have the resources to match then it's not going to make a huge difference. You're bascially just getting a walkthrough of how far ahead the opposition is.

Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 07/12/2020 11:56:05    2319702

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And number 4:

Like Tyrone CB provided Dublin with proven knowledge and knowhow get Dublin representatives to now spread what they learned and built on with great success. Spread knowledge.. and don't be silly enough to turn your back on it.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 07/12/2020 11:57:23    2319704

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Replying To jimbodub:  "I found it interesting that Dublin offered knowledge and knowhow to our neighbour's in Leinster only to be given the complete cold shoulder.

While at the same time, the same heads in Leinster continually vote to keep Dublin in Croke Park.

Now can no one see how glaringly ridiculous that is?

Dublin seeked out the knowledge and knowhow of the brilliantly run Tyrone CB when they were in the need of such valuable experience and built up what they have now.

Knowledge is power.

There's a lot going on to this huge issue, there's an awful lot that could be done to improve things immediately though

1: Leinster Council Turkeys to stop voting for Christmas
2: Cancel the Spring Series
3: Give assistance to teams travelling costs from Central funding and allow those savings to go into games development in the same counties to promote the development of young players.

That's is very doable with not much fuss

It's not going to rectify the glaring problems that have existed from the very offset but it would help to address certain aspects very quickly and then give a proper in depth review across the board of what can be done long term."
You've pretty much just repeated what Kevin McStay said. Nothing original at all really.

Gilroy was off the mark when he was talking about offering Leinster Counties some guidance and help with the commercial aspect of things for a number of reasons

1. You can't compare demographics of Dublin to say even Meath or Kildare let alone Longford or Offaly. We simply can't sell as much as the dubs.

2. We have county grounds and Centre of Excellences to be paid for / run. Dublin do not. They simply don't have the same outgoings as counties with much smaller funding thus allowing them to focus on GDO's, player welfare and the like.

3. In summary Dublin giving commercial advice to the smaller Leinster Counties is like Guinness giving commercial advise to some lad home brewing in his shed.

Gilroy sounded smug too which I found uncomfortable. Granted I think RTE set McEntee up big time.

Regarding changes that can be made straight away

1. The venue things is obviously an easy one.

2. Rotate the Dubs between provinces. They did it with Galway in hurling. I'd argue that if the Dubs are left in Leinster hammering teams then the Connaught Hurling Championship should be resumed. Kildare / Laois / Offaly / Meath winning a Leinster even without Dublin in it would help and build interest amongst kids etc. This is probably a harder sell. No way would the Ulster / Connaught / Munster teams want this. A possibility of a hiding every four years.

3. Central funding and transparency. That's the key here really.

4. Make Cluxton take kick-outs with his right foot.

daytona11 (Kildare) - Posts: 3963 - 07/12/2020 12:06:00    2319709

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Replying To Htaem:  "But hang on jimbo, that's if you blindly believe Pat Gilroy, who knows what was actually offered if anything.

Now I normally have time for Pat Gilroy but he was wired to the moon last night, he forgot to stop talking and Des Cahill done a downright useless job of controlling the situation.

Also while information and knowledge is great if you don't have the resources to match then it's not going to make a huge difference. You're bascially just getting a walkthrough of how far ahead the opposition is."
You have additional funding pumping in now man over most counties why not get the best knowledge available to you to help maximize the potential of three East Leinster project

I 100% believe Gilroy and to insinuate anything else is something I would stronly disagree with

It's time for major structural reform and those best placed to help with three construction of that should be listened too.

Just like Dublin listened to the far superior at the time Tyrone men that greatly assisted the setip of the structures seen in Dublin

There are very many dodgy CB's out there and I would strongly disagree with just throwing money into their laps and expect them to maximize the potential without necessary support of the best possible CB representatives from around the country to pass on the knowledge and knowhow

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 07/12/2020 12:06:40    2319710

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Replying To Htaem:  "But hang on jimbo, that's if you blindly believe Pat Gilroy, who knows what was actually offered if anything.

Now I normally have time for Pat Gilroy but he was wired to the moon last night, he forgot to stop talking and Des Cahill done a downright useless job of controlling the situation.

Also while information and knowledge is great if you don't have the resources to match then it's not going to make a huge difference. You're bascially just getting a walkthrough of how far ahead the opposition is."
I don't see anyone coming out and denying the claims man ..

If they do come out and deny the claims then fair enough but for you to suggest he was lying is very unfair

But I would have thought an instant tweet would have been made to debunk his claims would have been done

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 07/12/2020 12:14:38    2319716

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "I thought Pat Gilroy was making sense, McEntee seemed out of his depth and was repeating the same thing about funding but couldn't really explain what he was trying to say or address what Gilroy was saying,
The Championship has to be restructured and the county set up as is will not work unless we go for a junior, intermediate and senior All Ireland series, and that might be the simplest answer,
I can't see counties wanting to amalgamate and lose their identity so the tired system has merit."
We've been talking about this for years on here. A geographical, county based competition is always going to have imbalances. At the lower end of the population resource scale we have Leitrim and at the upper Dublin. If you want more equitable population/resource based competition then there's only one solution but it will do away with one of the pillars of the GAA, local identity. It would be a huge change and I just don't see it happening any time soon. Giving weaker counties more money may well be a case of throwing good money after bad. If Gilroy was right in saying that the DCB and Costello offered to assist other counties in Leinster when it comes to finances and those counties refused then that's a shocking indictment of those county chairs.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4443 - 07/12/2020 12:21:45    2319723

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Replying To browncows:  "The guy is hard to listen to, any under 10 would do better-poor analyses by all and you would get better with banter in the local pub (now closed). A gorgeous point sound good just wonder what the difference on the scoreboard."
When he said 1 of the Mayo lads did a lovely stuttering solo :-) what the hell Kevin?

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 13787 - 07/12/2020 12:24:37    2319725

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I will **** myself laughing if the Leinster Council once again votes to keep Dublin in Croke Park

To think of the county representatives not voting in favour of Donegal's motion too.. only gaining 36% support

Dubs are being kept in Croke Park by a large majority of you all

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishmirror.ie/sport/gaa/gaelic-football/gaelic-football-news/motion-move-dublin-out-croke-14041340.amp

"He was also joined by Tony Dempsey, Wexford GAA and Meath GAA in expressing opposition."

Good aul Leinster representatives

Gobble, Gobble, Gobble!!

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 07/12/2020 12:31:46    2319729

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Replying To jimbodub:  "I don't see anyone coming out and denying the claims man ..

If they do come out and deny the claims then fair enough but for you to suggest he was lying is very unfair

But I would have thought an instant tweet would have been made to debunk his claims would have been done"
I never said Pat was outright lying, but I am questioning what exactly was offered and what benefit it would have been, which I think is a fair thing to do.

Again, even if we take that comprehensive advice was offered, do you think it would make a huge difference given the massive gulf in resources?

At this stage, I can't see how the likes of Meath and Kildare are going to get back challenging Dublin without a huge increase in revenue and a full time CEO to run the whole operation.

Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 07/12/2020 12:32:08    2319730

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Replying To Joxer:  "We've been talking about this for years on here. A geographical, county based competition is always going to have imbalances. At the lower end of the population resource scale we have Leitrim and at the upper Dublin. If you want more equitable population/resource based competition then there's only one solution but it will do away with one of the pillars of the GAA, local identity. It would be a huge change and I just don't see it happening any time soon. Giving weaker counties more money may well be a case of throwing good money after bad. If Gilroy was right in saying that the DCB and Costello offered to assist other counties in Leinster when it comes to finances and those counties refused then that's a shocking indictment of those county chairs."
Man I don't hear anyone denying the claims..

Its the same lot that continually vote to keep Dublin in Croke Park and opposed Donegal's motion to remove Dublin for their Super 8 games

Is it that surprising?

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 07/12/2020 12:37:23    2319731

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Replying To daytona11:  "You've pretty much just repeated what Kevin McStay said. Nothing original at all really.

Gilroy was off the mark when he was talking about offering Leinster Counties some guidance and help with the commercial aspect of things for a number of reasons

1. You can't compare demographics of Dublin to say even Meath or Kildare let alone Longford or Offaly. We simply can't sell as much as the dubs.

2. We have county grounds and Centre of Excellences to be paid for / run. Dublin do not. They simply don't have the same outgoings as counties with much smaller funding thus allowing them to focus on GDO's, player welfare and the like.

3. In summary Dublin giving commercial advice to the smaller Leinster Counties is like Guinness giving commercial advise to some lad home brewing in his shed.

Gilroy sounded smug too which I found uncomfortable. Granted I think RTE set McEntee up big time.

Regarding changes that can be made straight away

1. The venue things is obviously an easy one.

2. Rotate the Dubs between provinces. They did it with Galway in hurling. I'd argue that if the Dubs are left in Leinster hammering teams then the Connaught Hurling Championship should be resumed. Kildare / Laois / Offaly / Meath winning a Leinster even without Dublin in it would help and build interest amongst kids etc. This is probably a harder sell. No way would the Ulster / Connaught / Munster teams want this. A possibility of a hiding every four years.

3. Central funding and transparency. That's the key here really.

4. Make Cluxton take kick-outs with his right foot."
Dublin just paid close to 30 million for two green sites with not a brick laid on them yet.

We have massive land procurement disadvantages in Dublin, it is what it is.

But to suggest Dublin are not spending when their spending far outweighs your own is questionable

Dubs currently train on DCU pitches in Glasnevin. It's nothing special but a hugely expensive facilities are on the way. The land has been bought

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 07/12/2020 12:44:46    2319732

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Replying To jimbodub:  "I will **** myself laughing if the Leinster Council once again votes to keep Dublin in Croke Park

To think of the county representatives not voting in favour of Donegal's motion too.. only gaining 36% support

Dubs are being kept in Croke Park by a large majority of you all

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishmirror.ie/sport/gaa/gaelic-football/gaelic-football-news/motion-move-dublin-out-croke-14041340.amp

"He was also joined by Tony Dempsey, Wexford GAA and Meath GAA in expressing opposition."

Good aul Leinster representatives

Gobble, Gobble, Gobble!!"
You're off the mark again. That article refers to home games in the super8's for the Dubs. If Dublin want to rent croker for home games so be it.

Its when they are constantly given preferential treatment and allowed to use Croke park as a neutral venue all the time. That's the issue.

Yes Dublin should have to play away games in Portlaoise, Newbridge or Navan.

Dublin should he allowed to use Croker for home games if they can sell enough tickets.

daytona11 (Kildare) - Posts: 3963 - 07/12/2020 12:46:20    2319733

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Replying To daytona11:  "You're off the mark again. That article refers to home games in the super8's for the Dubs. If Dublin want to rent croker for home games so be it.

Its when they are constantly given preferential treatment and allowed to use Croke park as a neutral venue all the time. That's the issue.

Yes Dublin should have to play away games in Portlaoise, Newbridge or Navan.

Dublin should he allowed to use Croker for home games if they can sell enough tickets."
And who's the ones giving it to them?

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20341 - 07/12/2020 12:51:56    2319734

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