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Replying To Purpleandgold72: "Please, you simply cannot compare Tipp to ourselves this time last year and claim they 'were going nowhere'. Fair enough, their supporters were frustrated after a poor year but that is more a reflection of the standards they set for themselves. They had also just won an all Ireland minor title last year to add to all Ireland minor titles they won in 2022 and 2016. Plus they won u21 all Irelands in 2018 and 2019 and lost the u21 final last year. All this underage success was going to bear fruit at some stage and that happened last Sunday and will doubtless see them claim Liam McCarthy again in the coming years. Meanwhile, we have one Leinster minor title in 2019 having to go back to 1985 for the last one before that. Like I said, Tipp set high standards based on realistic expections every year. We are going nowhere because that is where we are at the moment and have been for long time. To expect anymore, is just unrealistic." That's part of the problem though, no-one believes in the players so the players don't end up believing in themselves
When McGuinness first went into Donegal, he asked his players how many thought that Donegal could win an AI and only Michael Murphy and Karl Lacey put their hands up. Not even two years laters and they were AI champs
If we did the same, I'd say Chin would be the only one to put his hand up, I think a lot of the other players aren't emptying themselves and that's because they don't fully believe in themselves and they're never going to believe in themselves if they kept on getting told they're at nothing
ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 612 - 27/07/2025 19:02:18
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Replying To Purpleandgold72: "Please, you simply cannot compare Tipp to ourselves this time last year and claim they 'were going nowhere'. Fair enough, their supporters were frustrated after a poor year but that is more a reflection of the standards they set for themselves. They had also just won an all Ireland minor title last year to add to all Ireland minor titles they won in 2022 and 2016. Plus they won u21 all Irelands in 2018 and 2019 and lost the u21 final last year. All this underage success was going to bear fruit at some stage and that happened last Sunday and will doubtless see them claim Liam McCarthy again in the coming years. Meanwhile, we have one Leinster minor title in 2019 having to go back to 1985 for the last one before that. Like I said, Tipp set high standards based on realistic expections every year. We are going nowhere because that is where we are at the moment and have been for long time. To expect anymore, is just unrealistic." Brutal record in fairness. 2 Leinster minor titles since 1985.
Avondhu86 (Cork) - Posts: 26 - 27/07/2025 21:02:48
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Replying To Avondhu86: "Brutal record in fairness. 2 Leinster minor titles since 1985." Think it's only 1 lad
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16718 - 27/07/2025 22:23:18
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Replying To Purpleandgold72: "Please, you simply cannot compare Tipp to ourselves this time last year and claim they 'were going nowhere'. Fair enough, their supporters were frustrated after a poor year but that is more a reflection of the standards they set for themselves. They had also just won an all Ireland minor title last year to add to all Ireland minor titles they won in 2022 and 2016. Plus they won u21 all Irelands in 2018 and 2019 and lost the u21 final last year. All this underage success was going to bear fruit at some stage and that happened last Sunday and will doubtless see them claim Liam McCarthy again in the coming years. Meanwhile, we have one Leinster minor title in 2019 having to go back to 1985 for the last one before that. Like I said, Tipp set high standards based on realistic expections every year. We are going nowhere because that is where we are at the moment and have been for long time. To expect anymore, is just unrealistic." Tipp had a terrible record in the championship since winning it in 2019. It was far from only last year. Cahill had two poor seasons in a row. Sure there were positive signs and results at underage but senior level for them was desperate. Their support had deserted their team, plenty of their former players were commenting on it.
Id agree, we are where we deserve to be. No hard luck story this year.
Timbertony (Wexford) - Posts: 440 - 27/07/2025 22:28:24
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Replying To ElGranSenor: "That's part of the problem though, no-one believes in the players so the players don't end up believing in themselves
When McGuinness first went into Donegal, he asked his players how many thought that Donegal could win an AI and only Michael Murphy and Karl Lacey put their hands up. Not even two years laters and they were AI champs
If we did the same, I'd say Chin would be the only one to put his hand up, I think a lot of the other players aren't emptying themselves and that's because they don't fully believe in themselves and they're never going to believe in themselves if they kept on getting told they're at nothing" 100%
Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3860 - 27/07/2025 23:01:48
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Replying To Timbertony: "Tipp had a terrible record in the championship since winning it in 2019. It was far from only last year. Cahill had two poor seasons in a row. Sure there were positive signs and results at underage but senior level for them was desperate. Their support had deserted their team, plenty of their former players were commenting on it.
Id agree, we are where we deserve to be. No hard luck story this year." Tipp were very poor, but they always had the potential to come good in a given year. They had a group of hurlers who won an All-Ireland in 2019, plus a lot of successful underage talent coming through.
They might not even get out of Munster next year, but it wouldn't surprise me if they won another All-Ireland in next few years.
WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 2474 - 28/07/2025 00:02:17
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Replying To Timbertony: "Tipp had a terrible record in the championship since winning it in 2019. It was far from only last year. Cahill had two poor seasons in a row. Sure there were positive signs and results at underage but senior level for them was desperate. Their support had deserted their team, plenty of their former players were commenting on it.
Id agree, we are where we deserve to be. No hard luck story this year." This is the first time since the start of the Liam Dunne era that we've just been fairly consistently off the pace.
I will say again though, it's not as bad as it was then. Mainly because of the age profile of the players. There's time for this group to improve quite a bit.
Even the dodgy penalty in Parnell... Would that have fundamentally changed our season? Maybe. What if we had finished third in Leinster? We'd have gotten 1 extra game.
I'm clutching at straws a bit, but the positives from 25 are:
Another season of experience for our younger players. Carley, Foley, Ryan, Byrne, Molloy, Lawlor etc.
League wins against Clare and Limerick. Albeit they had poor seasons themselves.
A good response when being well beaten by Kilkenny and Tipp in the league.
About 45 minutes of good hurling against Dublin and Galway........
A hard fought win against a very determined Offaly team.
Surely the only way is up for 26 ?
Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3860 - 28/07/2025 08:10:27
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Replying To Doylerwex: "This is the first time since the start of the Liam Dunne era that we've just been fairly consistently off the pace.
I will say again though, it's not as bad as it was then. Mainly because of the age profile of the players. There's time for this group to improve quite a bit.
Even the dodgy penalty in Parnell... Would that have fundamentally changed our season? Maybe. What if we had finished third in Leinster? We'd have gotten 1 extra game.
I'm clutching at straws a bit, but the positives from 25 are:
Another season of experience for our younger players. Carley, Foley, Ryan, Byrne, Molloy, Lawlor etc.
League wins against Clare and Limerick. Albeit they had poor seasons themselves.
A good response when being well beaten by Kilkenny and Tipp in the league.
About 45 minutes of good hurling against Dublin and Galway........
A hard fought win against a very determined Offaly team.
Surely the only way is up for 26 ?" Hope so Doyler. This time next year we will be Leinster Champions ;-)
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16718 - 28/07/2025 12:41:37
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Replying To ElGranSenor: "That's part of the problem though, no-one believes in the players so the players don't end up believing in themselves
When McGuinness first went into Donegal, he asked his players how many thought that Donegal could win an AI and only Michael Murphy and Karl Lacey put their hands up. Not even two years laters and they were AI champs
If we did the same, I'd say Chin would be the only one to put his hand up, I think a lot of the other players aren't emptying themselves and that's because they don't fully believe in themselves and they're never going to believe in themselves if they kept on getting told they're at nothing" I genuinely thought our 2019 was going to be like Donegal's 2011, Davy was our McGuinness and Chin was our Murphy, win the provincial get beat in a SF and then make improvements the following year and eventually get over the line. Unfortunately it doesn't work like that.
Regarding the first point - I want to see us succeed as just as much as everyone else, but two things I'll stress are we have to be realistic about where we are, it counts for absolutely nothing now but I don't think it's going to change a lot between now and January barring retirements etc. but may serve as some sort of barometer as to where we are in the pecking order - PP currently have us at 100/1 to win the AI next year, I think Waterford and Dublin are at 25/1 and Offaly are about 175/1, Galway 14/1 and we need to be patient with this transition we're going through, it'll be no overnight fix.
I'm not being biased but as well as OHanlon, Dee and Mogie won't be easily replaced in that team, and I'd probably throw Paul Morris and Shaun Murphy into that bracket too.
I do think you're right though on your point putting hands up, but nevermind all Ireland, if you sat the panel in a room at the start of next year and said how many of you genuinely think we can win Leinster - how many hands do you think would be up in the air?
OpenStandWall (Wexford) - Posts: 285 - 28/07/2025 13:54:50
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Memory popped up on my phone this morning, 6 years ago today:
https://vm.tiktok.com/ZNHpmoL6av8oT-iZAiR/
OpenStandWall (Wexford) - Posts: 285 - 28/07/2025 14:12:14
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Replying To OpenStandWall: "I genuinely thought our 2019 was going to be like Donegal's 2011, Davy was our McGuinness and Chin was our Murphy, win the provincial get beat in a SF and then make improvements the following year and eventually get over the line. Unfortunately it doesn't work like that.
Regarding the first point - I want to see us succeed as just as much as everyone else, but two things I'll stress are we have to be realistic about where we are, it counts for absolutely nothing now but I don't think it's going to change a lot between now and January barring retirements etc. but may serve as some sort of barometer as to where we are in the pecking order - PP currently have us at 100/1 to win the AI next year, I think Waterford and Dublin are at 25/1 and Offaly are about 175/1, Galway 14/1 and we need to be patient with this transition we're going through, it'll be no overnight fix.
I'm not being biased but as well as OHanlon, Dee and Mogie won't be easily replaced in that team, and I'd probably throw Paul Morris and Shaun Murphy into that bracket too.
I do think you're right though on your point putting hands up, but nevermind all Ireland, if you sat the panel in a room at the start of next year and said how many of you genuinely think we can win Leinster - how many hands do you think would be up in the air?" I don't know if being realistic is what you actually need to be in order to win, would say that a focus on raising standards is a lot more important than having realistic expectations
The benefits of a strong culture (Something we don't really have) are two-fold; you get players who are hurling-obsessed and hurl every day of the week when they're young but also a strong culture generally leads to higher standards and higher expectations. KK, Cork, and Tipp have won more AIs than anyone else and it's the same for Kerry in football; these things don't happen because they are naturally better than everyone else, their strong culture means they have more self-belief than everyone else
I don't agree with benchmarking ourselves against KK (We obsess over beating them, they obsess over winning AIs) but with both teams at their best, I don't think there's clear blue water between them and us yet they have been much, much closer than us to winning an AI even with a team that would be considered poor by KK's standards (A poor KK is still a good team). I think this is because even if this isn't the greatest KK team in the world, they're still hell-bent on winning an AI, they never doubt themselves that they can win one, and they don't suffer fools when it comes to setting standards
We need to focus on raising standards and getting the players to believe in themselves, don't know how far we'd go if that were to happen but do know that we would contending for Leinster at the very least
ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 612 - 28/07/2025 15:12:45
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Replying To OpenStandWall: "I genuinely thought our 2019 was going to be like Donegal's 2011, Davy was our McGuinness and Chin was our Murphy, win the provincial get beat in a SF and then make improvements the following year and eventually get over the line. Unfortunately it doesn't work like that.
Regarding the first point - I want to see us succeed as just as much as everyone else, but two things I'll stress are we have to be realistic about where we are, it counts for absolutely nothing now but I don't think it's going to change a lot between now and January barring retirements etc. but may serve as some sort of barometer as to where we are in the pecking order - PP currently have us at 100/1 to win the AI next year, I think Waterford and Dublin are at 25/1 and Offaly are about 175/1, Galway 14/1 and we need to be patient with this transition we're going through, it'll be no overnight fix.
I'm not being biased but as well as OHanlon, Dee and Mogie won't be easily replaced in that team, and I'd probably throw Paul Morris and Shaun Murphy into that bracket too.
I do think you're right though on your point putting hands up, but nevermind all Ireland, if you sat the panel in a room at the start of next year and said how many of you genuinely think we can win Leinster - how many hands do you think would be up in the air?" I genuinely think we can win Leinster, and maybe would've won Leinster again since 2019, if we can keep key men fit and injury free. Which sadly has been beyond us.
So we need a bigger panel of better players, preferably younger, which I think we are on our way with. But most of these are currently aged between 20 and 23, so will need at least another 2 years before they hit their peak as regards speed and strength.
Will they be strong enough to win Leinster next year? Probably not if we have injuries to key men again.
If we could get older lads, mid late 20s, to recommit that might help bridge that gap, but I don't think they will.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16718 - 28/07/2025 15:40:25
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Replying To OpenStandWall: "I genuinely thought our 2019 was going to be like Donegal's 2011, Davy was our McGuinness and Chin was our Murphy, win the provincial get beat in a SF and then make improvements the following year and eventually get over the line. Unfortunately it doesn't work like that.
Regarding the first point - I want to see us succeed as just as much as everyone else, but two things I'll stress are we have to be realistic about where we are, it counts for absolutely nothing now but I don't think it's going to change a lot between now and January barring retirements etc. but may serve as some sort of barometer as to where we are in the pecking order - PP currently have us at 100/1 to win the AI next year, I think Waterford and Dublin are at 25/1 and Offaly are about 175/1, Galway 14/1 and we need to be patient with this transition we're going through, it'll be no overnight fix.
I'm not being biased but as well as OHanlon, Dee and Mogie won't be easily replaced in that team, and I'd probably throw Paul Morris and Shaun Murphy into that bracket too.
I do think you're right though on your point putting hands up, but nevermind all Ireland, if you sat the panel in a room at the start of next year and said how many of you genuinely think we can win Leinster - how many hands do you think would be up in the air?" I already find it funny that 5 Munster teams can have shorter odds. Two of them won't even be in the compensation.
Agree 100% on Paul Morris. A shockingly under appreciated player. Played for Wexford for 20 years from 14 up and averaged 3 points a game. That's an outrageously good record.
Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3860 - 28/07/2025 15:58:12
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Replying To OpenStandWall: "I genuinely thought our 2019 was going to be like Donegal's 2011, Davy was our McGuinness and Chin was our Murphy, win the provincial get beat in a SF and then make improvements the following year and eventually get over the line. Unfortunately it doesn't work like that.
Regarding the first point - I want to see us succeed as just as much as everyone else, but two things I'll stress are we have to be realistic about where we are, it counts for absolutely nothing now but I don't think it's going to change a lot between now and January barring retirements etc. but may serve as some sort of barometer as to where we are in the pecking order - PP currently have us at 100/1 to win the AI next year, I think Waterford and Dublin are at 25/1 and Offaly are about 175/1, Galway 14/1 and we need to be patient with this transition we're going through, it'll be no overnight fix.
I'm not being biased but as well as OHanlon, Dee and Mogie won't be easily replaced in that team, and I'd probably throw Paul Morris and Shaun Murphy into that bracket too.
I do think you're right though on your point putting hands up, but nevermind all Ireland, if you sat the panel in a room at the start of next year and said how many of you genuinely think we can win Leinster - how many hands do you think would be up in the air?" I agree OpenStandWall I dont think our lads genuinely believe they can win Leinster. The reason we won in 2019 is because we had the hurlers and vitally also the belief which came from our 3 under 21 Leinster title wins. The vast majority of lads were used to winning Leinster titles and believed they could win a Leinster title at senior. Who knows what a u20 Leinster title in 22 or 23 would have done for Wexford hurling.
Afinestick96 (Wexford) - Posts: 684 - 28/07/2025 16:01:55
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Replying To Doylerwex: "I already find it funny that 5 Munster teams can have shorter odds. Two of them won't even be in the compensation.
Agree 100% on Paul Morris. A shockingly under appreciated player. Played for Wexford for 20 years from 14 up and averaged 3 points a game. That's an outrageously good record." It's only now Morris is retired that we know the value he brought. Very reliable. A great player.
Yellowhelmet (Australia) - Posts: 157 - 28/07/2025 17:45:36
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Replying To Viking66: "I genuinely think we can win Leinster, and maybe would've won Leinster again since 2019, if we can keep key men fit and injury free. Which sadly has been beyond us.
So we need a bigger panel of better players, preferably younger, which I think we are on our way with. But most of these are currently aged between 20 and 23, so will need at least another 2 years before they hit their peak as regards speed and strength.
Will they be strong enough to win Leinster next year? Probably not if we have injuries to key men again.
If we could get older lads, mid late 20s, to recommit that might help bridge that gap, but I don't think they will." Was thinking that with the two Foleys at the match in the park Saturday, Paudie got 4 points I think all from about 80-100 yards out granted they had the wind in the first half, Oisin's ability to win dirty ball as well is badly missed.
OpenStandWall (Wexford) - Posts: 285 - 28/07/2025 19:12:57
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Replying To Yellowhelmet: "It's only now Morris is retired that we know the value he brought. Very reliable. A great player." For what it's worth, I think the fact that he's out injured right now is a large part of the reason why Ferns aren't going well so far in this year's championship. He's still as important to them as he ever was.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2990 - 28/07/2025 19:35:04
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Replying To OpenStandWall: "Was thinking that with the two Foleys at the match in the park Saturday, Paudie got 4 points I think all from about 80-100 yards out granted they had the wind in the first half, Oisin's ability to win dirty ball as well is badly missed." How badly we need some experience to tighten up our half backline.... As well as a natural ball winning forward..... We've the whole winter now to talk about lads who aren't involved for whatever reason.
Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3860 - 28/07/2025 23:10:02
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Replying To OpenStandWall: "Was thinking that with the two Foleys at the match in the park Saturday, Paudie got 4 points I think all from about 80-100 yards out granted they had the wind in the first half, Oisin's ability to win dirty ball as well is badly missed." Except, when they did commit to the Wexford panel, Oisin was part of a HF line in Egan's last season that hardly won a ball between them. He was anonymous v Dublin and Galway from memory. Paudie, not sure I remember his long distance shooting from play or frees being all that accurate. Fanning still took a lot of the frees.
Sure if they committed, which is a big if, they would be in the 26 for sure. But world beaters they aren't. Unlikely to have improved as hurlers the longer away from the panel they have been too.
I thought Cian Molloy should have been our 6 this year and he and our team would have been better for it. Rossi wasted another year with Damien Reck there and going back to Paudie Foley in such a key position would be a backward step I reckon.
Timbertony (Wexford) - Posts: 440 - 29/07/2025 00:13:02
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Replying To Timbertony: "Except, when they did commit to the Wexford panel, Oisin was part of a HF line in Egan's last season that hardly won a ball between them. He was anonymous v Dublin and Galway from memory. Paudie, not sure I remember his long distance shooting from play or frees being all that accurate. Fanning still took a lot of the frees.
Sure if they committed, which is a big if, they would be in the 26 for sure. But world beaters they aren't. Unlikely to have improved as hurlers the longer away from the panel they have been too.
I thought Cian Molloy should have been our 6 this year and he and our team would have been better for it. Rossi wasted another year with Damien Reck there and going back to Paudie Foley in such a key position would be a backward step I reckon." I agree Cian Molloy has to be centre back next year. I wouldnt be recalling Paudie Foley think hes 32 next year and has been away from county hurling for a while now. Would call back Oisin given he will be 28 I think next year if hes willing to commit he could be a big asset for us in the forwards
Afinestick96 (Wexford) - Posts: 684 - 29/07/2025 09:06:17
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