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Replying To ElGranSenor: "Was the U20 management team not in place before Christmas? I wonder is less more in this case, I'm not sure all of this training in November/December actually ends up giving teams that big of an edge come summertime plus it gives lads no chance to take some time away from the game and freshen up mentally" I guess we will see if you are right over the coming couple of months. You could well be and obviously hopefully you are. We were 2 months or so later starting at u20 than any other top county. We have alot of good players still u20 from last years u20 panel.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13070 - 23/03/2024 11:40:45
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Replying To ElGranSenor: "Was the U20 management team not in place before Christmas? I wonder is less more in this case, I'm not sure all of this training in November/December actually ends up giving teams that big of an edge come summertime plus it gives lads no chance to take some time away from the game and freshen up mentally" Totally agree. Between Colleges and everything else there is no need for lads to be flogged in November or December. They should be in the gym which they are and that is enough. The U20 management was in place for October. Five months is surely enough to prepare a team Viking?
I heard the 20s beat Tipp in a challenge game but that Eoin Whelan and two other starters will miss the championship which would be a huge blow. I speak to some people with chaps on teams and they say that the work being done by Niall Williams as Director of Hurling will pay off. Things have gone up a level in the last year or so. It obviously takes time and buy in from everybody.
wexfordwin (Wexford) - Posts: 164 - 23/03/2024 12:44:59
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Replying To wexfordwin: "Totally agree. Between Colleges and everything else there is no need for lads to be flogged in November or December. They should be in the gym which they are and that is enough. The U20 management was in place for October. Five months is surely enough to prepare a team Viking?
I heard the 20s beat Tipp in a challenge game but that Eoin Whelan and two other starters will miss the championship which would be a huge blow. I speak to some people with chaps on teams and they say that the work being done by Niall Williams as Director of Hurling will pay off. Things have gone up a level in the last year or so. It obviously takes time and buy in from everybody." The U20 management team wasn't even ratified until the end of November. Theyve only had a little over 3 months. We had loads of odd carry-on to do with Rory Jacobs backroom team.
Are you sure Whelans going to miss the Championship? Cian Byrne told me a few weeks ago that he should be back. Did he re-injure himself? Who are the other 2 starters we will be missing?
For sure things have definitely improved in terms of underage set up the last few years. As you say it will take time to see the results of this. And obviously most other counties are improving what they are doing. It's not just the case that we need to improve in order to win underage AIs, its also the case that we need to improve just to keep up.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13070 - 23/03/2024 13:05:39
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Replying To wexfordwin: "Totally agree. Between Colleges and everything else there is no need for lads to be flogged in November or December. They should be in the gym which they are and that is enough. The U20 management was in place for October. Five months is surely enough to prepare a team Viking?
I heard the 20s beat Tipp in a challenge game but that Eoin Whelan and two other starters will miss the championship which would be a huge blow. I speak to some people with chaps on teams and they say that the work being done by Niall Williams as Director of Hurling will pay off. Things have gone up a level in the last year or so. It obviously takes time and buy in from everybody." Eoin Whelan would be a huge loss, I think he's potential to be a senior starter down the line although does seem injury prone, I'm guessing we'd be 4th favourites for Leinster this year behind Kilkenny, Galway and Offaly who have most of their team from last year underage again. Heard challenge games hadn't been going well prior to the Tipp game but hopefully we'll be in the mix in the championship.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 23/03/2024 13:07:31
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Replying To wexfordwin: "Totally agree. Between Colleges and everything else there is no need for lads to be flogged in November or December. They should be in the gym which they are and that is enough. The U20 management was in place for October. Five months is surely enough to prepare a team Viking?
I heard the 20s beat Tipp in a challenge game but that Eoin Whelan and two other starters will miss the championship which would be a huge blow. I speak to some people with chaps on teams and they say that the work being done by Niall Williams as Director of Hurling will pay off. Things have gone up a level in the last year or so. It obviously takes time and buy in from everybody." The U20 management team wasn't even ratified until the end of November. Theyve only had a little over 3 months. We had loads of odd carry-on to do with Rory Jacobs backroom team.
Are you sure Whelans going to miss the Championship? Cian Byrne told me a few weeks ago that he should be back. Did he re-injure himself? Who are the other 2 starters we will be missing?
For sure things have definitely improved in terms of underage set up the last few years. As you say it will take time to see the results of this. And obviously most other counties are improving what they are doing. It's not just the case that we need to improve in order to win underage AIs, its also the case that we need to improve just to keep up.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13070 - 23/03/2024 13:07:56
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Replying To Viking66: "I'm not saying excuses are better than honesty. In all honesty did you think we would beat Cork when the 2 teams were announced just before throw-in? That's not an excuse. That Wexford selection was never going to beat that Cork selection. It's absolutely incredible that so called hurling experts on this forum were surprised by the result to the point they started coming out with all the usual negative #####.
We can speculate why the team was named that way, but we don't know. We don't know who are injured. We don't know how injured they are. Why should Rossiter tell us? The bottom line was we achieved our target for this years League, 1a hurling next year and new players given gametime, which was an achievement in itself bearing in mind the Championship starters we were missing.
As regards the relevance of people on the ground doing more, it's completely relevant. You don't buy intercounty hurlers in Aldi or Tesco. And if the standard of u8-u12 coaching doesn't improve countywide in the clubs we will still be going along as we were. There's top u12 lads in our county who can't strike well off their weaker side for example. That's a huge negative when these lads then end up in u14 development squads." Well the bottom line if you ask me is just like the Clare game last year people paid 20 quid in to watch an annihilation.
If you are naming a weakened team, bloody well go and name it on Thursday night so people can at least decide "we're not interested in winning this game" and decide accordingly if that's the best use of their hard earned money. I would never be of the opinion you follow teams through good times only but there is a reason league games across the board are poorly attended.
I agree with you about people on the ground doing more, no arguments there.
ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1242 - 23/03/2024 14:13:48
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Replying To tearintom: "It's nothing to do with how you or I think we are going to do.
Did I think we would beat cork, no I didn't. But I didn't try and excuse the performance on the basis of "ah we didn't really want to win it anyway" cos that's quite frankly bull! Ye see that's an excuse!
I didn't see anyone really being disappointed with the result in all honesty but people offering an honest opinion on our performance which was poor on the day. There's nothing negative in saying that, it's a fact, it doesn't negate all the other positives we have had this year in admitting that.
And again it's been a successful start to the year imho, but overall imho we really need to stop with the pathetic excuses when things do go awry because it's serves no one or nothing." This is exactly what I was saying. The time for the BS excuse has to be over.
ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1242 - 23/03/2024 14:17:00
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Replying To ExiledInWex: "This is exactly what I was saying. The time for the BS excuse has to be over." Very disappointing result in the under 19, anyone know anything about the set up etc...
hunting (Wexford) - Posts: 1013 - 23/03/2024 14:35:18
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Replying To ExiledInWex: "Well the bottom line if you ask me is just like the Clare game last year people paid 20 quid in to watch an annihilation.
If you are naming a weakened team, bloody well go and name it on Thursday night so people can at least decide "we're not interested in winning this game" and decide accordingly if that's the best use of their hard earned money. I would never be of the opinion you follow teams through good times only but there is a reason league games across the board are poorly attended.
I agree with you about people on the ground doing more, no arguments there." The team named in advance WAS the weakened team pretty much. It got changed ok by the replacement of Richie Lawlor by Joe O Connor and Darragh Carley got a start I think at the expense of Niall Murphy. But it didn't have Chin, Jacko, Dee, Mogie, Mac, Devitt, Dwyer, Jippo, CBD or Tucker starting in it anyway. I left off Oisin Foley and Conall Flood as I don't think they will be fit for this years championship anyway. Some of those lads would have started if last weeks game was the Championship opener against Dublin. They weren't going to risk them for a nothing game against Cork. The corresponding fixture last year caused us big problems coming into the Leinster Championship. From Memory O'Hanlon, Mac, Dee, Mogie and Damien Reck all picked up serious enough injuries. We led that game for 69 minutes until Cork got a goal to nick it at the death. But overall the injuries we picked up during that game messed up our whole season.
On the last point I know you are a lad that puts in your time coaching. There's nothing in any of my posts that's a personal attack on you!
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13070 - 23/03/2024 14:51:40
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Replying To wexfordwin: "Totally agree. Between Colleges and everything else there is no need for lads to be flogged in November or December. They should be in the gym which they are and that is enough. The U20 management was in place for October. Five months is surely enough to prepare a team Viking?
I heard the 20s beat Tipp in a challenge game but that Eoin Whelan and two other starters will miss the championship which would be a huge blow. I speak to some people with chaps on teams and they say that the work being done by Niall Williams as Director of Hurling will pay off. Things have gone up a level in the last year or so. It obviously takes time and buy in from everybody." Don't know as much about the underage structures as I should . What plans has Niall Williams put in place ?
Afinestick96 (Wexford) - Posts: 338 - 23/03/2024 14:56:16
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Replying To hunting: "Very disappointing result in the under 19, anyone know anything about the set up etc..." Some of the team weren't even on Celtic Challenge teams when they were minor. Other lads didn't commit as its kind of an in between year. Some counties are taking it more seriously than others, playing their u19 starters off their u20s in it. We aren't. According to a top man in our underage set up there are 2 lads, maybe 3, on that team that might start for the u20s, but not until next year.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13070 - 23/03/2024 14:59:37
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Replying To Viking66: "The team named in advance WAS the weakened team pretty much. It got changed ok by the replacement of Richie Lawlor by Joe O Connor and Darragh Carley got a start I think at the expense of Niall Murphy. But it didn't have Chin, Jacko, Dee, Mogie, Mac, Devitt, Dwyer, Jippo, CBD or Tucker starting in it anyway. I left off Oisin Foley and Conall Flood as I don't think they will be fit for this years championship anyway. Some of those lads would have started if last weeks game was the Championship opener against Dublin. They weren't going to risk them for a nothing game against Cork. The corresponding fixture last year caused us big problems coming into the Leinster Championship. From Memory O'Hanlon, Mac, Dee, Mogie and Damien Reck all picked up serious enough injuries. We led that game for 69 minutes until Cork got a goal to nick it at the death. But overall the injuries we picked up during that game messed up our whole season.
On the last point I know you are a lad that puts in your time coaching. There's nothing in any of my posts that's a personal attack on you!" Sorry forgot Rory on that list
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13070 - 23/03/2024 15:25:05
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Going by the fact this year's U20s team lost a Leinster Minor Final to Kilkenny by three points in 2021, you would be hopeful that there's some good talent there, pretty much every Minor team who have reached a Leinster Final for us since 2008 have ended up contributing a good few starters to our Senior team
But talent doesn't necessarily translate to success, let's see how this team goes
ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 332 - 23/03/2024 17:43:38
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Replying To Viking66: " Replying To Pikeman96: "You maybe have me on a technicality re. the 50s.
If you say we reached four All-Irelands in the 50s, then you're obviously using the period 1951 to 1960, and it's actually correct to count 1960 as part of the 50s.
I was looking at the period 1950 to 1959. The actual record in those years is four Leinsters and two All-Irelands for Wexford, and five Leinsters and one All-Ireland for Kilkenny.
But an old records book I have here mistakenly includes 1950 for Kilkenny in the All-Ireland roll of honour, even though they lost that year's final to Tipperary (it lists 1950 for Tipperary as well, and I never noticed the mistake before!). So I was writing earlier in the belief that Kilkenny had won two All-Ireland plus five Leinsters during those years, compared to our two plus four.
Anyway, fairly small point in the overall scheme of things, but thought I'd answer you on it anyway." We reached all ireland hurling finals in 51,54,55,and 56. We won 2, 55 and 56."
Forgot about the '51 All-Ireland so when you said "four in the 1950s", thought you meant 54, 55, 56 and correctly counting 1960 as actually the last year of the 1950s decade.
Anyway, initial point stands, that we basically have to live in hope rather than expectation, because we simply and unfortunately haven't been successful enough over the years to ever be able to expect success as a matter of course.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2337 - 23/03/2024 17:56:44
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Replying To hunting: "Very disappointing result in the under 19, anyone know anything about the set up etc..." At the risk of being accused of "making excuses" after we lose something, I wouldn't be too concerned over it.
Apparently this new thing was set up between the counties themselves, with Kilkenny being the main instigator, and it was agreed it should only be open to players who haven't yet played U20 championship matches.
So, apparently Offaly played seven or eight last night who haven't yet played U20 championship, but who are expected to start for them in the first round of U20 next week. Wexford, on the other hand, took the approach of using it to give a game to all the lads who are not expected to feature in the U20 championship this year. So basically, seems it was half of Offaly's championship team versus none of ours.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2337 - 23/03/2024 18:02:27
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Replying To Pikeman96: "At the risk of being accused of "making excuses" after we lose something, I wouldn't be too concerned over it.
Apparently this new thing was set up between the counties themselves, with Kilkenny being the main instigator, and it was agreed it should only be open to players who haven't yet played U20 championship matches.
So, apparently Offaly played seven or eight last night who haven't yet played U20 championship, but who are expected to start for them in the first round of U20 next week. Wexford, on the other hand, took the approach of using it to give a game to all the lads who are not expected to feature in the U20 championship this year. So basically, seems it was half of Offaly's championship team versus none of ours." From what I have been told only the Offaly goalie will be part of the 24 for their 1st Rd match.
But on the other hand it definitely is not Wexfords next best panel after our proper 20s. I would imagine only max 5 of them will play U20s for Wexford.
Paull (Wexford) - Posts: 179 - 23/03/2024 18:52:17
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Replying To ElGranSenor: "Going by the fact this year's U20s team lost a Leinster Minor Final to Kilkenny by three points in 2021, you would be hopeful that there's some good talent there, pretty much every Minor team who have reached a Leinster Final for us since 2008 have ended up contributing a good few starters to our Senior team
But talent doesn't necessarily translate to success, let's see how this team goes" Hopefully you are right about the reduced time together not making any difference.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13070 - 23/03/2024 19:37:04
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Replying To Pikeman96: "At the risk of being accused of "making excuses" after we lose something, I wouldn't be too concerned over it.
Apparently this new thing was set up between the counties themselves, with Kilkenny being the main instigator, and it was agreed it should only be open to players who haven't yet played U20 championship matches.
So, apparently Offaly played seven or eight last night who haven't yet played U20 championship, but who are expected to start for them in the first round of U20 next week. Wexford, on the other hand, took the approach of using it to give a game to all the lads who are not expected to feature in the U20 championship this year. So basically, seems it was half of Offaly's championship team versus none of ours." From what I have been told only the Offaly goalie will be part of the 24 for their 1st Rd match.
But on the other hand it definitely is not Wexfords next best panel after our proper 20s. I would imagine only max 5 of them will play U20s for Wexford.
Paull (Wexford) - Posts: 179 - 23/03/2024 19:41:57
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Well lads, is impending doom on the way for Limerick after today just like it was for us after the defeat to Cork?
More relevant news to us is alot of lads returning to the Antrim panel before the championship, 6 Dunloy lads including Keelan Molloy who is their best player in my opinion and their goalie Ryan Elliott, makes the tricky trip Belfast tricker again.
On the u19 game last night I've no idea on how each county is approaching the competition, all I know is there's only 1 player on the Wexford panel last night who I would have taught was in the mix to be starting on the team this year and he's still u18.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 23/03/2024 20:13:51
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Replying To ElGranSenor: "Going by the fact this year's U20s team lost a Leinster Minor Final to Kilkenny by three points in 2021, you would be hopeful that there's some good talent there, pretty much every Minor team who have reached a Leinster Final for us since 2008 have ended up contributing a good few starters to our Senior team
But talent doesn't necessarily translate to success, let's see how this team goes" Kilkenny had a very strong team in that game, think 4 of them have played Senior already, and we very nearly beat them in it. It was nip and tuck all game and we were all over them at the end.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13070 - 23/03/2024 20:14:40
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