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Hopefully when the lads who proposed it start getting minors coming up again next year we won't hear any more about it. You were bang on.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13862 - 11/12/2023 22:43:21 2516409 Link 0 |
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56 votes in favour but 115 votes against, to be precise. The right decision. Thing said most often was that clubs would all have players coming up from 2023 minor grade to 2024 adult grades anyway, so even if they did fall short this year, they won't have that problem next year so long as they hold on to their players. In fairness, changing things on account of how it worked in the one year (this year) when nobody graduated from minor to senior would have been madness. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 12/12/2023 01:30:40 2516419 Link 0 |
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The correct decision. Anything else of interest at convention? wexfordwin (Wexford) - Posts: 186 - 12/12/2023 02:44:47 2516420 Link 0 |
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Anyone able to explain the Shels motion that was passed about being able to regrade players after two rounds of championship to a second team? Is it that if a player plays in the first team in one of there two games, he can be regraded to the second team? alwaysasub (Wexford) - Posts: 444 - 12/12/2023 09:45:56 2516429 Link 0 |
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Spending on county teams went up from 955k to 1.2m seems to similar pattern to most counites with accommodation prices etc. Surplus of 300k or so I think, anyone know what the accounting period was for it? TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 12/12/2023 10:02:44 2516436 Link 0 |
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No. Alot of motions that seemed just procedural in nature. Shels got a motion passed without a count that looked very close to 50/50 tbh but no request for those voting against was asked for. Its not going to make much difference to the majority of clubs tbh though. Good thing the championship format discussion was deferred or we will still be there. Also Mihael Martin alluded to the poor results Wexford clubs have had in Leinster, and it being a result of our championship format, as if it was a contributory reason to our lack of county success, which was a complete red herring. Clubs that have won multiple Leinsters and AIs have had in the main 1 golden generation. In Senior hurling only 3 clubs have won AIs with completely different teams. The 2 Shamrocks and James Stephens. The teams that win these have great teams for a period of time, and it doesn't always follow that their counties teams are great at the same time. Buffers Alley and Rathnure are the only clubs to win multiple Leinsters from Wexford, and had great teams at the time, and we still only won one club all ireland. And in the whole period of club AIs since 1970 we have only won 1 Senior intercounty AI, and no minor or u20/1 ones. In both codes put together. Club success is completely unrelated to intercounty success. Limerick have only 1 club AI won since they started in 1970, yet have 6 intercounty AIs, Tipp only have 2 club AI titles won, as have Clare, and have won 7 and 3 intercounty AI titles respectively. Galway have 13, yet only 4 intercounty AIs in that timeframe. Organising our club championship format in the vague hope that it will help our intercounty team is just nonsense. Going back to alternate weeks or blocks will only suit 1 code clubs, like Vols. And won't suit the vast majority of our players, or their standard of football and hurling, being as most of them are genuinely dual and the 2 games are completely different in skillset. If we are serious about winning AIs in either code down the line then the standard and volume of our underage training and coaching has to improve massively in all clubs, especially at u10s to u14s. S and C has to improve from u14s up in all clubs. All club underage teams need 4 mentors ideally, and should have 2 one hour training sessions a week, preferably for an hour and half, allowing for an in house game for half an hour which is what keeps the young lads interested. The move being discussed to make u12 non competitive would be a disaster for the county's underage standards. If win-at-all-costs managers don't give every boy and girl some gametime, say 15 minutes minimum, in every game, then points should be deducted. I talked to a current referee who is also an underage manager for his club and he agreed, and he said it would be easy for referees to police. Non competitive games will lead to some of the better players just giving up. Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13862 - 12/12/2023 10:10:32 2516438 Link 0 |
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Ended end of September. We spent less than half what Galway spent all the same.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13862 - 12/12/2023 10:13:26 2516440 Link 0 |
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Thought it was a good motion rather than a "ridiculous" one myself, and since it was overwhelmingly passed, seems just about everybody else thought the same. Either way, you have the meaning of it all right. It allows a club to give somebody a chance at a higher grade than they might normally play at, and then if it transpires that he's not really up to it and is not likely to feature regularly at that level, he can drop back down a grade instead of having to sit out every match for the rest of the year. I take your point how it might seem to work against a Junior team like let's say St. Pat's (hurling), if they were to play neighbours Ferns in Round 3 of Junior and Ferns were able to regrade players from their Senior team. However, it would also benefit the likes of St. Pat's for their own second team. Somebody who's normally a Junior B player for them but who got a run during the first couple of rounds of Junior could drop back down to the Junior B team again, instead of them having to do without him for the rest of the year because he got maybe 10 minutes of a run as a sub for their first team. I'd expect some safeguards to be built into the system, though. Maybe either: - Round 3 being scheduled like Round 1, i.e. a club's first team playing first that weekend, and their second/third teams following afterwards, or - CCC having the power to refuse a regarding, if it doesn't seem a genuine one. For example, if Gorey's Juniors were to play Round 3 on a Thursday evening but their Seniors weren't out until the Sunday, they wouldn't be allowed to regrade Conor McDonald, Cathal Dunbar and Charlie McGuckin for that one match, for the sake of picking up a couple of handy points in the Junior championship. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 12/12/2023 10:14:42 2516441 Link 0 |
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The lad speaking for it was wanting the change so that a lad, especially a young lad, who was flying in the League and made the Senior club team, but then wasn't so good at championship when the intensity was raised, could be regraded downwards after 2 games. 3 players max, at the discretion of the CCC, as if they didn't have enough to be doing already. Will be some boot in the stones for any young player it affects down the line, and will likely not help retaining young players making the transition to adult.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13862 - 12/12/2023 10:16:47 2516442 Link 0 |
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Accounting period is the same as for clubs - i.e. it runs from 1st October in one year to 30th September the following year. So for example, the accounts presented last night included income from the closing stages of last year's club football championships (played in October 2022) but not from this year's (played in October 2023). Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 12/12/2023 10:19:03 2516443 Link 0 |
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The St. Joseph's speaker who proposed the motion said they only had 22 or 24 players this year, so they couldn't field a second team without minors. Makes me think though that even if they proposed to play absolutely every single one of their 2024 second year minors, they maybe still wouldn't have enough for two teams. And that in turn makes me think they're maybe a perfect example of the sort of club mentioned here previously, who really should be asking themselves different questions about why they're finding it so hard to attract and retain players. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 12/12/2023 10:23:25 2516447 Link 0 |
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Nothing shocking from the convention that I see? I would like to hear more on how the regrading one will work. The meeting in January on structures will be interesting to see how clubs vote. M Martin seemed to focus on some online abuse during the year last year, I didn't see anything that I remember being bad. Was it an issue at the time? btwex90 (Wexford) - Posts: 27 - 12/12/2023 10:33:01 2516451 Link 0 |
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I disagree it would be a kick in the stones for anybody. There's always been regrading before the start of the championships, so it's not a new concept. This just introduces a second round of it, part-way through. If you're a fringe player with a club's senior team (for example), and you get a run of 10 or 15 minutes in Round 1 or 2, which of these would you prefer? - Having to hang around as a sub with the seniors for the rest of the year, in the hope of getting another run sometime, but knowing that opportunities are likely to be limited? - or being able to drop back down to the Juniors and play away every week until you maybe get an opportunity with the seniors again, after impressing at the lower level? By the way, I notice you said above that the Shels motion seemed to be about 50-50, but there was no call for 'no' votes. From where I was sitting, it looked to be about 75 to 80% 'yes' on the show of hands, and so no need to call for 'no' votes. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 12/12/2023 11:04:59 2516455 Link 0 |
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As far as I can remember there were some blunt enough assessments of our hurling management, and also our "proud hurling supporters", alluded to by Mihael Martin, who turned out in their droves for the home championship game against Westmeath (not), on this. Including from me tbh. I'm not on Twitter FB etc so can't comment on those.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13862 - 12/12/2023 11:10:09 2516457 Link 0 |
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There was a slide on-screen as he spoke about that, showing some posts from Twitter and Facebook that were fairly abusive towards the Chairman himself. And after the Westmeath match in particular, I remember seeing comments on the Wexford GAA Facebook post with the match stats that were very abusive towards Darragh Egan and some of the players. Some focused even on Egan's size and had nothing to do with hurling at all. They were gone an hour or two later, so somebody at the Wexford GAA end of things must have deleted them. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2621 - 12/12/2023 11:20:17 2516460 Link 0 |
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Not sure if it's good or ridiculous as I'm not sure who will benefit or lose out but the Shels speaker seemed to think it impacts a lot of clubs/players? In reality it will only benefit bigger clubs with multiple teams. Speaker said a young lad could be "flying in league for their senior team but then doesn't perform in championship" round 1 or 2 and then "mammy and daddy aren't happy as he on the sideline and not getting games". Shels have several teams so surely that's the clubs issue to deal with and select their players accordingly. I think the only reason it over overwhelmingly passed was that the Shels speaker did a good job at selling it and only focused on the positives and highlighted it would help young players several times and this was shortly after the discussion on under 18 players and people just voted for it without considering it could be abused. There was a lot of confusion in the room. Speaker did mention that the CCC would have the power to refuse a regrade but on what grounds ? If a senior county player twinge's his hamstring 20 mins into first round of senior champ and they don't want to risk him in round 2 the club could regrade him then and let him play at one of the lower grades in round 3 where he'd be able to win a match on one leg for a struggling 2nd/3rd team. If their senior team have won the first 3 rounds at this stage and they don't need him for round 4 he can play round 4 and 5 with junior a/b team and then go back up to play senior 1/4 final ?! As the chair said "you can always go back up!" I'd imagine there will be some controversy with the introduction of this rule later in the year. grassroots01 (Wexford) - Posts: 177 - 12/12/2023 11:33:16 2516465 Link 0 |
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Agree 100% Viking - madness and as you said as if the CCC didn't have enough to be doing already.
grassroots01 (Wexford) - Posts: 177 - 12/12/2023 11:34:30 2516467 Link 0 |
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I'd also add I think some of the stuff even before the Westmeath game was out of order, 1 show on the local radio station asking if there should be a change in management after a 2 point defeat to Dublin was nothing short of tabloid stuff. TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 12/12/2023 11:38:24 2516468 Link 0 |
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I think on those Yes/No votes they should be counted anyway - Yes = 67 - No = 20 etc. and not just "that's passed" - several delegates thought that Shels vote was very close and top table are only leaving themselves open.
grassroots01 (Wexford) - Posts: 177 - 12/12/2023 11:41:55 2516470 Link 0 |
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I was talking to a lad this morning who said there was an image put up showing some of the abuse received by players and the manager and Martin himslef that was pretty bad. Most of it was facebook stuff under South East radio articles. He also called out one co board delegate who tried to be a big lad on local radio.. SE radio defintely went over the top earlier in the year and it seems like they are now doing the same with Wexford County council CEO.
wexfordwin (Wexford) - Posts: 186 - 12/12/2023 11:44:46 2516471 Link 0 |