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Irish At The Paris Olympics

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "I thought O'Sullivan made a highly dubious comment in the aftermath of the Irish mixed relay 4x400 team's performance. It was "we need more men capable of running sub-45 seconds".

She wasn't even picked up on it. But imagine the uproar if a male pundit said "we need more women capable of running sub-50 seconds".

Disclaimer: I might have the figures of 45 and 50 incorrect, but the point stands."
Don't think it's worth your while getting worked up about a scenario you've made up in your head.

She was right. Our male runners are very clearly not up to the standard of the males in the successful mixed relay teams, while are female runners very clearly are.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12199 - 12/08/2024 15:02:41    2564779

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "I thought O'Sullivan made a highly dubious comment in the aftermath of the Irish mixed relay 4x400 team's performance. It was "we need more men capable of running sub-45 seconds".

She wasn't even picked up on it. But imagine the uproar if a male pundit said "we need more women capable of running sub-50 seconds".

Disclaimer: I might have the figures of 45 and 50 incorrect, but the point stands."
Belgium had the opposite issue. Their two men were the fastest and 2nd fastest running their own legs, but the women on the team were of a much lower standard and it cost them.
Sonia's point was correct in that our women 400m runners are of a relatively higher standard, but I'm not sure if the Belgian Sonia made a similar point on their coverage. Unlikely, I'd say.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 2187 - 12/08/2024 15:04:42    2564780

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Replying To Breffni40:  "Don't think it's worth your while getting worked up about a scenario you've made up in your head.

She was right. Our male runners are very clearly not up to the standard of the males in the successful mixed relay teams, while are female runners very clearly are."
It's far from worked up I am, and yes, O'Sullivan is correct that our women 400m runners are of a higher standard relative to other women than our men are relative to other men.

But I still think I've a valid point in relation to the different standards that apply.

Consider if the roles were fully reversed - i.e. we've a mixed relay team of two male athletes who have serious ambitions in the individual event themselves, and two women who are way down the rankings as regards the women's individual event.

The team just misses out on qualification after the two men run stormers but the two women run slowly in comparison with other women runners. A male pundit on RTE uses words to the effect of "it's a pity the women weren't capable of running faster".

Do you not think there'd be outrage?

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 12/08/2024 15:40:37    2564786

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "It's far from worked up I am, and yes, O'Sullivan is correct that our women 400m runners are of a higher standard relative to other women than our men are relative to other men.

But I still think I've a valid point in relation to the different standards that apply.

Consider if the roles were fully reversed - i.e. we've a mixed relay team of two male athletes who have serious ambitions in the individual event themselves, and two women who are way down the rankings as regards the women's individual event.

The team just misses out on qualification after the two men run stormers but the two women run slowly in comparison with other women runners. A male pundit on RTE uses words to the effect of "it's a pity the women weren't capable of running faster".

Do you not think there'd be outrage?"
If your hypothetical was as obviously true as Sonia's reality then no I don't think there would be any outrage. I don't think what she said is "highly dubious" at all. But maybe I'm just more assured in my masculinity to invent an outrageous hypothetical hypocrisy

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12199 - 12/08/2024 16:18:11    2564797

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "I thought O'Sullivan made a highly dubious comment in the aftermath of the Irish mixed relay 4x400 team's performance. It was "we need more men capable of running sub-45 seconds".

She wasn't even picked up on it. But imagine the uproar if a male pundit said "we need more women capable of running sub-50 seconds".

Disclaimer: I might have the figures of 45 and 50 incorrect, but the point stands."
Calm down. Much ado about absolutely nothing. Sonia O Sullivan was right. There's nothing worse than manufactured outrage.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6144 - 12/08/2024 16:46:48    2564802

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If you wanna be hypothetical, if Rob Heffernan said it, not Sonia, would it be "highly dubious"?

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12199 - 12/08/2024 17:03:25    2564809

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "It's far from worked up I am, and yes, O'Sullivan is correct that our women 400m runners are of a higher standard relative to other women than our men are relative to other men.

But I still think I've a valid point in relation to the different standards that apply.

Consider if the roles were fully reversed - i.e. we've a mixed relay team of two male athletes who have serious ambitions in the individual event themselves, and two women who are way down the rankings as regards the women's individual event.

The team just misses out on qualification after the two men run stormers but the two women run slowly in comparison with other women runners. A male pundit on RTE uses words to the effect of "it's a pity the women weren't capable of running faster".

Do you not think there'd be outrage?"
It'd cause a Twitter storm. Maybe an amber weather alert. They might have to ring Teresa Mannion. Some keyboards might be broken. We'd probably survive though, but it'd be touch and go for those precarious minutes.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7651 - 12/08/2024 17:15:25    2564813

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "Do you just find random things to be angry about? Painful."
No I'm not angry about it at all … I only just found out that all those that returned home had to return for the closing ceremony… just thought it was strange until I found this out…. Don't get your knickers in a twist Flaker…

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3027 - 12/08/2024 18:02:15    2564822

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Replying To Breffni40:  "If you wanna be hypothetical, if Rob Heffernan said it, not Sonia, would it be "highly dubious"?"
Okay, "dubious" was probably the wrong word to use in my initial post about this, as it seems to be giving the impression that I'm questioning the accuracy of what she actually said. I'm not.

A different way of summarising things would be this:

A female pundit got away with saying something about the male members of the team, that a male pundit probably wouldn't get away with saying about the female team members if the performances on the track were reversed. It wouldn't matter if the male pundit was equally accurate in actually making that statement.

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 12/08/2024 18:17:12    2564828

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Replying To ForeverBlue2:  "No I'm not angry about it at all … I only just found out that all those that returned home had to return for the closing ceremony… just thought it was strange until I found this out…. Don't get your knickers in a twist Flaker…"
It's a short flight back for a great honour. It wasn't flying back to Melbourne. By the way i think the other posters have given their opinion on what they think of your posts. Not just me. Did you ever think that it might just be you that's the problem?

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8155 - 12/08/2024 18:56:56    2564834

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "It's a short flight back for a great honour. It wasn't flying back to Melbourne. By the way i think the other posters have given their opinion on what they think of your posts. Not just me. Did you ever think that it might just be you that's the problem?"
I have no problem…. a lot of those posters are a bit like yourself….flakey.. taking offence to every little comment .

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3027 - 12/08/2024 21:18:19    2564838

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I am sick to death of looking at Marty Morrissey on TV.

bruffgael (Limerick) - Posts: 201 - 12/08/2024 21:42:32    2564840

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "Okay, "dubious" was probably the wrong word to use in my initial post about this, as it seems to be giving the impression that I'm questioning the accuracy of what she actually said. I'm not.

A different way of summarising things would be this:

A female pundit got away with saying something about the male members of the team, that a male pundit probably wouldn't get away with saying about the female team members if the performances on the track were reversed. It wouldn't matter if the male pundit was equally accurate in actually making that statement."
Sonia's point was completely unfair. Blaming two solid guys because of Adeleke focussing on the individual.
Sonia has a bee in her bonnet about the kudos the sprinters got after the Europeans.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8284 - 12/08/2024 21:54:32    2564841

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "Okay, "dubious" was probably the wrong word to use in my initial post about this, as it seems to be giving the impression that I'm questioning the accuracy of what she actually said. I'm not.

A different way of summarising things would be this:

A female pundit got away with saying something about the male members of the team, that a male pundit probably wouldn't get away with saying about the female team members if the performances on the track were reversed. It wouldn't matter if the male pundit was equally accurate in actually making that statement."
I don't think so pikeman - any comments could be borne out by facts, you are think of the reaction of comparing women to men in the same sport - anyone saying that is comparing like with like, its not a female v male thing its a comparison - why would anyone be upset with the facts presented that way.

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1900 - 12/08/2024 22:04:22    2564844

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Replying To Rebel2020:  "Amazing performance last night. Took a GB national record to deprive Ireland of a medal. I wish more people here would spell Rhasidat correctly."
If there were Olympic medals for cringe .. :-)

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3118 - 12/08/2024 23:22:27    2564855

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Replying To ForeverBlue2:  "I have no problem…. a lot of those posters are a bit like yourself….flakey.. taking offence to every little comment ."
How was i offended by your post. There was nothing offensive about it. Just a daft post. Sorry to disappoint you there.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8155 - 13/08/2024 10:06:16    2564897

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I'm no expert on athletics and the Irish team did us proud but sometimes we get carried away and we develop blinkered vision.
Looking ahead to the next Olympics in LA we will be looking to equal or surpass our achievements in France. However just because we came 4th in the relay and the 800 meters does not mean we will get medals next time around. We may improve our times but rest assured that competitors from other countries will be working on their times as well .
Bottom line is we can and hopefully get medals in the above named events but athletes that won or finished in the top 5 or six will be going all out to mprove on their results in Paris.
They will not stay still while we knock off a second or two off our current timings.
Well done to all our men and women and please God we will get even more bronze, silver and gold next time in the USA.

Magpie2 (Wexford) - Posts: 386 - 13/08/2024 13:56:04    2564960

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The President of the Olympic Council of Ireland knows this is a good time to move on to a new role. Ireland will be doing reasonably well to medal in at least 4 disciplines. Anything else will be a bonus.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8284 - 13/08/2024 14:29:57    2564971

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The time has come to invest even more in our athletes and sports. The feel good factor from this Olympics needs to be capitalised on and not let to drift backwards. It inspires a nation and that cannot be underestimated.

hughieferm (Fermanagh) - Posts: 13 - 14/08/2024 13:18:56    2565079

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "Okay, "dubious" was probably the wrong word to use in my initial post about this, as it seems to be giving the impression that I'm questioning the accuracy of what she actually said. I'm not.

A different way of summarising things would be this:

A female pundit got away with saying something about the male members of the team, that a male pundit probably wouldn't get away with saying about the female team members if the performances on the track were reversed. It wouldn't matter if the male pundit was equally accurate in actually making that statement."
John McEnroe made an accurate statement re the quality of female tennis players in comparison to their male counterparts and got a fair bit of aggro over it,, he held firm though, fair play to him.

If a pundit were to suggest after the recent ladies all Ireland finals that it's a pity they're not up to the same standard as the men I think we all know how that would go.

There's a clear double standard there,, and a mature society would be happy to point that out and talk about it,, it certainly has nothing to do with whether or not you're "secure in your masculinity" as some eejit claimed.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1942 - 19/08/2024 00:14:30    2565745

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