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Wexford Hurling thread 2024

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Replying To tearintom:  "I think as a county we are great at making excuses imho.

This time last year it was pretty obvious we were in a bit of trouble yet on here there was a plethora of excuses league doesn't matter, different come championship even suggestion we hadn't bothered in the league because the year before we did and championship wasn't great so trying the opposite.

All excuses rather than facing the reality at the time.

How many times have we read on here or heard fowllowing a bad performance that we had a tough training session or week of training in the build up to that game for example? The ref, the crowd, Kilkenny could dispatch Westmeath at home with very little attending but the lack of a big crowd affected us?

And of course the age old one that's never gone away about how playing football means we aren't as good at hurling as we should be!

We tolerate excuses that other counties don't imho and I've been guilty of it myself also.

Maybe it's just how we are as a people, we are quite laid back, I don't know but I do think we dole out excuses that other counties wouldn't and don't."
Isn't that better than just saying we are terrible? We aren't as bad as some people make out. But we are a little way off consistently winning things.
What we need are more people willing to put their time into making things better. Get involved with coaching underage instead of complaining, and then try to be better at coaching. Take courses. Improve their coaching. Provide better coaching in every club for every agegroup. Otherwise things will stay exactly where they are at now.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12387 - 22/03/2024 08:55:46    2532598

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Replying To hunting:  "Is there no topic on Dublin hurling on this forum."
No. Only Barney and Exiled seem to have any interest in it.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12387 - 22/03/2024 08:56:44    2532599

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Replying To Canuck:  "To say Lee Chin, Tony Kelly who's carriers, hampered by injuries are not among the greats who play the game not good enough is something. Tadgh DeBurca who has had two horrific cruciate injuries and an achilles tended rupture was not consistent or good enough ??? O sorry it is just good Waterford players. Someone thought Prunty an All star at 21 was good enough."
What has Prunty done since? Like most Waterford players, very little. Don't try blame injuries for being the worst county in MUnster for a number of years.

countyman2022 (Wexford) - Posts: 645 - 22/03/2024 09:22:32    2532606

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Replying To Viking66:  "Isn't that better than just saying we are terrible? We aren't as bad as some people make out. But we are a little way off consistently winning things.
What we need are more people willing to put their time into making things better. Get involved with coaching underage instead of complaining, and then try to be better at coaching. Take courses. Improve their coaching. Provide better coaching in every club for every agegroup. Otherwise things will stay exactly where they are at now."
No, not when we were terrible.

How can excuses be better than honesty?

This is part of the problem, I mean we were blown away by Cork, that's a fact but on here you read excuses like "ah we didn't really want to win it anyway"

What does that serve? Honestly, what good is that?

Unless we start not accepting the excuses nothing will change.

Of course we need more people to get involved and do more, not sure what relevance that has to the discussion at hand if I'm honest, that's a given.

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1356 - 22/03/2024 09:59:53    2532612

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Wexford have been hit harder with injuries to key players under 30 than any other team over the last four years. Is it a legacy of the Davy years? How sustainable was what went on in those years.
Ryan, Hanlon, the Recks, Rory and Deeo and Lee all with recurring hamstring/achilles/back injuries.
I think Mogie, Gavin Bailey and the cruciates are in a different category, they seem to be a part and parcel risk of body shape/training and match intensity nowadays.
What does anyone think?

wendellgee (Wexford) - Posts: 26 - 22/03/2024 12:33:21    2532634

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Replying To tearintom:  "No, not when we were terrible.

How can excuses be better than honesty?

This is part of the problem, I mean we were blown away by Cork, that's a fact but on here you read excuses like "ah we didn't really want to win it anyway"

What does that serve? Honestly, what good is that?

Unless we start not accepting the excuses nothing will change.

Of course we need more people to get involved and do more, not sure what relevance that has to the discussion at hand if I'm honest, that's a given."
I'm not saying excuses are better than honesty. In all honesty did you think we would beat Cork when the 2 teams were announced just before throw-in? That's not an excuse. That Wexford selection was never going to beat that Cork selection. It's absolutely incredible that so called hurling experts on this forum were surprised by the result to the point they started coming out with all the usual negative #####.
We can speculate why the team was named that way, but we don't know. We don't know who are injured. We don't know how injured they are. Why should Rossiter tell us? The bottom line was we achieved our target for this years League, 1a hurling next year and new players given gametime, which was an achievement in itself bearing in mind the Championship starters we were missing.
As regards the relevance of people on the ground doing more, it's completely relevant. You don't buy intercounty hurlers in Aldi or Tesco. And if the standard of u8-u12 coaching doesn't improve countywide in the clubs we will still be going along as we were. There's top u12 lads in our county who can't strike well off their weaker side for example. That's a huge negative when these lads then end up in u14 development squads.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12387 - 22/03/2024 12:53:20    2532635

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Replying To Viking66:  "We have done nothing in my adult lifetime to give any sane adult any expectation of success. But if you don't have hope, or at least try to have it, you will just give up. And then expectation of failure will become a self fulfilling prophecy.

As regards the 50s and 60s in the 1950s we reached 4 AI finals to Kilkennys 3. We won 2 to their 1. Surely that makes us more successful?

In the 60s they reached 5 to our 4, winning 3 to our 2. So they were more successful.

So overall we had exactly the same record as them in AI finals in the 50s and 60s. We both reached 8, and both won 4."
You maybe have me on a technicality re. the 50s.

If you say we reached four All-Irelands in the 50s, then you're obviously using the period 1951 to 1960, and it's actually correct to count 1960 as part of the 50s.

I was looking at the period 1950 to 1959. The actual record in those years is four Leinsters and two All-Irelands for Wexford, and five Leinsters and one All-Ireland for Kilkenny.

But an old records book I have here mistakenly includes 1950 for Kilkenny in the All-Ireland roll of honour, even though they lost that year's final to Tipperary (it lists 1950 for Tipperary as well, and I never noticed the mistake before!). So I was writing earlier in the belief that Kilkenny had won two All-Ireland plus five Leinsters during those years, compared to our two plus four.

Anyway, fairly small point in the overall scheme of things, but thought I'd answer you on it anyway.

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2282 - 22/03/2024 12:53:56    2532636

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Replying To wendellgee:  "Wexford have been hit harder with injuries to key players under 30 than any other team over the last four years. Is it a legacy of the Davy years? How sustainable was what went on in those years.
Ryan, Hanlon, the Recks, Rory and Deeo and Lee all with recurring hamstring/achilles/back injuries.
I think Mogie, Gavin Bailey and the cruciates are in a different category, they seem to be a part and parcel risk of body shape/training and match intensity nowadays.
What does anyone think?"
To be honest I'm not sure anything that went on in the Davy era isn't going on still.

I was talking to a physio about this the other day in fact and he's adamant what we are doing in terms of players particularly inter county is madness across the board and unsustainable in the long run.

More and more games into an ever tightening schedule whilst being amateur and working a day job leaving no time for recovery will lead to more and more serious injuries according to him

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1356 - 22/03/2024 13:18:21    2532639

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Replying To wendellgee:  "Wexford have been hit harder with injuries to key players under 30 than any other team over the last four years. Is it a legacy of the Davy years? How sustainable was what went on in those years.
Ryan, Hanlon, the Recks, Rory and Deeo and Lee all with recurring hamstring/achilles/back injuries.
I think Mogie, Gavin Bailey and the cruciates are in a different category, they seem to be a part and parcel risk of body shape/training and match intensity nowadays.
What does anyone think?"
Agree fully. It's surely more than a coincidence that so many of our key players were dropping like flies over the last few years. I would hazard a guess and say that we sustained more injuries than any other team. Chin, jacko, mogie, Dee, Rory, Flood, Oisin Foley, O'Hanlon, Mac, Richie Lawlor, seems likely that it's the intence training regime that may be the cause. Perhaps the training methods would be in need of examination.
No county team can be expected to go out week after week with so many first team players on the treatment table and hope to be competitive against the top teams, especially when it comes to the cut and thrust of championship hurling.
We done well in the league with what 0 was essentially a young inexperienced team. In the Cork game we capitulated because the young lads couldn't possibly compete against the almost full strength leesiders. That is not an excuse, it's a fact.
If we are missing too many regulars when the leinster championship begins I would be very worried. Hopefully we will have most if not all of the above named back and be competitive in all our games. The league is over and done with for us now and perhaps that is a good thing from our point of view. If we reached a league semi final or final the chances are we would pick up more injuries and would inevitably be in poor shape going forward.

Magpie2 (Wexford) - Posts: 312 - 22/03/2024 13:59:05    2532645

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Replying To Viking66:  "I'm not saying excuses are better than honesty. In all honesty did you think we would beat Cork when the 2 teams were announced just before throw-in? That's not an excuse. That Wexford selection was never going to beat that Cork selection. It's absolutely incredible that so called hurling experts on this forum were surprised by the result to the point they started coming out with all the usual negative #####.
We can speculate why the team was named that way, but we don't know. We don't know who are injured. We don't know how injured they are. Why should Rossiter tell us? The bottom line was we achieved our target for this years League, 1a hurling next year and new players given gametime, which was an achievement in itself bearing in mind the Championship starters we were missing.
As regards the relevance of people on the ground doing more, it's completely relevant. You don't buy intercounty hurlers in Aldi or Tesco. And if the standard of u8-u12 coaching doesn't improve countywide in the clubs we will still be going along as we were. There's top u12 lads in our county who can't strike well off their weaker side for example. That's a huge negative when these lads then end up in u14 development squads."
It's nothing to do with how you or I think we are going to do.

Did I think we would beat cork, no I didn't. But I didn't try and excuse the performance on the basis of "ah we didn't really want to win it anyway" cos that's quite frankly bull! Ye see that's an excuse!

I didn't see anyone really being disappointed with the result in all honesty but people offering an honest opinion on our performance which was poor on the day. There's nothing negative in saying that, it's a fact, it doesn't negate all the other positives we have had this year in admitting that.

And again it's been a successful start to the year imho, but overall imho we really need to stop with the pathetic excuses when things do go awry because it's serves no one or nothing.

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1356 - 22/03/2024 14:13:51    2532650

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Replying To Viking66:  "I'm not saying excuses are better than honesty. In all honesty did you think we would beat Cork when the 2 teams were announced just before throw-in? That's not an excuse. That Wexford selection was never going to beat that Cork selection. It's absolutely incredible that so called hurling experts on this forum were surprised by the result to the point they started coming out with all the usual negative #####.
We can speculate why the team was named that way, but we don't know. We don't know who are injured. We don't know how injured they are. Why should Rossiter tell us? The bottom line was we achieved our target for this years League, 1a hurling next year and new players given gametime, which was an achievement in itself bearing in mind the Championship starters we were missing.
As regards the relevance of people on the ground doing more, it's completely relevant. You don't buy intercounty hurlers in Aldi or Tesco. And if the standard of u8-u12 coaching doesn't improve countywide in the clubs we will still be going along as we were. There's top u12 lads in our county who can't strike well off their weaker side for example. That's a huge negative when these lads then end up in u14 development squads."
I remember watching a documentary on the coaches in Ballyhale Shamrocks on off the ball and they stated they mostly played at C level at underage due to smaller numbers in the parish but their sole focus as coaches during the early teenage years was to make sure kids had all the hurling skills mastered.

They really honed in on top level coaching so kids could master all the skills properly.

Then when the skills were mastered and executed at pace they are able to compete as a club at a higher grade between the ages of 17 and 21.

Past hurler (None) - Posts: 749 - 22/03/2024 14:45:23    2532663

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Replying To tearintom:  "It's nothing to do with how you or I think we are going to do.

Did I think we would beat cork, no I didn't. But I didn't try and excuse the performance on the basis of "ah we didn't really want to win it anyway" cos that's quite frankly bull! Ye see that's an excuse!

I didn't see anyone really being disappointed with the result in all honesty but people offering an honest opinion on our performance which was poor on the day. There's nothing negative in saying that, it's a fact, it doesn't negate all the other positives we have had this year in admitting that.

And again it's been a successful start to the year imho, but overall imho we really need to stop with the pathetic excuses when things do go awry because it's serves no one or nothing."
But if we really wanted to win it why didn't we play Lee Chin? We didn't play him, Richie Lawlor, CBD etc because they have "minor niggles". So we rested them so they wouldn't make themselves worse with the really important games just around the corner. So therefore we didn't really want to win it. If we did those lads would've played. Why do you think we should have wanted to win that game that badly? It was a meaningless game. Why risk players being fit for the Championship?
As regards the 2nd half of your post yes we were poor on the day. And everyone including me said that already. Kevin Foley in particular had an off day and he's been 1 of our best players all year. But some lads were here piling it on, basically writing us off again after that one bad result. Can't you see that that's being unfairly negative to the panel and their management?

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12387 - 22/03/2024 21:47:48    2532722

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Replying To Pikeman96:  "You maybe have me on a technicality re. the 50s.

If you say we reached four All-Irelands in the 50s, then you're obviously using the period 1951 to 1960, and it's actually correct to count 1960 as part of the 50s.

I was looking at the period 1950 to 1959. The actual record in those years is four Leinsters and two All-Irelands for Wexford, and five Leinsters and one All-Ireland for Kilkenny.

But an old records book I have here mistakenly includes 1950 for Kilkenny in the All-Ireland roll of honour, even though they lost that year's final to Tipperary (it lists 1950 for Tipperary as well, and I never noticed the mistake before!). So I was writing earlier in the belief that Kilkenny had won two All-Ireland plus five Leinsters during those years, compared to our two plus four.

Anyway, fairly small point in the overall scheme of things, but thought I'd answer you on it anyway."
We reached all ireland hurling finals in 51,54,55,and 56. We won 2, 55 and 56.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12387 - 22/03/2024 22:15:08    2532729

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Replying To tearintom:  "To be honest I'm not sure anything that went on in the Davy era isn't going on still.

I was talking to a physio about this the other day in fact and he's adamant what we are doing in terms of players particularly inter county is madness across the board and unsustainable in the long run.

More and more games into an ever tightening schedule whilst being amateur and working a day job leaving no time for recovery will lead to more and more serious injuries according to him"
There are definitely too many intercounty games. But that's what the public, and therefore the administrators, want. More games=more revenue.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12387 - 22/03/2024 22:16:37    2532730

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Looks like the U19s lost tonight by 3-18 to 1-15 against Offaly in that new U19 Development League. Wasn't at the game so don't know how much to read into it, the XV that was named to start included three starters from the Minor game against Laois two years ago, one of whom also started the Minor game against Kilkenny last year; no other starters from that Kilkenny game last year were named to start tonight. I'm guessing our best U19s would be with the U20s rather than the Development side but the same is likely true for Offaly

ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 293 - 22/03/2024 22:17:51    2532731

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Replying To Past hurler:  "I remember watching a documentary on the coaches in Ballyhale Shamrocks on off the ball and they stated they mostly played at C level at underage due to smaller numbers in the parish but their sole focus as coaches during the early teenage years was to make sure kids had all the hurling skills mastered.

They really honed in on top level coaching so kids could master all the skills properly.

Then when the skills were mastered and executed at pace they are able to compete as a club at a higher grade between the ages of 17 and 21."
They emphasise all that in the pre teen years also. They had an u10 development team last year, for lads who weren't good enough to be on their u11 panels, something like Ray Harris' rising stars idea. Offer a weaker grade so weaker chaps can get more touches to help their confidence. They are a very innovative club.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12387 - 22/03/2024 22:21:59    2532733

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Replying To ElGranSenor:  "Looks like the U19s lost tonight by 3-18 to 1-15 against Offaly in that new U19 Development League. Wasn't at the game so don't know how much to read into it, the XV that was named to start included three starters from the Minor game against Laois two years ago, one of whom also started the Minor game against Kilkenny last year; no other starters from that Kilkenny game last year were named to start tonight. I'm guessing our best U19s would be with the U20s rather than the Development side but the same is likely true for Offaly"
https://kilkennygaa.ie/2024/03/u19-development-league/

TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 22/03/2024 22:50:12    2532741

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Replying To ElGranSenor:  "Looks like the U19s lost tonight by 3-18 to 1-15 against Offaly in that new U19 Development League. Wasn't at the game so don't know how much to read into it, the XV that was named to start included three starters from the Minor game against Laois two years ago, one of whom also started the Minor game against Kilkenny last year; no other starters from that Kilkenny game last year were named to start tonight. I'm guessing our best U19s would be with the U20s rather than the Development side but the same is likely true for Offaly"
Spoke to a father of one of the team who said Offaly played 6 or 7 lads who will also play U20 whereas Wexford panel is completely separate. His lad is U18 but didn't make starting 15 on minors last year.

wexfordwin (Wexford) - Posts: 145 - 23/03/2024 07:53:28    2532756

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Replying To ElGranSenor:  "Looks like the U19s lost tonight by 3-18 to 1-15 against Offaly in that new U19 Development League. Wasn't at the game so don't know how much to read into it, the XV that was named to start included three starters from the Minor game against Laois two years ago, one of whom also started the Minor game against Kilkenny last year; no other starters from that Kilkenny game last year were named to start tonight. I'm guessing our best U19s would be with the U20s rather than the Development side but the same is likely true for Offaly"
We had lads on that team that didn't play celtic challenge even. It's likely the weakest u19 team of the 4.
The u20s beat Tipp in a challenge game, although they are still way behind where they should be on account of the time taken to sort out a management team for them. Hopefully we never make that mistake again.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12387 - 23/03/2024 08:23:08    2532763

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Was the U20 management team not in place before Christmas? I wonder is less more in this case, I'm not sure all of this training in November/December actually ends up giving teams that big of an edge come summertime plus it gives lads no chance to take some time away from the game and freshen up mentally

ElGranSenor (Wexford) - Posts: 293 - 23/03/2024 10:43:06    2532782

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