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Yeah it was big of the English FA, especially as the GAA was such a big threat for the hearts and minds of young lads from around North London.
benched (Tyrone) - Posts:365 - 16/11/2016 11:34:26
true but ironically some of those games took place during the ban. Having those games in london was good for the irish over there
janesboro (Limerick) - Posts: 1502 - 16/11/2016 12:05:43
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Replying To cavanman47: "I actually think it'd be a huge publicity faux pas to move the all Ireland final.
The buzz around Dublin on All Ireland final day is like no other day of the year. What better way to impress the touring masses than to give them a taste of Dublin on the 3rd Sunday in September?
I'd be in favour of playing 2 games in the Aviva that day, one early (say 10am to suit Oz, NZ, etc.) And one at 8pm. But I'd leave time in between to showcase the all ireland, play it live in the fanzones, etc." dont think the gardai would agree to three big matches in dublin city on the same day
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 16/11/2016 12:06:21
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Replying To janesboro: "sure now they are considering moving the all ireland final to host opening rugby match in croker.
did they actually go to congress and pass a vote for to allow all the stadiums ?
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts:11376 - 16/11/2016 11:36:51 1934631
went to congress in 2013 .
IF the gaa were to gain €30million, its 30million they would not otherwise be getting. Could buy a lot of footballs, kits, sliotars, hurleys helmets with that." 30 million im sure if you added up county finals gates effected around the country your eating into it.
then add up the loss possibily of a the knock on effect of maybe loosing supporters or kids joining clubs over the following decade.
long term picture needs to be viewed
im not on the inside of this project I dont know ins and outs so we are all just specualting
but it seems very cloak and dagger at the moment(maybe john delaney has a big say here haha)
another possible stumbling block here could be brexit
if that pm one puts up a border like the old days dividing north and south
you would have rugby suits getting grilled by immigration couldnt see them being too pleased
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 16/11/2016 12:11:10
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Sure the Dubs should be welcoming this with open arms.
Croke Park will get a substantial income boost and sure we all know that several million of that money will be thrown at the Dublin footballers to try and keep them competitive against the young superstars from Kerry that will be going for the 4 in a row by then ;D
Seriously though, if the bid is successful won't 8-12 GAA stadiums get upgrades paid for? By all accounts even Croke Park will need to be upgraded to be ready to host a RWC final. It is an opportunity for an infrastructural investment in its facilities on a scale the GAA of itself would not be able to afford.
I also thing Gotmilk is right, this could be a great opportunity to help market Gaelic games to the world. The GAA should insist in any deal that a substantial part of the media coverage highlights the role of the GAA in helping stage the event and exploring the games, their history, importance and legacy in Irish life etc.
On a broader level, people are asking what rugby ever did for the GAA. As someone who came to rugby relatively late in my late teens I would say that there is a lot of things from rugby that sports like the GAA should look to emulate.
The respect for referee's and match officials that is inherent in rugby is a template the GAA needs desperately to bring in.
The way rugby promotes itself is also something the GAA can learn a lot from. Rugby in Ireland is able to maximise media/public interest for its events and it manages to do this by simply being far more open and accessible. For instance, rugby teams are named for a game 2-3 days before it is held. That mean's on a Thursday when there might not be much sports news, newspapers, radio, tv can talk about rugby team selections, highlighting upcoming fixtures.
Rugby also seems to have no problem allowing players the freedom to talk to the media even if a game is on the same week. County managers take note!!!
Finally the culture that is around rugby, is something I would love to see the modern GAA try and emulate. The mutual respect for players and opposing teams, all you have to do is look at the huge international rubgy reaction to Anthony Foley's death.
Rugby is a great sport, played by men who think nothing of carrying on with fractured arms or blood pumping out of their head. It's brave and intense and the respect between opponents is huge. As the modern GAA goes ever further down the soccer route of play acting, targeting opposing players and hounding referee's, I think modern rugby highlights a better spirit in which sport can be played.
TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 16/11/2016 12:19:08
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Replying To MesAmis: "Yeah saw that alright. The Independent is a complete rag in anyways.
What struck me was the fact that the €30m seems very low for the GAA to be getting.
I mean the GAA are going to end up supplying at least half of the stadia, move the All-Ireland Finals (Football, Hurling, Camogie, Ladies Football) back a month or so, lose out on countless media attention in the run up to the tournament, give a rival organisation the best platform ever to advertise and lose out on a lot of revenue at local level as county championships are on at the same time. €30m seems like a terrible deal for the GAA.
I know they are in a poor negotiating position because the IRFU know that the media would have ripped the GAA apart had they the gall to refuse but it's still a poor return, no doubt about it." Hopefully by 2023 the All Ireland Finals will have been brought forward a month to August.
m_the_d (None) - Posts: 1099 - 16/11/2016 12:23:44
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I'm not necessarily against it either. As long as it doesn't cost the taxpayer, north and south, too much then I'd broadly be in favour as a lot of people will get a tremendous amount of enjoyment from it and that's important too. We'll never be able to host the World Cup or Olympics so this is the best we could do in terms of a fairly international tournament.
I'd just take exception with the comments that this is going to make us all millions and that it is a great idea for the GAA.
The GAA had no choice in this as the fall out to rejecting it would have been enormous in the media and political world for obvious reasons.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts:10255 - 16/11/2016 11:32:06 1
I 100% agree with you on all of that, and I actually think the GAA and Ireland will actually be down money overall after it, once taking the cost of all developments into consideration
However it will offer a much welcome morale boost to Island as a whole, something which will do no harm at all. Just so long as they don't get too carried away, and run up too much debt.
GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 16/11/2016 12:29:07
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Hopefully by 2023 the All Ireland Finals will have been brought forward a month to August.
m_the_d (All) - Posts:885 - 16/11/2016 12:23:44
Maybe they will be or maybe they won't.
As things stand they'll have to be moved.
Anyway you cut it the deal seems to be a very poor one from the GAA's point of view.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13794 - 16/11/2016 12:32:21
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Replying To hill16no1man: "dont think the gardai would agree to three big matches in dublin city on the same day" Yeah fair point.
But don't most of these major tournaments rely on voluntary officials for elements of crowd control, etc.?
Either way, with Croker, the Aviva and RDS all being used, are they going to run into this issue regardless of GAA games?
cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5244 - 16/11/2016 12:32:27
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all this talk of the gaa stands to make 30 million
where are the media penning how much the IRFU stand to make??????????????
eden park in new zealand had 10 thousand temporary seats needed to even host the final as a stadium must have minimum 60 thousand capacity.
if temporary seating was classed as fine why would croke park that already can host huge events like the all ireland finals and biggest names in the world of music need upgrading.
rugby park stadium hosted matches in new zealand in 2011 with grass banks behind the goals the same as exists in pairc tailteann in navan.
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 16/11/2016 12:42:56
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Replying To cavanman47: "Yeah fair point.
But don't most of these major tournaments rely on voluntary officials for elements of crowd control, etc.?
Either way, with Croker, the Aviva and RDS all being used, are they going to run into this issue regardless of GAA games?" doubt the three stadiums in dublin would be in use the same days
would not alone be a gardai nightmare to facilitate every day life and transport
but from a safety point of view it would be considered a target for extremists.
id imagine there would be a rotation of where matches would be played to allow it to be policed to the best it could be.
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 16/11/2016 12:46:53
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Replying To janesboro: "sure now they are considering moving the all ireland final to host opening rugby match in croker.
did they actually go to congress and pass a vote for to allow all the stadiums ?
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts:11376 - 16/11/2016 11:36:51 1934631
went to congress in 2013 .
IF the gaa were to gain €30million, its 30million they would not otherwise be getting. Could buy a lot of footballs, kits, sliotars, hurleys helmets with that." where is all that perceived equipment going to come from and who will benefit from it? certainly not the clubs you can be assured of that, not how the gaa works but maybe you no something the rest of us don't. Still a big issue if All Irelands are moved to accommodate another sport, but then again they have form with moving a replay to facilitate American colleges football seems the ivory tower crew in croke park are more in tune with the d4 set and the dub based media rather than the 10s of thousands of paying members.
Personally I have no truck with rugby or any other sport and am a regular visitor to the local rugby ground for their home games. it is the sheer hypocrisy of the croke park people in the way the ordinary paying members are treated at club level regarding grounds and will they be asking the opinions of the clubs who make up the county committees of the grounds involved if they agree to allow the use of the grounds. I think whole thing is a vanity project for those involved and will end up costing the irish tax payer a lot of money which basically could be spent on a lot of other more needy areas. As for infrastructure like building the supposed new A5 between Dublin a derry not a hope in h-ll of helping that project as the unionist politicians and the big farmers with vested interests along the route will block it at every stage and it is on the wrong side of the river bann. Anyway it's probably all irrelevant as politics will probably swing it into the southern hemisphere south Africa which has more potential for growth.
bulmccabe (Tyrone) - Posts: 361 - 16/11/2016 12:52:27
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hill16no1man its almost like if your not of a certain social standard or havent got a mercedes pulling up well maybe you be better off not sending young sean or mary in here kind of answer.
has any rugby club refused anybody on such a basis , if yes which clubs were they, the president of terenure at the weekend was driving a 2008 vw polo,
Again id say they have no problem welcome rugby clubs to play them from all over country, as they see them as their own people with same interest and they can pick up contacts but within dublin
to be honest when we go up we are going to cheer on our team - no interest in stuff like contacts
at the terenure game i had the pleasure of meeting and chatting with one of the current dublin footballers, he was watching the game and knew some of terenure lads, while i was only talking to him for about 10 mins he came accross as a sound humble guy, being from liemrick its as close as i get to an all ireland winner!!
janesboro (Limerick) - Posts: 1502 - 16/11/2016 13:07:12
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If Ireland win this bid it will be wall-to-wall,blanket coverage for six years.And this is even before the tournament starts.I already find it difficult to avoid all the rugger coverage.I'd have to come up with another plan.Maybe rent out my small duplex to Eir B & B for the two months while paddywhackery is in full swing.Yea,come to think of it,i'm off to the states.Trump will be on his second term and there wont be egg-ball spoken of in any yank shebeen or speakeasy.All the best troops,i'm out of here.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 16/11/2016 13:19:06
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Replying To cuederocket: "If Ireland win this bid it will be wall-to-wall,blanket coverage for six years.And this is even before the tournament starts.I already find it difficult to avoid all the rugger coverage.I'd have to come up with another plan.Maybe rent out my small duplex to Eir B & B for the two months while paddywhackery is in full swing.Yea,come to think of it,i'm off to the states.Trump will be on his second term and there wont be egg-ball spoken of in any yank shebeen or speakeasy.All the best troops,i'm out of here." Poor cue.
It mightn't be that bad. Plenty of places in Dublin to lie low for the duration.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13794 - 16/11/2016 13:53:38
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Replying To MesAmis: "Poor cue.
It mightn't be that bad. Plenty of places in Dublin to lie low for the duration." I'm out of Dodge,mes.Adios.Every cloud has a silver lining though : I'll stick a few rugger fans from Tongo or Kenya in the gaf and that'll pay for vacation,Stateside!I've never tried this Eir B & B but needs must in this instance.I'll be back for the All Ireland football final in December,all going well (:
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 16/11/2016 14:07:33
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Don't agree with the use of all these GAA stadia for the Rugby world cup.If they haven't got enough of their own stadia they shouldn't be allowed host it.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts:4824 - 15/11/2016 13:12:09Should the Soccer world cup not have been hosted in the United States in 1994 then? Or 2010 World cup in South Africa which used rugby stadiums...
Sorry can't agree with you there. Why would you not rent out stadiums and showcase what the gaa has to foreigners and millions of people throughout the globe. Heck you could even showcase the stadiums to people in our own country who don't know what we have.
The only thing I would be worried about is county finals. Do rugby world cup games take priority over the county finals? A bit like the semi final replay a few years ago?
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts:3702 - 15/11/2016 13:17:47Rugby world cup games would take priority over county finals but there would be plenty of stadiums only used for a small number of games so county finals could be moved around to cater for both in the stadiums in question
ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 16/11/2016 14:16:14
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Countries that host major sporting events rarely get a tourism boost from it.
They may get more people that particular month but it tends to even out over a number of years.
I don't see why Ireland will be the exception in that. Beware of organisers and politicians spinning lies lads.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts:10256 - 15/11/2016 13:45:33 Where are the facts to back that up?
ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 16/11/2016 14:16:52
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Replying To ormondbannerman: "Don't agree with the use of all these GAA stadia for the Rugby world cup.If they haven't got enough of their own stadia they shouldn't be allowed host it.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts:4824 - 15/11/2016 13:12:09Should the Soccer world cup not have been hosted in the United States in 1994 then? Or 2010 World cup in South Africa which used rugby stadiums...
Sorry can't agree with you there. Why would you not rent out stadiums and showcase what the gaa has to foreigners and millions of people throughout the globe. Heck you could even showcase the stadiums to people in our own country who don't know what we have.
The only thing I would be worried about is county finals. Do rugby world cup games take priority over the county finals? A bit like the semi final replay a few years ago?
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts:3702 - 15/11/2016 13:17:47Rugby world cup games would take priority over county finals but there would be plenty of stadiums only used for a small number of games so county finals could be moved around to cater for both in the stadiums in question" I'm not pushed on the idea of a county final being moved out of the county ground. If a game is held in casement on the Tuesday for the RWC could the county final be held there on a Sunday?
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 16/11/2016 14:22:44
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Replying To TheHermit: "Sure the Dubs should be welcoming this with open arms.
Croke Park will get a substantial income boost and sure we all know that several million of that money will be thrown at the Dublin footballers to try and keep them competitive against the young superstars from Kerry that will be going for the 4 in a row by then ;D
Seriously though, if the bid is successful won't 8-12 GAA stadiums get upgrades paid for? By all accounts even Croke Park will need to be upgraded to be ready to host a RWC final. It is an opportunity for an infrastructural investment in its facilities on a scale the GAA of itself would not be able to afford.
I also thing Gotmilk is right, this could be a great opportunity to help market Gaelic games to the world. The GAA should insist in any deal that a substantial part of the media coverage highlights the role of the GAA in helping stage the event and exploring the games, their history, importance and legacy in Irish life etc.
On a broader level, people are asking what rugby ever did for the GAA. As someone who came to rugby relatively late in my late teens I would say that there is a lot of things from rugby that sports like the GAA should look to emulate.
The respect for referee's and match officials that is inherent in rugby is a template the GAA needs desperately to bring in.
The way rugby promotes itself is also something the GAA can learn a lot from. Rugby in Ireland is able to maximise media/public interest for its events and it manages to do this by simply being far more open and accessible. For instance, rugby teams are named for a game 2-3 days before it is held. That mean's on a Thursday when there might not be much sports news, newspapers, radio, tv can talk about rugby team selections, highlighting upcoming fixtures.
Rugby also seems to have no problem allowing players the freedom to talk to the media even if a game is on the same week. County managers take note!!!
Finally the culture that is around rugby, is something I would love to see the modern GAA try and emulate. The mutual respect for players and opposing teams, all you have to do is look at the huge international rubgy reaction to Anthony Foley's death.
Rugby is a great sport, played by men who think nothing of carrying on with fractured arms or blood pumping out of their head. It's brave and intense and the respect between opponents is huge. As the modern GAA goes ever further down the soccer route of play acting, targeting opposing players and hounding referee's, I think modern rugby highlights a better spirit in which sport can be played." Good post,hermit.To be fair,your making a decent case for it.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 16/11/2016 14:25:43
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Gaa county grounds, the vast majority apart from maybe one or two are delapidated and would be an embarrassment to display them to the rest of the world. Croke Park is the only stadium that I would be proud to showcase. The rest are a joke to be fair.
Steady_Eddie (Cavan) - Posts: 75 - 16/11/2016 14:36:42
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