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Replying To legendzxix: "Croke Park, everyone and myself included are making it all unnecessarily complicated.
1. The All Ireland for many years was 4 qualifying rounds and 8 teams in the All Ireland series.
- This just had to change to 2 qualifying rounds and 16 teams in the All Ireland series in whatever agreed format.
2. The Tommy Murphy Cup was a straight knockout of 8 or 9 counties.
- The Tailteann Cup just needs to be a straight knockout after the qualifiers for the 16 or 17 missing out on the All Ireland. Winner qualifying for the All Ireland of the following year.
Nothing more needs to be done." "everyone.... unnecessarily complicated"?
I suppose that includes me more than anyone else - despite my AILC being VERY "straight forward" :)
Seriously, 2 open draw rds - 1 at home, 1 away for each team - with single winners to PQFs and double winners to QFs, seems like probably the sweet spot for most support.
It's similar to next year's;
guarantees a home game for all;
each game is meaningful; and
not "unnecessarily complicated".
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3304 - 08/06/2025 16:46:50
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Replying To omahant: ""everyone.... unnecessarily complicated"?
I suppose that includes me more than anyone else - despite my AILC being VERY "straight forward" :)
Seriously, 2 open draw rds - 1 at home, 1 away for each team - with single winners to PQFs and double winners to QFs, seems like probably the sweet spot for most support.
It's similar to next year's;
guarantees a home game for all;
each game is meaningful; and
not "unnecessarily complicated"." GAA+ scheduled to show four Round 3 games. Where does that fit in within your plan?
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8965 - 08/06/2025 18:18:28
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Replying To omahant: ""everyone.... unnecessarily complicated"?
I suppose that includes me more than anyone else - despite my AILC being VERY "straight forward" :)
Seriously, 2 open draw rds - 1 at home, 1 away for each team - with single winners to PQFs and double winners to QFs, seems like probably the sweet spot for most support.
It's similar to next year's;
guarantees a home game for all;
each game is meaningful; and
not "unnecessarily complicated"." Yeah it's definitely not that complicated.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4584 - 09/06/2025 11:18:00
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Replying To legendzxix: "GAA+ scheduled to show four Round 3 games. Where does that fit in within your plan?" Are those things thought about when the GAA already tweaks the system every couple of years now anyway.
In the past there was uncertainty around the number of replays and which games they'd be and that was able to be accommodated.
There will probably be around 3 to 5 of those games each season with a bit of uncertainty, it's really not that bad to be honest.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4584 - 09/06/2025 11:22:47
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The All Ireland series went to 16 teams in 2023. A notable feature since has been the inequitable nature and spread of games for the various teams from the commencement of the 4 Provincial Championships. Teams reaching Provincial finals will have a nice even spread of games while teams losing in the early rounds will have an extended competitive game break. In extreme cases that can be up to 7 weeks as happened to Cork [2023] Westmeath [2024] and Derry [2025]
Cork eventually in 2023 went on to reach the A.I Q.Fs. So their schedule after losing to Clare in the 1st round of the Munster Championship was no games for 7 weeks followed by a hectic schedule of 5 games in 6 weeks. Unfortunately the way Championship is set up there is no way around this as the A.I 16 does not commence until 1 or 2 weeks after the Provincial finals
A somewhat slightly different way of organizing the A.I. 16 would bring the maximum length of time a team losing early in the Provincials would have to wait for their next game down to 4 weeks .It would actually be less for most teams Still not ideal but an improvement on the way things currently stand.
The A.I 16 is divided into 2 sections. It consists of a combination of double elimination[ the 8 Provincial finalists] and groups[2] [the 8 other teams]
INTERPROS [ The 8 Provincial finalists]
ROUND 1
4 Provincial winners v 4 Provincial runner ups [draw made after Provincial finals]
ROUND 2A
4 round 1 winners
2 winners to A.I Q.F
2 losers to A.I P.Q.F [home]
ROUND 2B
4 round 1 losers
2 winners to A.I P.Q.F [away]
2 losers are out
QUALIFIERS [8 non Provincial finalists]
2 groups of 4 teams[seeded based on league]
What was pot 3 in this years draw would be pot 1.
What was pot 4 in this years draw would be pot 2.
2 group winners to A.I Q.F
2 group 2nd to A.I .P.Q.F [home]
2 group 3nd to A.I P.Q.F [away]
The 2 groups[ or at least some of the games] commence on the completion of the Provincial S.Fs. Under this dual set up there is no longer a necessity for early Provincial losers to have wait around for the completion of these Championships .Going by the current football championship calendar these group games would have 7 weeks to be played over giving ample opportunity for well spread out games. This gives opportunity for more games to be televised
[or screened] and gives both players/management and spectators alike some breathing space.
The Provincial finalists play a game less in the A.I 16 but their extra game is the Provincial final.
edu (Mayo) - Posts: 115 - 12/06/2025 21:06:54
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In the 2026 format, if every championship round is one week later, after a week off between league finals and championship, this weekend instead of group stage Round 3 - 2025 will be Round 2A - 2026 and Round 2B - 2026.
Round 2A of Round 1 winners:
Kerry v Meath
Monaghan v Down
Armagh v Dublin
Tyrone v Cavan
Round 2B of Round 1 losers: (will mix up as no set groups)
Roscommon v Clare
Louth v Mayo
Derry v Cork
Donegal v Galway
Donegal and Galway despite winning their provinces could be in a 2B battle for survival!
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8965 - 13/06/2025 13:16:53
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@edu (Mayo) - Posts: 114 - 12/06/2025
In my AILC, all teams play an equal 12-game (or 10, if preferred) mixed-quality set of fixtures (if 12, then 3 against each of 4 seeding pots), regardless of inclusion of playing 4 Ulster rds or 1 Munster rd etc.
League-only games played concurrently with Prov KO Rds.
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3304 - 13/06/2025 19:49:41
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Replying To legendzxix: "In the 2026 format, if every championship round is one week later, after a week off between league finals and championship, this weekend instead of group stage Round 3 - 2025 will be Round 2A - 2026 and Round 2B - 2026.
Round 2A of Round 1 winners:
Kerry v Meath
Monaghan v Down
Armagh v Dublin
Tyrone v Cavan
Round 2B of Round 1 losers: (will mix up as no set groups)
Roscommon v Clare
Louth v Mayo
Derry v Cork
Donegal v Galway
Donegal and Galway despite winning their provinces could be in a 2B battle for survival!" Would be exciting - but maybe more so, drawing two initial rds (Rd 1 being an Open Draw, with all Home teams playing Away in Rd 2).
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3304 - 13/06/2025 19:54:23
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Replying To omahant: "Would be exciting - but maybe more so, drawing two initial rds (Rd 1 being an Open Draw, with all Home teams playing Away in Rd 2)." Back to the future. Just need to bring back two rounds of qualifiers for the 23 non finalists, or 24 non finalists when the Tailteann winner makes their provincial final. Just get on with the game! ;-D
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8965 - 14/06/2025 09:10:37
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@edu (Mayo) - Posts: 114 - 12/06/2025 21:06:54
Munster SHC has 3 of 5 advancing and seems to strike a nice balance between incentive and jeopardy.
Maybe AI Sam could take a similar approach - 4 groups of 5, including 8 Prov SFs plus ('4 of 16' others after 2 KO Rds).
Each group has 2 Prov SFs from 2 different Provs (say, U+L, LM, MC & CU).
AI KO 12 - top 3 in each group - no Prov Champ guarantee - 4 PQFs, 4 QFs, 2 SFs & F, after 4 group games (Prov Fs provide a 'bonus' 5th game, so 2 extra pts can be earned from each of these crossover games).
Bottom 12 to Tailteann Cup - 2 groups of 6, 2 QFs, SFs & F.
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3304 - 18/06/2025 11:46:52
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A 21% increase in attendances for the group stages this year. And they're getting rid of it. Madness. Save the group stage!
trimmer (Meath) - Posts: 549 - 18/06/2025 16:02:45
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Replying To trimmer: "A 21% increase in attendances for the group stages this year. And they're getting rid of it. Madness. Save the group stage!" I think the CCCC will be glad to be freed from the headache of neutral venue games!
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8965 - 18/06/2025 16:15:29
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Replying To legendzxix: "I think the CCCC will be glad to be freed from the headache of neutral venue games!" Ár Uachtarán is setting up another group to examine and report on Inter County structures.
What have they in mind now?
Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 2439 - 18/06/2025 17:01:30
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Replying To legendzxix: "I think the CCCC will be glad to be freed from the headache of neutral venue games!" Would the 2A and 2B rounds not require neutral venues?
Al_Maguire (Donegal) - Posts: 280 - 18/06/2025 17:26:05
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Replying To Seanfanbocht: "Ár Uachtarán is setting up another group to examine and report on Inter County structures.
What have they in mind now?" I don't football will be impacted much other extending the season. Hurling preliminary quarter-finals and possibly the group stage structure in lower tiers might be reviewed. County boards of some lower tier counties might be ok with the winners and losers round coming into football. It applied in the Christy Ring Cup previously. Would mean 3 tiered brackets of 8 instead of the current 4 tiered groups of 6.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8965 - 18/06/2025 18:13:29
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The double elimination brings with it a reduction of 8 games in comparison to the current group stage. It means that the A.I series will now lose a third of its games. That is a rather large chunk to lose. Similarly the Tailteann Cup.
edu (Mayo) - Posts: 115 - 18/06/2025 19:12:12
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Replying To legendzxix: "I think the CCCC will be glad to be freed from the headache of neutral venue games!" CCCC should read your posts - in each group, 2 teams get 2 home games, the other 2 get 1.
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3304 - 19/06/2025 14:56:47
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Replying To edu: "The double elimination brings with it a reduction of 8 games in comparison to the current group stage. It means that the A.I series will now lose a third of its games. That is a rather large chunk to lose. Similarly the Tailteann Cup." Maybe an argument can be made to reduce the inter-county footprint, at least for the stronger teams - so a one rd reduction is probably ok.
I think the intensity of Rd 2A/2B next year should be no less so than current 3rd group rd.
Curiously, there was no need for Tier 2 to be identical to Tier 1 - the former could do with the extra games.
omahant (USA) - Posts: 3304 - 19/06/2025 15:08:21
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The likes of Offaly and Westmeath should be pushing for All Ireland qualifiers, even Down as well. I wouldn't mind but the timescale is there. Q1 on the weekend of the Ulster and Leinster finals. Q2 the weekend after. All Ireland championship starting then on the following weekend.
-1. Allianz league finals.
0. Weekend off!
1. Provincial Round 1
2. Leinster and Ulster quarters
3. Connacht and Munster semis
4. Leinster and Ulster semis
5. Connacht and Munster finals
6. Leinster and Ulster finals. Qualifier Round 1.
7. Qualifier Round 2 (Hurling final group stage round.)
8. All Ireland Round 1
9. Weekend off (Hurling provincial finals)
10. Rounds 2A and 2B.
11. Round 3
12. All Ireland quarter finals...
(Note: Qualifiers would work better towards a group stage. I'm just not going down the road of wholesale changes.)
If there were qualifiers this year - Offaly, Kildare, Westmeath and Fermanagh would be the unseeded teams that could cause an upset depending in the Q2 draw e.g. Cork away to Kildare, Tyrone away to Westmeath or Derry away to Offaly!
...
Tailteann 16 straight knockout:
7. Preliminary round of two Q1 losers. (Possibly lowest two based on league ranking.)
8. Tailteann Round of 16 (Including Q1 losers, Q2 losers, New York and Preliminary round winner.)
9. Weekend off (Hurling provincial finals)
10. Tailteann quarters. All Ireland Rounds 2A and 2B.
11. Tailteann semis. All Ireland Round 3.
...
14. Tailteann final. All Ireland semis.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8965 - 19/06/2025 21:11:56
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