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Pre-2018 Qualifiers with a "twist" to counter Prov imbalance: omahant (USA) - Posts: 2810 - 14/07/2024 04:58:23 2558871 Link 0 |
That'd be really bizarre though, to have qualifiers that are knock out and then suddenly get to the last 16 again and it's double elimination. All these formats are confusing lots of elements in ways that make no sense and have bizarre changes in momentum to the season. The hurling has a championship decoupled from the league so it's a clean start to the competition. It then goes to a group stage followed by playoff rounds. It's a much more sensible format which people can relate to and identify with as its common place across sports and other games. The football season on the other hand. It's not going to be improved by a double elimination last 16 coming straight off the back of the Provincial championships. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4326 - 14/07/2024 09:02:02 2558886 Link 1 |
Hurling can have graded Inter County Championships, with Group stages and with promotion and relegation. Camogie and LGFA the same. Buy inter Co football can't or the sky might fall in?! Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1795 - 14/07/2024 11:03:33 2558919 Link 1 |
If you ask someone from Armagh, Galway, Donegal and say louth they would probably tell you this year that the championship structure is fine. Ulsterchamps_32 (Donegal) - Posts: 772 - 14/07/2024 11:45:29 2558930 Link 1 |
Four groups of four with the top two qualifying or the double elimination format both require six weeks. The double elimination cuts out the dead rubber of a team on 2 wins versus a team without a win. Knockout qualifiers with a group stage following aesthetically looks better on the surface but it doesn't necessarily mean that the double elimination isn't a better approach. Football can be decoupled from the league using the tiered provincial group stage approach: ULSTER 2 groups of 4. Top two to semi-finals. 4th placed teams in relegation playoff if an Ulster team wins the Tailteann. LEINSTER 2 groups of 4. Top two to semi-finals. 4th placed teams in relegation playoff if a Leinster team wins the Tailteann. CONNACHT 1 group of 4. Top two to final. 4th placed team relegated if a Connacht team wins the Tailteann. MUNSTER 1 group of 4. Top two to final. 4th placed team relegated if a Munster team wins the Tailteann. ALL-IRELAND PRELIMINARY QUARTER-FINALS: 4 provincial runners-up versus 4 Leinster and Ulster losing semi-finalists. ALL-IRELAND QUARTER-FINALS: 4 provincial winners versus 4 Pre-QF winners. TAILTEANN CUP 2 groups of 4. Top two to semi-finals. Tailteann winner promoted to their provincial championship of the following year. New York a conundrum as always. Possibly New York can travel for a Tailteann Cup quarter-final against the lowest ranked group runner-up or some other suitable arrangement can be agreed upon. legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8161 - 14/07/2024 12:23:07 2558938 Link 0 |
Do you actually ever read anything that people write or follow a conversation because you always just put words in people's mouths and argue over things no one is saying. Nothing wrong with having tiers in football but they have to make sense. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4326 - 14/07/2024 13:44:48 2558953 Link 0 |
Hurling has a tiered championship where teams move up from one grade to another through championship performance only. Football has 3 different pathways leading into the top championship. That's the difference, that's why the formats never make sense. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4326 - 14/07/2024 13:51:08 2558956 Link 0 |
Tier Provincial championships are a shocking idea. The 8 teams left out won't be on merit. The teams ultimately qualifying also aren't necessarily going to be a reflection of the best teams. Really the knockout provincials are probably getting most of the relevant fixtures played already, I just don't think there's a need to add more. You look at Connacht, is it going to be more exciting having Mayo, Galway and Roscommon playing each other in 4 games rather than 2. Is them playing against Leitrim and London also adding much? What about Munster, does anyone want 16 Munster championship fixtures. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4326 - 14/07/2024 13:59:30 2558958 Link 0 |
Sorry I forgot that you Leitrim and London won't feature in your system and it'll be only 13 Munster championship games. But let's take Connacht, let's say Sligo come bottom of that group but played well against all the big 3 and are clearly better than London or Leitrim but are relegated because Leitrim have won a competition amongst the weaker teams. Promotion and relegation for the All Ireland isn't being determined fully on the pitch, it's partly being determined by geographical quirks. The same exists in hurling and it's not great but they kind of get away with it because the 5th placed team in Munster is likely a good bit better than the 6th placed team in Leinster but still there are issues with competitive integrity that set up brings up. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4326 - 14/07/2024 14:11:22 2558963 Link 0 |
Does this work?: omahant (USA) - Posts: 2810 - 14/07/2024 15:04:38 2558977 Link 0 |
in hurling and it's not great but they kind of get away with it because the 5th placed team in Munster is likely a good bit better than the 6th placed team in Leinster but still there are issues with competitive integrity that set up brings up. omahant (USA) - Posts: 2810 - 14/07/2024 15:30:30 2558981 Link 0 |
If a tiered provincial championship is a non runner for those reasons, bring back the qualifiers for 7 qualifiers to join the 8 provincial finalists and the Tailteann winner from the previous year.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8161 - 14/07/2024 16:53:32 2558997 Link 0 |
Or my pre-2018 Qualifiers with a "twist" above.
omahant (USA) - Posts: 2810 - 14/07/2024 17:32:47 2559004 Link 0 |
Or provincial championships before league. 13:10:10 split. 8 league, 4 provincial winners and Tailteann winner into All-Ireland series. Next best 10 from the league into the Tailteann. The remaining 9 and New York into a Tier 3. The All-Ireland series, Tailteann and Tier 3 all run on knockout basis. League seeding used for all rounds. The top 2 from the league potentially kept apart until the All-Ireland final. legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8161 - 14/07/2024 17:50:29 2559013 Link 0 |
It works - 3 Tier 1 byes based on Prov Champs higher league ranking?
omahant (USA) - Posts: 2810 - 14/07/2024 18:16:13 2559032 Link 0 |
The top 3 in Division 1 can earn a bye to the All-Ireland quarter-finals. Provincial champions and Tailteann winners can qualify for the All-Ireland series but league ranking should take precedence so that the current competition is offering a carrot for all as much as possible. The All-Ireland quarter-finals can remain in Croke Park. Division 2, 3 and 4 winners could be guaranteed home advantage in their first championship round, be that All-Ireland preliminary quarter-final, Tailteann quarter-final, Tailteann preliminary quarter-final, Tier 3 quarter-final or Tier 3 preliminary quarter-final. Retaining league finals or not is debatable. League finalists with a bye to quarter-finals would have a reasonable four week break. A non league-finalist with a bye to quarter-finals might have a five week break. That might not find favour? If league finals are sacrificed because knockout championship is on the horizon, teams would have no more than a four week break. Decisions, decisions, decisions!!! legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8161 - 14/07/2024 18:51:02 2559044 Link 0 |
What about... Lúla571210 (Louth) - Posts: 54 - 14/07/2024 23:44:16 2559159 Link 0 |
@legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8108 - 14/07/2024 18:51:02 2559044 omahant (USA) - Posts: 2810 - 15/07/2024 01:56:47 2559177 Link 0 |
How late in August?
Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1795 - 15/07/2024 11:32:18 2559247 Link 0 |
Midday or midnight?
omahant (USA) - Posts: 2810 - 15/07/2024 17:01:43 2559351 Link 0 |