National Forum

Get Rid Of Hurling League And New Hurling Championship Proposal

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Replying To Viking66:  "How much money will friendlies raise for the Injury fund? Also like many other hurling fans I enjoy the preseason competitions. There were over 12000 people in the Park to see Kilkenny come to town."
You can take money from many other games for injury funds. sure take a percentage from provincial finals, all ireland semis and final like 1/2% and it would generate far more than any pre season competitions

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3571 - 28/03/2023 13:59:21    2467325

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Replying To legendzxix:  "The GAA won't be in a hurry to dismiss league semi-finals when there were good crowds in Limerick and Kilkenny."
I know. Unfortunately short term money seems to matter to some people more than anything else.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12963 - 28/03/2023 14:17:34    2467333

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Replying To Viking66:  "How much money will friendlies raise for the Injury fund? Also like many other hurling fans I enjoy the preseason competitions. There were over 12000 people in the Park to see Kilkenny come to town."
Why not use the games that get far more people attending them and use a percentage of those games income to give to injury funds?

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3571 - 28/03/2023 14:22:26    2467337

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "Ah look, there's no perfect format.
The reason the provincial championships were retained in my proposal was because the counties, and the traditionalists, will fight tooth and nail to keep them.
I think below the top 9, the ability to extend my proposed championship to 7 teams in each group provides everybody with an incentive to grow the game.
I think if hurling's fraternity could be extended to 14-16 counties in a decade, that would be an almighty step forward for the game. Realistically, the game will never spread in to 1/2 of the country no matter how much we wish it would.

We don't want another 40 years of no new champions though so have to provide something better for the middle of the road counties, even if the cream will always rise to the top."
For Westmeath or Antrim to win an AI they need to get more underage hurlers for a start, to increase their pick. Kildare will likely be the next breakthrough county I would be guessing.
You can mess around with formats all you like but you can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear. The middle tier counties need to grow the game within the county and get more players to pick from.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12963 - 28/03/2023 14:22:59    2467338

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To limit the yoyo impact of annual promotion/relegation:
- Have Divs 1 to 6 of 5,6,5,5,6,5 teams.
- 5 team groups only play round robins and in addition to playing teams in neighbouring 6-team div, all complete 10 games.
- No KO, 2 up/down between divs.

omahant (USA) - Posts: 2766 - 28/03/2023 14:27:22    2467341

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "Ah look, there's no perfect format.
The reason the provincial championships were retained in my proposal was because the counties, and the traditionalists, will fight tooth and nail to keep them.
I think below the top 9, the ability to extend my proposed championship to 7 teams in each group provides everybody with an incentive to grow the game.
I think if hurling's fraternity could be extended to 14-16 counties in a decade, that would be an almighty step forward for the game. Realistically, the game will never spread in to 1/2 of the country no matter how much we wish it would.

We don't want another 40 years of no new champions though so have to provide something better for the middle of the road counties, even if the cream will always rise to the top."
While not reading every reply to the original first post, this is a very good proposal, it need not necessarily have to have the current rediculous situation of the All Ireland final in July, that I can't accept. I would like to retain the league in some guise, many minnows it will be the only silverware they will ever win or have a chance of winning.. Current microwaving of the games is shocking and unfair..yes what about the club.. October to December maybe.. Currently it's getting more time than the AI Championships almost..

Fairplayalways (Offaly) - Posts: 1037 - 28/03/2023 14:34:04    2467347

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Replying To ExiledInWex:  "Ah look, there's no perfect format.
The reason the provincial championships were retained in my proposal was because the counties, and the traditionalists, will fight tooth and nail to keep them.
I think below the top 9, the ability to extend my proposed championship to 7 teams in each group provides everybody with an incentive to grow the game.
I think if hurling's fraternity could be extended to 14-16 counties in a decade, that would be an almighty step forward for the game. Realistically, the game will never spread in to 1/2 of the country no matter how much we wish it would.

We don't want another 40 years of no new champions though so have to provide something better for the middle of the road counties, even if the cream will always rise to the top."
Yeah we do agree on more than we disagree on.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4314 - 28/03/2023 14:38:37    2467348

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Replying To Fairplayalways:  "While not reading every reply to the original first post, this is a very good proposal, it need not necessarily have to have the current rediculous situation of the All Ireland final in July, that I can't accept. I would like to retain the league in some guise, many minnows it will be the only silverware they will ever win or have a chance of winning.. Current microwaving of the games is shocking and unfair..yes what about the club.. October to December maybe.. Currently it's getting more time than the AI Championships almost.."
When would you play the club championships then? Go back to knockout intercounty with 3 or 4 weeks between games and the players released back to their clubs for club championship games as happened in the past?

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12963 - 28/03/2023 15:14:42    2467356

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Replying To KillingFields:  "Why not use the games that get far more people attending them and use a percentage of those games income to give to injury funds?"
Because that money goes elsewhere already

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12963 - 28/03/2023 15:15:38    2467358

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Replying To Viking66:  "When would you play the club championships then? Go back to knockout intercounty with 3 or 4 weeks between games and the players released back to their clubs for club championship games as happened in the past?"
Dont go back to straight knock out intercounty. Clubs need to play more games without county players. you cant hold up 99% of players because less than `1% are playing inter county

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3571 - 28/03/2023 15:18:05    2467359

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Replying To Viking66:  "Because that money goes elsewhere already"
Not all of it and a percentage of all ireland semis would bring far more than than the money from these games.

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3571 - 28/03/2023 15:53:26    2467377

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Replying To Viking66:  "How much money will friendlies raise for the Injury fund? Also like many other hurling fans I enjoy the preseason competitions. There were over 12000 people in the Park to see Kilkenny come to town."
For one specific reason though, would be a 5th of that under other circumstances.

As things stand we know have 2 pre seasons comps taking up the majority of the intercounty calendar thats already too short because in reality only a few counties take the league seriously in hurling each year.

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1387 - 28/03/2023 16:12:24    2467384

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Replying To omahant:  "To limit the yoyo impact of annual promotion/relegation:
- Have Divs 1 to 6 of 5,6,5,5,6,5 teams.
- 5 team groups only play round robins and in addition to playing teams in neighbouring 6-team div, all complete 10 games.
- No KO, 2 up/down between divs."
McDonagh Cup teams (Div 3), in addition to playing each other, would also play lower McCarthy Cup teams (Div 2). Those lower McCarthy teams, while not eligible for Div 1 title, would still also play those teams and strive for promotion. Perhaps, one up/down is better, given 5-team divs here.

omahant (USA) - Posts: 2766 - 28/03/2023 16:14:48    2467386

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Replying To KillingFields:  "Dont go back to straight knock out intercounty. Clubs need to play more games without county players. you cant hold up 99% of players because less than `1% are playing inter county"
I wasn't seriously suggesting it. But the OP seems to have forgotten why the final was moved to July in the 1st place!

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12963 - 28/03/2023 17:34:14    2467425

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Replying To omahant:  "McDonagh Cup teams (Div 3), in addition to playing each other, would also play lower McCarthy Cup teams (Div 2). Those lower McCarthy teams, while not eligible for Div 1 title, would still also play those teams and strive for promotion. Perhaps, one up/down is better, given 5-team divs here."
If Kildare and Offaly are promoted to Division 1B and Laois win the McDonagh, Division 1B 2024 would have two McDonagh counties. That would be fair enough in that scenario.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8109 - 28/03/2023 17:37:26    2467430

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Replying To Viking66:  "When would you play the club championships then? Go back to knockout intercounty with 3 or 4 weeks between games and the players released back to their clubs for club championship games as happened in the past?"
As annoying to the new system brigade it may sound yes is my answer to your question, I and many loved the old system but of course money talks now in conjunction with player welfare supposedly so my days of listening to rd 3 of NHL on 1st Sunday in November or later ain't coming back, the club takes too long to run off too in reality, games are postponed as a hurler is playing junior hurling the night before or something.. Panel's are panels for a reason, is it all about "taking part" or winning, we know the answer to that..

Fairplayalways (Offaly) - Posts: 1037 - 28/03/2023 19:37:12    2467463

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The GAA should never go back to rounds of the hurling league played in November.
To me, that was total madness. I never understand people who think that is a solution because they might want to go back and look at the state of the pitches being hurled on even for the club championships.
November and December are not months for hurling and my original proposal has a slow-build to it with pre-season in Feb/March, and then games on thick and fast.

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1226 - 29/03/2023 10:32:56    2467505

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The hurling league can run 3 rounds from early to mid February. The final 2 rounds and final from early to mid March. 6 weekends. 1 rest weekend in-between. 4 rest weekends before championship round robins. Easily done.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8109 - 29/03/2023 12:54:11    2467557

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Replying To legendzxix:  "The hurling league can run 3 rounds from early to mid February. The final 2 rounds and final from early to mid March. 6 weekends. 1 rest weekend in-between. 4 rest weekends before championship round robins. Easily done."
You would have even more challenge matches between the same teams, less isn't more some times

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1226 - 05/04/2023 15:01:33    2469084

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Now that the complaints are coming thick and fast, is this structure in the first post inevitable? Winning the provinical championship gets you seeded in the draw, but after that if you are good enough prove it.

ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1226 - 04/05/2023 10:25:08    2475582

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