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Replying To royaldunne: "I'm sure Cavan are feeling the same then ? We are talking about Athlone town playing against Barcelona in terms. The only difference is that all counties including the ulster champions are Athlone town. Forget about Dublin I couldn't give a f about Leinster last year or this. And if Andy does then he should be removed IMMEDIATELY, championship football is dead. It's all about the league." I'm pretty sure Cavan will be much closer to Tyrone than we can dream of being to Dublin. Remember Cavan were Ulster champions on merit last year. We were a shambles in Leinster final. League is important but will be no good if the harsh lessons learned are ignored even if we secure promotion playing in the same way. We will be found out very soon when the level improves and back at square one.
winatallcost (Meath) - Posts: 594 - 25/04/2021 21:38:57
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To compare a Meath/ Dublin game to Athlone/ Barcelona is an enormous exaggeration, as bad as things have got and we can all appreciate that fact, they arent that bad. It's also an exaggeration to state that people in Meath GAA circles are happy to bow down to Dublin either.
The facts as I see them is that there seems to be a rising sun consensus that the game is changed. I agree that championship football in its current format is dead. We're looking at a Dublin win every year or every other year from now on until the flood, with Kerry plugging the substantial gaps when they dont win. Thats now the reality. The nearlymen, the heroic competetive teams with good fanbases such as Tyrone and Donegal and Mayo will hang about and fall off etc, picking up the odd title every 15/20 years or so. Meath are also in that category. But its the Dublin show now. That's football in its current format. It might not properly be addressed for another 10 years but it will have to be someday. Ive no doubt that this Dublin team will come crashing down one year soon (perhaps this year) and the GAA coffers will be all out talking about their defeat, but it makes no odds, they'll win 6/7 of the next 10 and the odd loss every 15/20 matches or so (at a stretch) wont change that.
The tier structure and the ending of provincial competitions would see a fresh approach to tournaments and a growth in competetiveness. As things stand we are a big runner in the second tier, and thats no shame. Thats where we are. There are lots of good sides in that category who in a knockout game vs. Meath would provide serious entertainment. The days of the Meath-Dublin rivalry and the 80,000 packed to capacity Croker are over. Gone. It hasnt really existed for two decades and except for the case of the last two or three games in any given championship it doesent happen at all anymore. In the era post-covid attendences will further lower due to new guidelines and restrictions. God be with the old days... but theyre gone forever. The last two years has changed things. Just as the last 3/4 years has changed our team.
Hypothetically in a new tiered promotion system, our new year-in, year-out rivals could be aN Armagh, Down or a Tipperary, or a Roscommon or a Cork. All teams in our ballpark and all capable of coming out on top in a competition designed for the teams rated from 6/7-12th in the country. Id even argue the match-ups would be far more exciting than what Dublin would have to play in tier one in their annual walk to victory.
Young_gael (Meath) - Posts: 596 - 26/04/2021 05:43:49
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Replying To Borderroyal: "Jasus lads if the mood in the county is bow to the dubs we are in bigger trouble than i thought.i know the league is vital this year but keep hetting to leinster finals in my book is vital too.
Getting these you g lads accustomed to croker and playing the dubs.so when we get a team capable of toppling them or goin other route to allireland series.thats the plan we should be goin for.no looking back drive on." I agree with that and you don't just throw your hat at the championship. But because it's knockout the Dublin game will all but certainly be our last game. And then regardless of what happens before it all the mood around this squad will be doom and gloom regardless of what happened before hand. I agree that the championship still matters and if we blow it to any other Leinster county then I'll be fuming. But I won't judge this team on their ability to compete with a team that increasingly nobody can compete with
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1527 - 26/04/2021 09:19:58
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Replying To winatallcost: "I'm pretty sure Cavan will be much closer to Tyrone than we can dream of being to Dublin. Remember Cavan were Ulster champions on merit last year. We were a shambles in Leinster final. League is important but will be no good if the harsh lessons learned are ignored even if we secure promotion playing in the same way. We will be found out very soon when the level improves and back at square one." We'd be a lot closer to Tyrone to than we have to Dublin, just like we were right there up until the final whistle in Croker in 2013, Omagh 2015 and Navan 2018. That's his point, if we're in any other province we can dream about pulling a Cavan and going and winning it. Because we play in Leinster that opportunity isn't there. His point is valid. You talk about the step up to division 1, and that is a definite step up. But the step up to Dublin is an even bigger one again. Imagine for a second Dublin were in Ulster last year. Cavan after their great wins over Monaghan and Down would have been squashed and embarrassed like they were in the All Ireland semi final except they wouldn't have an Ulster trophy to show for it. That's the situation we are in. Judge us against Donegal, Tyrone, Mayo, Galway, Monaghan and even Kerry if you wish. We can judge performances off that, and against those teams I believe our ability to compete and be right in the game has improved massively over the last 2 years. But if you compare any team to Dublin over the last 3 years then they'll be a complete failure. In the last 3 seasons the one game they've had with the result in the balance at all was Kerry in the 2019 drawn final. And that was with Dublin playing with 14 for about 40 mins. Then they went out and beat them by 6 in the replay handily. Once Tyrone get to Croker the Dubs beat them handy the last 2 times. Donegal haven't come close since 2014. Monaghan lose by 10+ come championship time, Galway hammered the one championship game they played them in 2018. Even Mayo, the great hope for the rest of Ireland against Dublin. The last 2 games they played them in Croker, lost by 10. Lost by 5. Dublin have the all Ireland sewn up until this team gets old/retires and by some miracle they don't have another generation coming behind them. Until then we have the misfortune of being in their province and the even greater misfortune of the championship being knockout in back to back years. And yes I will still be disappointed if we get to a Leinster final and Dublin hammer us. It's deflating and crushing. As somebody from a border town it's insufferable. But I won't let it change my view on the team all that much because there's 0 success for any other counties if the judgment on them is solely Dublin based
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1527 - 26/04/2021 09:37:36
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Replying To Young_gael: "To compare a Meath/ Dublin game to Athlone/ Barcelona is an enormous exaggeration, as bad as things have got and we can all appreciate that fact, they arent that bad. It's also an exaggeration to state that people in Meath GAA circles are happy to bow down to Dublin either.
The facts as I see them is that there seems to be a rising sun consensus that the game is changed. I agree that championship football in its current format is dead. We're looking at a Dublin win every year or every other year from now on until the flood, with Kerry plugging the substantial gaps when they dont win. Thats now the reality. The nearlymen, the heroic competetive teams with good fanbases such as Tyrone and Donegal and Mayo will hang about and fall off etc, picking up the odd title every 15/20 years or so. Meath are also in that category. But its the Dublin show now. That's football in its current format. It might not properly be addressed for another 10 years but it will have to be someday. Ive no doubt that this Dublin team will come crashing down one year soon (perhaps this year) and the GAA coffers will be all out talking about their defeat, but it makes no odds, they'll win 6/7 of the next 10 and the odd loss every 15/20 matches or so (at a stretch) wont change that.
The tier structure and the ending of provincial competitions would see a fresh approach to tournaments and a growth in competetiveness. As things stand we are a big runner in the second tier, and thats no shame. Thats where we are. There are lots of good sides in that category who in a knockout game vs. Meath would provide serious entertainment. The days of the Meath-Dublin rivalry and the 80,000 packed to capacity Croker are over. Gone. It hasnt really existed for two decades and except for the case of the last two or three games in any given championship it doesent happen at all anymore. In the era post-covid attendences will further lower due to new guidelines and restrictions. God be with the old days... but theyre gone forever. The last two years has changed things. Just as the last 3/4 years has changed our team.
Hypothetically in a new tiered promotion system, our new year-in, year-out rivals could be aN Armagh, Down or a Tipperary, or a Roscommon or a Cork. All teams in our ballpark and all capable of coming out on top in a competition designed for the teams rated from 6/7-12th in the country. Id even argue the match-ups would be far more exciting than what Dublin would have to play in tier one in their annual walk to victory." I agree that a tiered championship would be better but it only masks the problem. Going on what the tiers would be this year Tipp and Cavan in division 3 wouldn't have got the chance to beat Cork and Donegal/Monaghan. Cork who were in division 3 last year couldn't have beaten Kerry. The elephant in the room is still a blue one. Dublin have destroyed the Leinster championship and if the same advantages are given to them at central level and taxpayer level (DCU training ground, Croke Park for all home games) as they get naturally with population, good market for sponsors, all the jobs and universities so players don't have to travel far. Then this problem will keep existing. In recent years Kerry lost to Cork and to Galway. Mayo lost to Roscommon and Kildare. Donegal lost to Cavan. All the top teams can be beaten except the Dubs. I think a tiered championship just masks the problem rather than solving it
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1527 - 26/04/2021 09:54:08
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Replying To winatallcost: "While looking forward to some football this year I would not have much optimise about the year ahead under the current management with failure of blatant lessons to be learned from during their tenure. Any news on possibilities of resolving goalkeeping, freetaking and I guess overall quicker transition from defence to attack through kickpassing. Don't mean to be pessimistic but Lenister final defeat last year was extremely damaging and expect to to plod along again with limited changes in playing personnel and tactics and ultimately end up with a similar Leinster Final result if we are lucky enough to get there. Management seem happy to be still in media spotlight so seem to believe they are doing good jobs.
I am much more interested in how well last year's minors can fare in finishing off what they started and hopefully the U20s at some stage." No doubt Nally talks a very good game, having read recent Examiner article you would come away thinking Meath are very lucky to have a coach who seemes switched on to all aspects of game. However there is a breakdown somewhere between traing pitch and what we see on matchdays. Back to back losses in Leinster Final have to leave their mark and if we are fortunate to get another chance then there can be no repeat. No expecting a win, however a decent performance with improvements in all areas should be the very minimum that is acceptable.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2196 - 26/04/2021 21:03:55
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Replying To Borderroyal: "Jasus lads if the mood in the county is bow to the dubs we are in bigger trouble than i thought.i know the league is vital this year but keep hetting to leinster finals in my book is vital too.
Getting these you g lads accustomed to croker and playing the dubs.so when we get a team capable of toppling them or goin other route to allireland series.thats the plan we should be goin for.no looking back drive on." In reality the GAA are unlikely to change current championship structure in the short term. Therefore Meath must prepare for what is in front of us, hoping changes to current set-up will be our saviour is a best wishful thinking. Control what we can, underage structure, ensureing management have all the necessary resources and that same management are held to account for any shortcomings. The league has become more important from this year on as failure for us will mean Dublin are no longer a problem. You are right to say our goal is always a Leinster Final and there is no way we can ever accept anything less. We have a very decent panel, however they need and deserve the very best of management. Change may come in time, until then Meath have to make the best of what we have.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2196 - 26/04/2021 21:40:32
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Just saw a tweet from Fergal Lynch
Andy Colgan and Harry Hogan are the two keepers for this year. Mark/ Marcus Brennan is retired and now their coach.
Liam Byrne (Dunboyne) and Ben Brennan (St Colmcilles) are doing work on the kick out's with the above two in case of injury and or suspensions. Their outfield players but could be used in a pinch between the sticks.
I'm not sure what to say. Mark/ Marcus was also in the position last year and we were poor. There didn't seem to be a strategy at all. Granted Colgan is a better kicker of the ball than Mark/ Marcus but is always liable to give up 3/4 scores.
Whats that saying about the definition of insanity!!!!!
brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 27/04/2021 00:55:46
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Replying To brian: "Just saw a tweet from Fergal Lynch
Andy Colgan and Harry Hogan are the two keepers for this year. Mark/ Marcus Brennan is retired and now their coach.
Liam Byrne (Dunboyne) and Ben Brennan (St Colmcilles) are doing work on the kick out's with the above two in case of injury and or suspensions. Their outfield players but could be used in a pinch between the sticks.
I'm not sure what to say. Mark/ Marcus was also in the position last year and we were poor. There didn't seem to be a strategy at all. Granted Colgan is a better kicker of the ball than Mark/ Marcus but is always liable to give up 3/4 scores.
Whats that saying about the definition of insanity!!!!!" I'm a big believer in Andy but I must say his handling of the goalkeeping position is his absolute Achilles heel. I hope Colgan is given the start every game and he sticks with him. But to not bring in any of the young keepers of Beakey, Pluck and Sean Brennan is very confusing to me
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1527 - 27/04/2021 10:15:40
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "I'm a big believer in Andy but I must say his handling of the goalkeeping position is his absolute Achilles heel. I hope Colgan is given the start every game and he sticks with him. But to not bring in any of the young keepers of Beakey, Pluck and Sean Brennan is very confusing to me" Have the lads mentioned been put off joining panel due to constant bad press around this issue.? If not, it looks a very poor decision.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2196 - 27/04/2021 10:58:11
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "I'm a big believer in Andy but I must say his handling of the goalkeeping position is his absolute Achilles heel. I hope Colgan is given the start every game and he sticks with him. But to not bring in any of the young keepers of Beakey, Pluck and Sean Brennan is very confusing to me" Beakey has been asked in previously and said no.
Sean Brennan will be contesting the U20 role with Dean Pluck and Eoin Griffin this year. That's the best place for both players and let them develop.
Throwing a kid in there and not letting them develop would not be the best thing for them long term.
jackhackett (Meath) - Posts: 773 - 27/04/2021 11:08:50
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Replying To jackhackett: "Beakey has been asked in previously and said no.
Sean Brennan will be contesting the U20 role with Dean Pluck and Eoin Griffin this year. That's the best place for both players and let them develop.
Throwing a kid in there and not letting them develop would not be the best thing for them long term." I'm not saying you put them straight into the team. But the under 20's aren't back yet and might not be back at all this year. So having Pluck/Brennan in there to learn seems like much better development than trying to do goalkeeper work individually. Also Sean Brennan is 20 this year. I don't think that's an outrageous age to be considering them for the senior team. And I'd be confident in saying that S Brennan/Pluck would be a better goalkeeper than Ben Brennan who is an outfield player who isn't the tallest and doesn't even really have a massive kick off the ground
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1527 - 27/04/2021 12:02:21
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Replying To brian: "Just saw a tweet from Fergal Lynch
Andy Colgan and Harry Hogan are the two keepers for this year. Mark/ Marcus Brennan is retired and now their coach.
Liam Byrne (Dunboyne) and Ben Brennan (St Colmcilles) are doing work on the kick out's with the above two in case of injury and or suspensions. Their outfield players but could be used in a pinch between the sticks.
I'm not sure what to say. Mark/ Marcus was also in the position last year and we were poor. There didn't seem to be a strategy at all. Granted Colgan is a better kicker of the ball than Mark/ Marcus but is always liable to give up 3/4 scores.
Whats that saying about the definition of insanity!!!!!" So let me get this straight.benbrennan is in as cover For goalie?.but if is showing form out field can play there?.liam byrne is in same boat. Hogan is sub goalie?.colgan is main keeper.
And marky brennan is coach again.
Borderroyal (Meath) - Posts: 496 - 27/04/2021 15:00:23
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Replying To seadog54: "In reality the GAA are unlikely to change current championship structure in the short term. Therefore Meath must prepare for what is in front of us, hoping changes to current set-up will be our saviour is a best wishful thinking. Control what we can, underage structure, ensureing management have all the necessary resources and that same management are held to account for any shortcomings. The league has become more important from this year on as failure for us will mean Dublin are no longer a problem. You are right to say our goal is always a Leinster Final and there is no way we can ever accept anything less. We have a very decent panel, however they need and deserve the very best of management. Change may come in time, until then Meath have to make the best of what we have." I agree let the man have his time.at the start of his appointment i thought he was doing well but along the way little important issues scuppered his progress goalie etc.
But like most genuine meath supporters we take the good with the bad.i definitely feel for one that we have youth been primed for years to come.it will be for long term gain.so hopefully mcentee leaves us in better place whenever he goes.keep on knocking on the dubs door and one day they will get the shock of there life.only by playing them can you gauge there strengths weaknesses.
Borderroyal (Meath) - Posts: 496 - 27/04/2021 15:09:49
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Replying To Borderroyal: "So let me get this straight.benbrennan is in as cover For goalie?.but if is showing form out field can play there?.liam byrne is in same boat. Hogan is sub goalie?.colgan is main keeper.
And marky brennan is coach again." Brennan and Byrne are in as outfield players. But they are also working with the goalkeepers on the kickout strategy. If Colgan and or Hogan go down, the Brennan and Byrne at least know the strategy, rather than parachuting in Sean Brennan, Dean Pluck or Eoin Griffin from the U20's.
I'm guessing Dominic Yorke is now tossed onto the scrap heap with Hannigan, Berlingham, Beakey, McDermott, Sheridan, Gallagher, Dardis
brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 27/04/2021 15:56:37
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Replying To brian: "Brennan and Byrne are in as outfield players. But they are also working with the goalkeepers on the kickout strategy. If Colgan and or Hogan go down, the Brennan and Byrne at least know the strategy, rather than parachuting in Sean Brennan, Dean Pluck or Eoin Griffin from the U20's.
I'm guessing Dominic Yorke is now tossed onto the scrap heap with Hannigan, Berlingham, Beakey, McDermott, Sheridan, Gallagher, Dardis" Shooddy work ted.yorke is a strange one.
Borderroyal (Meath) - Posts: 496 - 27/04/2021 17:08:53
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Replying To winatallcost: "I'm pretty sure Cavan will be much closer to Tyrone than we can dream of being to Dublin. Remember Cavan were Ulster champions on merit last year. We were a shambles in Leinster final. League is important but will be no good if the harsh lessons learned are ignored even if we secure promotion playing in the same way. We will be found out very soon when the level improves and back at square one." So what if Cavan are closer to Tyrone then we are to dubs? Last time dubs played Tyrone in knock out game , the match was over after 15 minutes too. Tyrone aren't near the standard of Dublin apart from in their own heads. I'm not having a go here. But I really think we have to stop comparing ourselves to dubs. The are unbeatable for the near future, our aim should not be Dublin, our benchmarks should be Donegal, mayo , Galway Kerry. I wouldn't include Tyrone as I think both counties would be 50/50. We need to go up to next level which includes the ones I mentioned. Forget about dubs.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 27/04/2021 19:13:21
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Replying To Borderroyal: "Jasus lads if the mood in the county is bow to the dubs we are in bigger trouble than i thought.i know the league is vital this year but keep hetting to leinster finals in my book is vital too.
Getting these you g lads accustomed to croker and playing the dubs.so when we get a team capable of toppling them or goin other route to allireland series.thats the plan we should be goin for.no looking back drive on." No one's saying now down forever. However realism has to play a part, to even challenge dubs, we have to be in division one playing the likes of Kerry Dublin Donegal every year, and winning (this is why league so important) then we can put it upto dubs in Leinster and if we don't win at least then go through qualifying and perhaps end up in all semifinals. Then and only then can we topple them. I actually believe if dubs are to be beaten over next 5 years it will be most likely Kerry or ourselves. I was in sales years ago, and a old season campaigner asked how do you eat a elephant?? One piece at a time. You can't look at top of ladder and say that's the rung I want to be on without climbing the other ones first.
Point one stop comparing ourselves to dubs. Let's start at mayo , Donegal, Kerry. Then look at Dublin
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 27/04/2021 19:21:35
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "I agree with that and you don't just throw your hat at the championship. But because it's knockout the Dublin game will all but certainly be our last game. And then regardless of what happens before it all the mood around this squad will be doom and gloom regardless of what happened before hand. I agree that the championship still matters and if we blow it to any other Leinster county then I'll be fuming. But I won't judge this team on their ability to compete with a team that increasingly nobody can compete with" My point but perhaps better put.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 27/04/2021 19:22:34
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "We'd be a lot closer to Tyrone to than we have to Dublin, just like we were right there up until the final whistle in Croker in 2013, Omagh 2015 and Navan 2018. That's his point, if we're in any other province we can dream about pulling a Cavan and going and winning it. Because we play in Leinster that opportunity isn't there. His point is valid. You talk about the step up to division 1, and that is a definite step up. But the step up to Dublin is an even bigger one again. Imagine for a second Dublin were in Ulster last year. Cavan after their great wins over Monaghan and Down would have been squashed and embarrassed like they were in the All Ireland semi final except they wouldn't have an Ulster trophy to show for it. That's the situation we are in. Judge us against Donegal, Tyrone, Mayo, Galway, Monaghan and even Kerry if you wish. We can judge performances off that, and against those teams I believe our ability to compete and be right in the game has improved massively over the last 2 years. But if you compare any team to Dublin over the last 3 years then they'll be a complete failure. In the last 3 seasons the one game they've had with the result in the balance at all was Kerry in the 2019 drawn final. And that was with Dublin playing with 14 for about 40 mins. Then they went out and beat them by 6 in the replay handily. Once Tyrone get to Croker the Dubs beat them handy the last 2 times. Donegal haven't come close since 2014. Monaghan lose by 10+ come championship time, Galway hammered the one championship game they played them in 2018. Even Mayo, the great hope for the rest of Ireland against Dublin. The last 2 games they played them in Croker, lost by 10. Lost by 5. Dublin have the all Ireland sewn up until this team gets old/retires and by some miracle they don't have another generation coming behind them. Until then we have the misfortune of being in their province and the even greater misfortune of the championship being knockout in back to back years. And yes I will still be disappointed if we get to a Leinster final and Dublin hammer us. It's deflating and crushing. As somebody from a border town it's insufferable. But I won't let it change my view on the team all that much because there's 0 success for any other counties if the judgment on them is solely Dublin based" Thank you. People seem to be missing my point entirely.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 27/04/2021 19:23:52
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