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Longford GAA thread

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Replying To Therein2010:  "It's the club that the player is registered with. All Wolfe Tones players are registered by Mostrim. The Sean Connollys and Carrickedmond lads that have derogation to play Hurling with Wolfe Tones are similarly registered by the home club."
What relevance is that to a match programme??? Westmeath have loads of dual players but you'll never see a football club on a county hurling programme there! Imagine seeing Corofin under Daithí Burke's name instead of his hurling club on a Galway hurling programme???

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4026 - 31/01/2022 16:28:23    2397547

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Replying To LongfordgaaAbú:  "Do we really have a good record against Louth? Maybe in last couple of games, but not overall.

This century we played Louth 4 times in Leinster Championship.
Won 2, Lost 2.

This century we played Louth 6 times in League.
Won 2, Lost 4.

I'm not convinced we can beat Louth. If we get more than two wins in the division I will be pleasantly surprised. Our average achievement of ~ 4th place finish in Division 3 since 2016 might be a stretch to achieve this season. Will struggle to stay up IMO. It is part decisions on sideline for sure, but also part not good enough on the field. I struggled with the optimism around the place about this season. Football quality regressed in the county in last few years. The historically mega annihilation by Meath is still fresh in the mind. I will be delighted to be proved wrong next day out."
Its recent form that matters. I wouldn't be backing on team based on something that they did 20 years ago.

I agree the standard in the club championship has slipped. I think that is because of a large number of reasons but there is no team in Division 3 that has a senior club championship that is any great level above Longfords. Mullinachta and Killoe would do well in any county in Ireland. There is another tier of clubs that would be competitive and there is probably a number of clubs at the bottom that would be intermediate in any other county. There are 21 clubs in the county and more than half are playing senior, that is part of the issue but a completely different debate.

Colm Keyes had an article in the Irish Independent last week where he looked at league form over the last 10 years. Longford averaged out at 5th in Division 3. Considering they have been in Division 4 during this time its not too bad. Longford need to push on though. The quality of player is there to do better, and better is relative, but you need the county board to be something similar to what Offaly have at the minute and you need the right management team. Adding Eugene McCormack to the set-up certainly helps but the rest is not up to standard.

You could well be right about Longford only winning two games but we have already lost one we would be expected to win and had the players to win but it bad result stemmed from a bad decision by a county board appointing someone who was not qualified for the job and then in turn bad decisions by him losing us the game.

Mull93 (Longford) - Posts: 83 - 31/01/2022 20:59:00    2397605

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Replying To Mull93:  "Its recent form that matters. I wouldn't be backing on team based on something that they did 20 years ago.

I agree the standard in the club championship has slipped. I think that is because of a large number of reasons but there is no team in Division 3 that has a senior club championship that is any great level above Longfords. Mullinachta and Killoe would do well in any county in Ireland. There is another tier of clubs that would be competitive and there is probably a number of clubs at the bottom that would be intermediate in any other county. There are 21 clubs in the county and more than half are playing senior, that is part of the issue but a completely different debate.

Colm Keyes had an article in the Irish Independent last week where he looked at league form over the last 10 years. Longford averaged out at 5th in Division 3. Considering they have been in Division 4 during this time its not too bad. Longford need to push on though. The quality of player is there to do better, and better is relative, but you need the county board to be something similar to what Offaly have at the minute and you need the right management team. Adding Eugene McCormack to the set-up certainly helps but the rest is not up to standard.

You could well be right about Longford only winning two games but we have already lost one we would be expected to win and had the players to win but it bad result stemmed from a bad decision by a county board appointing someone who was not qualified for the job and then in turn bad decisions by him losing us the game."
This is our League form over the past 10 years...

2021: Division 3N = 4th (W0, D1, L1)
2020: Division 3 = 4th (W3, D1, L3)
2019: Division 3 = 5th (W3, D1, L3)
2018: Division 3 = 3rd (W4, D1, L2)
2017: Division 3 = 6th (W2, D1, L4)
2016: Division 3 = 4th (W4, D0, L3)
2015: Division 4 = 1st (W7, D1, L0)
2014: Division 3 = 7th (W2, D0, L5)
2013: Division 2 = 8th (W0, D0, L7)
2012: Division 3 = 1st (W7, D1, L0)

So we have survived by winning just 2 games before, so fingers crossed. I'm not sure I agree that Mullinalaghta and Killoe would do well in any county, a few counties yes, but would not keep up in many others. Our memories are fogged a bit by the great Leinster club success of Mullinalaghta, but in reality the 2021 county final was the worst i have ever seen, the 2020 and 2019 finals were largely forgettable and the Mullinalaghta v Abbeylara years burned the eyes out of most spectators, such was the lack of quality football on display (great achievements for the clubs but not quality football). There isn't enough quality at the moment. A few great players (as we always had), but not enough to make steady progress. I don't lay it all at the managers door. He just got here, and admittedly made some screw-ups on Saturday. But the core of the challenge predates him and the solution lies in investment way back down the tracks in Schools and Coiste na nOg (which some are trying to address to be fair to them, but it needs much more investment & resource). We are not actively building for success (or if we are it is too late in the cycle when we do it). Instead we are mostly hoping that clubs randomly birth the quality needed. That might be unfair to those involved, but that is certainly how it feels as a spectator.

LongfordgaaAbú (Longford) - Posts: 178 - 01/02/2022 13:01:07    2397690

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Replying To Mull93:  "Its recent form that matters. I wouldn't be backing on team based on something that they did 20 years ago.

I agree the standard in the club championship has slipped. I think that is because of a large number of reasons but there is no team in Division 3 that has a senior club championship that is any great level above Longfords. Mullinachta and Killoe would do well in any county in Ireland. There is another tier of clubs that would be competitive and there is probably a number of clubs at the bottom that would be intermediate in any other county. There are 21 clubs in the county and more than half are playing senior, that is part of the issue but a completely different debate.

Colm Keyes had an article in the Irish Independent last week where he looked at league form over the last 10 years. Longford averaged out at 5th in Division 3. Considering they have been in Division 4 during this time its not too bad. Longford need to push on though. The quality of player is there to do better, and better is relative, but you need the county board to be something similar to what Offaly have at the minute and you need the right management team. Adding Eugene McCormack to the set-up certainly helps but the rest is not up to standard.

You could well be right about Longford only winning two games but we have already lost one we would be expected to win and had the players to win but it bad result stemmed from a bad decision by a county board appointing someone who was not qualified for the job and then in turn bad decisions by him losing us the game."
It's been a shambles from day one. The county board have some serious questions to answer

williesboy (Leitrim) - Posts: 190 - 01/02/2022 15:05:51    2397741

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In fairness to the new manager, he was the last appointee in the country. Glad to see Eugene McCormack in there now.

The problem as I see it is from U20 down at club level there's only Clonguish, Killoe & the Colmcille amalgamation playing at high level. County development squads are destroying the smaller clubs who can't field without their strongest players.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4026 - 01/02/2022 19:03:38    2397808

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Replying To keeper7:  "In fairness to the new manager, he was the last appointee in the country. Glad to see Eugene McCormack in there now.

The problem as I see it is from U20 down at club level there's only Clonguish, Killoe & the Colmcille amalgamation playing at high level. County development squads are destroying the smaller clubs who can't field without their strongest players."
Slashers are strong in underage too, as is the Clonbroney / Wolfe Tones amalgamation (not sure Colmcille has won a major underage title in almost a decade - did you mean the Clonbroney amalgamation?). But the main point on lack of enough strong clubs in underage (as opposed to super amalgamations) is an important one. I see there is a new U16 competition starting. Are Co Board returning to the even numbered competitions or is this an extra one?

LongfordgaaAbú (Longford) - Posts: 178 - 02/02/2022 11:19:48    2397882

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Replying To LongfordgaaAbú:  "Slashers are strong in underage too, as is the Clonbroney / Wolfe Tones amalgamation (not sure Colmcille has won a major underage title in almost a decade - did you mean the Clonbroney amalgamation?). But the main point on lack of enough strong clubs in underage (as opposed to super amalgamations) is an important one. I see there is a new U16 competition starting. Are Co Board returning to the even numbered competitions or is this an extra one?"
Slashers & Wolfe Tones/Clonbroney are operating in Div. 2 & B championship at U17 since last year, I believe.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4026 - 02/02/2022 12:13:49    2397911

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" Are Co Board returning to the even numbered competitions or is this an extra one?"

This is an extra one. They're trying to play every individual age group from U12 up.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4026 - 02/02/2022 12:16:28    2397914

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Replying To keeper7:  "Slashers & Wolfe Tones/Clonbroney are operating in Div. 2 & B championship at U17 since last year, I believe."
I believe the underage Division 1 teams last season were...

U13 Division 1
Clonguish
St. Francis
Longford Slashers
Granard
Northern Gaels **
Southern Gaels **

U15 Division 1
Clonguish
Killoe
Carrick Sarsfields **
St. Colmcilles / St. Francis **

U17 Division 1
Clonguish
Killoe
St. Colmcilles / St. Francis **
Clonbroney Wolfe Tones **
Carrick Sarsfields **

(** means more than one club)

So across the three divisions, Clonguish was the only single 'club' in all three top flights. Colmcille competed in all three divisions as part of an amalgamation with Dromard. Not sure if that is continuing this year or not. I can't recall who got promoted or relegated so not sure of this years Division 1 lists.

LongfordgaaAbú (Longford) - Posts: 178 - 03/02/2022 13:28:51    2398117

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Replying To LongfordgaaAbú:  "I believe the underage Division 1 teams last season were...

U13 Division 1
Clonguish
St. Francis
Longford Slashers
Granard
Northern Gaels **
Southern Gaels **

U15 Division 1
Clonguish
Killoe
Carrick Sarsfields **
St. Colmcilles / St. Francis **

U17 Division 1
Clonguish
Killoe
St. Colmcilles / St. Francis **
Clonbroney Wolfe Tones **
Carrick Sarsfields **

(** means more than one club)

So across the three divisions, Clonguish was the only single 'club' in all three top flights. Colmcille competed in all three divisions as part of an amalgamation with Dromard. Not sure if that is continuing this year or not. I can't recall who got promoted or relegated so not sure of this years Division 1 lists."
Would find it hard to believe that Killoe aren't able to play at all age groups, but am open to correction all the same

keepitlit (Longford) - Posts: 9 - 03/02/2022 14:37:04    2398139

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Replying To keepitlit:  "Would find it hard to believe that Killoe aren't able to play at all age groups, but am open to correction all the same"
Killoe may have been in Div 2 at U13.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4026 - 03/02/2022 15:03:41    2398150

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Replying To LongfordgaaAbú:  "I believe the underage Division 1 teams last season were...

U13 Division 1
Clonguish
St. Francis
Longford Slashers
Granard
Northern Gaels **
Southern Gaels **

U15 Division 1
Clonguish
Killoe
Carrick Sarsfields **
St. Colmcilles / St. Francis **

U17 Division 1
Clonguish
Killoe
St. Colmcilles / St. Francis **
Clonbroney Wolfe Tones **
Carrick Sarsfields **

(** means more than one club)

So across the three divisions, Clonguish was the only single 'club' in all three top flights. Colmcille competed in all three divisions as part of an amalgamation with Dromard. Not sure if that is continuing this year or not. I can't recall who got promoted or relegated so not sure of this years Division 1 lists."
I think that amalgamation is Colmcille/Dromard AND Ballymore.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4026 - 03/02/2022 15:11:28    2398154

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Replying To keeper7:  "I think that amalgamation is Colmcille/Dromard AND Ballymore."
Nope! Some players from Ballymore have been granted derogation to play with the Colmcille/St. Francis amalgamation, but the Ballymore club is not part of that amalgamation.

LongfordgaaAbú (Longford) - Posts: 178 - 03/02/2022 15:35:32    2398159

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Any team news for the match Sunday, will Longford be at full strength?

keepitlit (Longford) - Posts: 9 - 03/02/2022 15:38:04    2398161

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Replying To LongfordgaaAbú:  "Nope! Some players from Ballymore have been granted derogation to play with the Colmcille/St. Francis amalgamation, but the Ballymore club is not part of that amalgamation."
Seeing as Ballymore aren't fielding on their own at underage (U13/15/17) that means all their eligible are being derogated to play for the amalgamation.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4026 - 03/02/2022 15:59:04    2398168

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Replying To keeper7:  "Seeing as Ballymore aren't fielding on their own at underage (U13/15/17) that means all their eligible are being derogated to play for the amalgamation."
Yes, their players are all derogated to play for Colmcille. Colmcille amalgamates with St. Francis for some (not all) competitions. Hence in that context they play in the amalgamation, wearing their derogated Colmcille hat.

LongfordgaaAbú (Longford) - Posts: 178 - 03/02/2022 16:55:35    2398181

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Replying To LongfordgaaAbú:  "Yes, their players are all derogated to play for Colmcille. Colmcille amalgamates with St. Francis for some (not all) competitions. Hence in that context they play in the amalgamation, wearing their derogated Colmcille hat."
Sound. Made more sense when they were amalgamated with Granard, in my opinion.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4026 - 03/02/2022 17:52:00    2398201

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Replying To Mull93:  "Its recent form that matters. I wouldn't be backing on team based on something that they did 20 years ago.

I agree the standard in the club championship has slipped. I think that is because of a large number of reasons but there is no team in Division 3 that has a senior club championship that is any great level above Longfords. Mullinachta and Killoe would do well in any county in Ireland. There is another tier of clubs that would be competitive and there is probably a number of clubs at the bottom that would be intermediate in any other county. There are 21 clubs in the county and more than half are playing senior, that is part of the issue but a completely different debate.

Colm Keyes had an article in the Irish Independent last week where he looked at league form over the last 10 years. Longford averaged out at 5th in Division 3. Considering they have been in Division 4 during this time its not too bad. Longford need to push on though. The quality of player is there to do better, and better is relative, but you need the county board to be something similar to what Offaly have at the minute and you need the right management team. Adding Eugene McCormack to the set-up certainly helps but the rest is not up to standard.

You could well be right about Longford only winning two games but we have already lost one we would be expected to win and had the players to win but it bad result stemmed from a bad decision by a county board appointing someone who was not qualified for the job and then in turn bad decisions by him losing us the game."
you have had your heart set on billy being a failure from the outset. last week was not good but he cant be to blame all by himself, eugene mccormack is part of the set up too as is declan flaherty.

not sure off the relevance of the listing of the underage teams. there was never a time where there was ever more then three strong competitive minor teams. the weakness of the majority of clubs now is nothing new. amalgamations have been winning underage titles for years. i did think there was a good spread of clubs in the different underage finals this year but of course when i went to check there is no where to find them.

slasher9 (Longford) - Posts: 150 - 04/02/2022 12:52:32    2398303

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Replying To slasher9:  "you have had your heart set on billy being a failure from the outset. last week was not good but he cant be to blame all by himself, eugene mccormack is part of the set up too as is declan flaherty.

not sure off the relevance of the listing of the underage teams. there was never a time where there was ever more then three strong competitive minor teams. the weakness of the majority of clubs now is nothing new. amalgamations have been winning underage titles for years. i did think there was a good spread of clubs in the different underage finals this year but of course when i went to check there is no where to find them."
Amalgamations haven't won as much as you might think. Of the 70 or more minor championships played over the years, amalgamations won 7 times (10%). I'm not assuming Northern Gaels to be an amalgamation in the traditional sense - if you do assume they are, it increases to ~15%, which is still small. If you focus on the last 5 years, amalgamations only won 1 of past 5 minor championships.

The numbers for Juvenile and Under 14 are even smaller again. The vast vast majority of underage A Championships (including in last 5 years) were won by single clubs, not superclubs or amalgamations. Killoe and Clonguish have had the lions share in recent years (Northern Gaels before that), but that will pass and others will step up and take over. I remember not that long ago when Clonguish or Killoe couldn't win a decent underage title in a fit!!! So it comes and goes.

The teams involved in underage A Championship finals last year (according to FB) were:

Under 19: Killoe beat Clonguish
Minor: Clonguish beat Colmcille/St. Francis
Juvenile: Clonguish beat Killoe
Under 13: Granard beat St. Vincents

On the county side, I'm prepared to give Billy this season to figure things out, once we don't get relegated.

LongfordgaaAbú (Longford) - Posts: 178 - 04/02/2022 17:07:50    2398335

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Replying To LongfordgaaAbú:  "Amalgamations haven't won as much as you might think. Of the 70 or more minor championships played over the years, amalgamations won 7 times (10%). I'm not assuming Northern Gaels to be an amalgamation in the traditional sense - if you do assume they are, it increases to ~15%, which is still small. If you focus on the last 5 years, amalgamations only won 1 of past 5 minor championships.

The numbers for Juvenile and Under 14 are even smaller again. The vast vast majority of underage A Championships (including in last 5 years) were won by single clubs, not superclubs or amalgamations. Killoe and Clonguish have had the lions share in recent years (Northern Gaels before that), but that will pass and others will step up and take over. I remember not that long ago when Clonguish or Killoe couldn't win a decent underage title in a fit!!! So it comes and goes.

The teams involved in underage A Championship finals last year (according to FB) were:

Under 19: Killoe beat Clonguish
Minor: Clonguish beat Colmcille/St. Francis
Juvenile: Clonguish beat Killoe
Under 13: Granard beat St. Vincents

On the county side, I'm prepared to give Billy this season to figure things out, once we don't get relegated."
Tomorrow is a must win.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4026 - 05/02/2022 14:23:51    2398411

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