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Carlow GAA thread

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Since the split season came

- Bagenalstown and Ballinkillen have reached county finals.
- Naomh Brid have returned to senior.
- Kildavin/Clonegal reformed and won Junior title.
- Burren Rangers reaching a Junior final and making huge progress at underage.

Amazed how quickly people forget the state of club hurling in Carlow back in the 2010's. More lads are now playing hurling than there has been in a long time. We've seen real progress in a very small amount of time, why risk throwing that away so that the County Champions have a slightly better chance of competing in Leinster?

TaosHum (Carlow) - Posts: 234 - 13/11/2023 08:02:45    2512626

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I understand Wexford are going back to the old structure, where it's 2 weeks hurling, 2 weeks football.

Repeat1944 (Carlow) - Posts: 4 - 13/11/2023 09:36:25    2512632

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Replying To Overthebar53:  "This new split season is a mirage. The exact same pertains in carlow and lots of other counties as did before this new measure. I don't see any benefit in it at all. On the contrary it's a huge disadvantage to counties like carlow and doing nothing to promote games."
A mirage?

You are implying that the season is not split and we are all imagining it?

As for your point about " doing nothing to promote games"

Since it was introduced, St Mullins have gone from not playing football at all to winning three successive championships.

Meanwhile, hurling now has six senior clubs - it only had four a few years ago - Kildavin are back hurling and Carlow Town are in an under 20 final, following years of decline. Not to mention the individual improvement in Naomh Brid. Bagenalstown and the rise of Burren Rangers.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 554 - 13/11/2023 11:31:11    2512661

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Replying To Repeat1944:  "I understand Wexford are going back to the old structure, where it's 2 weeks hurling, 2 weeks football."
Good for Wexford. Almost every club there is dual. Carlow is a totally different situation.

Naomh Brid, Ballinkillen, Naomh Eoin, Burren Rangers, Carlow Town all pull from football clubs they are not directly linked to.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 554 - 13/11/2023 11:32:42    2512662

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Replying To TaosHum:  "Since the split season came

- Bagenalstown and Ballinkillen have reached county finals.
- Naomh Brid have returned to senior.
- Kildavin/Clonegal reformed and won Junior title.
- Burren Rangers reaching a Junior final and making huge progress at underage.

Amazed how quickly people forget the state of club hurling in Carlow back in the 2010's. More lads are now playing hurling than there has been in a long time. We've seen real progress in a very small amount of time, why risk throwing that away so that the County Champions have a slightly better chance of competing in Leinster?"
100%. And given our county team is so reliant on two clubs, it's not really in the county's *collective* interests that MLR and Mullins go deep into winter.

We need them fully-focussed on the county team. Especially next year, given the step up.

Sorry if it sounds selfish to people from those clubs. But it's true.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 554 - 13/11/2023 11:34:52    2512663

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Replying To TaosHum:  "Since the split season came

- Bagenalstown and Ballinkillen have reached county finals.
- Naomh Brid have returned to senior.
- Kildavin/Clonegal reformed and won Junior title.
- Burren Rangers reaching a Junior final and making huge progress at underage.

Amazed how quickly people forget the state of club hurling in Carlow back in the 2010's. More lads are now playing hurling than there has been in a long time. We've seen real progress in a very small amount of time, why risk throwing that away so that the County Champions have a slightly better chance of competing in Leinster?"
It's growing hurling at the expense of football though. The football league ends in May and championship doesn't start until late August, and then it's all over in 5 weeks. It's incredibly damaging to football, it needs to go back to 2 weeks on 2 weeks off.

Barrowsider (Carlow) - Posts: 1542 - 13/11/2023 11:41:42    2512668

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Replying To Barrowsider:  "It's growing hurling at the expense of football though. The football league ends in May and championship doesn't start until late August, and then it's all over in 5 weeks. It's incredibly damaging to football, it needs to go back to 2 weeks on 2 weeks off."
Don't understand how trying to level up hurling is damaging football. It's not a zero sum game.

The GAA's mission is to. promote both codes.

If footballers feel let out in July and August,, there's nothing to stop them picking up a hurl.

Just as St Mullins dusted of the big ball to occupy their time in September and October.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 554 - 13/11/2023 12:30:42    2512684

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Replying To Barrowsider:  "It's growing hurling at the expense of football though. The football league ends in May and championship doesn't start until late August, and then it's all over in 5 weeks. It's incredibly damaging to football, it needs to go back to 2 weeks on 2 weeks off."
incredibly damaging? How? MLR and St Mullins have benefited greatly from it. 43 teams over 5 divisions competed in their respective grads. What's been damaged exactly?

TaosHum (Carlow) - Posts: 234 - 13/11/2023 14:28:59    2512722

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Replying To CARPS:  "Don't understand how trying to level up hurling is damaging football. It's not a zero sum game.

The GAA's mission is to. promote both codes.

If footballers feel let out in July and August,, there's nothing to stop them picking up a hurl.

Just as St Mullins dusted of the big ball to occupy their time in September and October."
Why is hurling always first? and I don't buy the excuse thats it's to do with the weather and the conditions, footballers prefer to play football on a dry day too.
If you want more footballers to play hurling, why not play it after the football season? Players from EO or Tinryland or Pal etc havent committed to Carlow Town Hurling because they are preparing for a senior football championship in a couple of weeks. If their championship was over, I could see a few of them committing to hurling then, just like St Mullins did the last few years.
Do we want more football in St Mullins or more hurling in Carlow town?

Repeat1944 (Carlow) - Posts: 4 - 13/11/2023 14:45:37    2512726

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Replying To CARPS:  "Don't understand how trying to level up hurling is damaging football. It's not a zero sum game.

The GAA's mission is to. promote both codes.

If footballers feel let out in July and August,, there's nothing to stop them picking up a hurl.

Just as St Mullins dusted of the big ball to occupy their time in September and October."
Of course the larger sport should get the premium time, that's what brings in the money kill that and you won't be able to promote the other. At the very least go back to 2 weeks on 2 off. If not rotate who goes first. This compact championship season is bad a minor injury in the first game and your season is likely over. Its harder on the pocket for supporters too with weekly games. Mlr posted above the long lay off effected them I'm sure the same is the case for football teams not getting a competitive game in 3 months

Barrowsider (Carlow) - Posts: 1542 - 13/11/2023 14:55:29    2512732

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Replying To Barrowsider:  "Of course the larger sport should get the premium time, that's what brings in the money kill that and you won't be able to promote the other. At the very least go back to 2 weeks on 2 off. If not rotate who goes first. This compact championship season is bad a minor injury in the first game and your season is likely over. Its harder on the pocket for supporters too with weekly games. Mlr posted above the long lay off effected them I'm sure the same is the case for football teams not getting a competitive game in 3 months"
Football brings in the money? Have you ever looked at the county board's accounts? Clearly not.

Did you ever think that if we continue the current system for a decade the two codes might level up?

Wouldn't that be great? Or you just want football to go back to the old dominance it had?

So shortsighted.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 554 - 13/11/2023 15:37:19    2512755

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Replying To Repeat1944:  "Why is hurling always first? and I don't buy the excuse thats it's to do with the weather and the conditions, footballers prefer to play football on a dry day too.
If you want more footballers to play hurling, why not play it after the football season? Players from EO or Tinryland or Pal etc havent committed to Carlow Town Hurling because they are preparing for a senior football championship in a couple of weeks. If their championship was over, I could see a few of them committing to hurling then, just like St Mullins did the last few years.
Do we want more football in St Mullins or more hurling in Carlow town?"
Because football is less weather dependent than hurling.

If footballers are preparing for a football championship over summer, what's the problem?

They have a choice, they can prepare for football or they can play hurling.

If you flip the codes, the footballers won't go hurling in September/October. They will go off playing soccer. You're hardly that naive?

ps. when football was played in August, clubs were whinging about lads being on holidays. Trying to get games called off. So if anything the September/October season suits schedules better.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 554 - 13/11/2023 15:39:55    2512757

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Replying To TaosHum:  "incredibly damaging? How? MLR and St Mullins have benefited greatly from it. 43 teams over 5 divisions competed in their respective grads. What's been damaged exactly?"
Not just MLR and St Mullins.

Bagenalstown too. And Naomh Brid, Ballinkillen and Fenagh. Naomh Eoin, Kildavin.

Not to mention, Burren Rangers - the growing success story.

Calling to go back to the old ways is troglodyte stuff.

What we should be trying to do is get hurling going properly in the Rathvilly-Tullow-Hacketstown area, and sort it out in Carlow town and Palatine/Tinryland.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 554 - 13/11/2023 15:43:09    2512760

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Replying To TaosHum:  "incredibly damaging? How? MLR and St Mullins have benefited greatly from it. 43 teams over 5 divisions competed in their respective grads. What's been damaged exactly?"
The fact that you basically have two football seasons in the one year, that's what the summer gap gives you. A season should be continuous not with a 3 months break. The football championships are suffering as a result.

Barrowsider (Carlow) - Posts: 1542 - 13/11/2023 16:18:18    2512777

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Replying To CARPS:  "Football brings in the money? Have you ever looked at the county board's accounts? Clearly not.

Did you ever think that if we continue the current system for a decade the two codes might level up?

Wouldn't that be great? Or you just want football to go back to the old dominance it had?

So shortsighted."
So you're saying that the vast majority of gate receipts are not from football?
What would be so great about them being level?
I only see benefits for hurling, getting prime summer time window for their championship, because hurling needs good weather, all field sports need good weather, it should go back to how it was same with under 20s, as far as I know this year the football 20s final is pencilled in for new years eve, football is just an after thought

Barrowsider (Carlow) - Posts: 1542 - 13/11/2023 16:25:12    2512781

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Replying To Barrowsider:  "So you're saying that the vast majority of gate receipts are not from football?
What would be so great about them being level?
I only see benefits for hurling, getting prime summer time window for their championship, because hurling needs good weather, all field sports need good weather, it should go back to how it was same with under 20s, as far as I know this year the football 20s final is pencilled in for new years eve, football is just an after thought"
The county board's main income is NOT gate receipts from local games. Thank God for that, or they'd be broke.

How many domestic games, in both codes, attract more than 2,500 paying spectators a year?

Having them level will screw Naomh Brid, Kildavin, Carlow Town and Burren Rangers in hurling. And is unfair on Naomh Eoin, MLR, Fenagh/Ballinkillen and Bagenalstown players.

It punishes dual players.

It will also kill the football revival in St Mullins.

Better if football clubs instead start hurling.

Like maybe Eire Og could get the ball rolling by entering a junior team next year?

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 554 - 13/11/2023 17:55:31    2512804

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Replying To Barrowsider:  "The fact that you basically have two football seasons in the one year, that's what the summer gap gives you. A season should be continuous not with a 3 months break. The football championships are suffering as a result."
That's an inconvenience more than damaging imo. Ending up with a Championship of 4 teams because players aren't able to commit to both is what I would consider damaging.

Carlow just doesn't have enough players for week on week off. Duel clubs in Carlow aren't in a position like Naas or Kilmacud where they have very little overlap between the codes. Lads get pressured into focusing on football only (apart from hurling first clubs), especially in amalgamated clubs or just don't have the time to commit to both.

This all boils down to the big clubs up North, who have wrongly offered absolutely no outlet for kids to play hurling within their clubs, not being happy with the break. Week on week off is also a massive advantage to them, as A) They are largely unaffected by it and B) It weakens clubs having to juggle both.

Why should they get that advantage, when clubs that promote both codes have to just get on oh it?

Why can't the football league be home and away, to extend it further and allow intercounty players to come back in for the second half of it? There was a 3 week break between EO winning SFC and first round of Leinster, they could shorten that to two and throw in another bye week.

TaosHum (Carlow) - Posts: 234 - 14/11/2023 08:12:36    2512847

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Replying To TaosHum:  "That's an inconvenience more than damaging imo. Ending up with a Championship of 4 teams because players aren't able to commit to both is what I would consider damaging.

Carlow just doesn't have enough players for week on week off. Duel clubs in Carlow aren't in a position like Naas or Kilmacud where they have very little overlap between the codes. Lads get pressured into focusing on football only (apart from hurling first clubs), especially in amalgamated clubs or just don't have the time to commit to both.

This all boils down to the big clubs up North, who have wrongly offered absolutely no outlet for kids to play hurling within their clubs, not being happy with the break. Week on week off is also a massive advantage to them, as A) They are largely unaffected by it and B) It weakens clubs having to juggle both.

Why should they get that advantage, when clubs that promote both codes have to just get on oh it?

Why can't the football league be home and away, to extend it further and allow intercounty players to come back in for the second half of it? There was a 3 week break between EO winning SFC and first round of Leinster, they could shorten that to two and throw in another bye week."
Very well said.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 554 - 14/11/2023 10:00:43    2512855

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Replying To TaosHum:  "That's an inconvenience more than damaging imo. Ending up with a Championship of 4 teams because players aren't able to commit to both is what I would consider damaging.

Carlow just doesn't have enough players for week on week off. Duel clubs in Carlow aren't in a position like Naas or Kilmacud where they have very little overlap between the codes. Lads get pressured into focusing on football only (apart from hurling first clubs), especially in amalgamated clubs or just don't have the time to commit to both.

This all boils down to the big clubs up North, who have wrongly offered absolutely no outlet for kids to play hurling within their clubs, not being happy with the break. Week on week off is also a massive advantage to them, as A) They are largely unaffected by it and B) It weakens clubs having to juggle both.

Why should they get that advantage, when clubs that promote both codes have to just get on oh it?

Why can't the football league be home and away, to extend it further and allow intercounty players to come back in for the second half of it? There was a 3 week break between EO winning SFC and first round of Leinster, they could shorten that to two and throw in another bye week."
Excellent Post

Dualclub1 (Carlow) - Posts: 276 - 14/11/2023 10:18:23    2512865

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Replying To TaosHum:  "That's an inconvenience more than damaging imo. Ending up with a Championship of 4 teams because players aren't able to commit to both is what I would consider damaging.

Carlow just doesn't have enough players for week on week off. Duel clubs in Carlow aren't in a position like Naas or Kilmacud where they have very little overlap between the codes. Lads get pressured into focusing on football only (apart from hurling first clubs), especially in amalgamated clubs or just don't have the time to commit to both.

This all boils down to the big clubs up North, who have wrongly offered absolutely no outlet for kids to play hurling within their clubs, not being happy with the break. Week on week off is also a massive advantage to them, as A) They are largely unaffected by it and B) It weakens clubs having to juggle both.

Why should they get that advantage, when clubs that promote both codes have to just get on oh it?

Why can't the football league be home and away, to extend it further and allow intercounty players to come back in for the second half of it? There was a 3 week break between EO winning SFC and first round of Leinster, they could shorten that to two and throw in another bye week."
I'm just saying that in other counties where one sport is bigger that usually takes precedence, it appears we do the opposite, I'm lead to believe the reason we haven't made a decision on going back to even ages is that we are waiting to see what kilkenny does as our underage hurlers play there, if that's true its absolutely scandalous. Underage football fixtures get moved in Carlow to accommodate kilkenny underage hurling games I know that to be a fact again an absolute scandalous scenario, no matter what our fixtures should come first regardless of the code.

I agree with you that clubs in the North of the county should be hurling I think every club should dual, I think mlr have done fairly well under the old system so have bagenalstown, naomh eoin were always able to manage it. There could be potential damage to burren rangers and cthc if the old system returned, but that's down to them being stand alone clubs again. That could be solved

Barrowsider (Carlow) - Posts: 1542 - 14/11/2023 11:09:20    2512905

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