National Forum

Should Unvaccinated Fans Be Allowed Into Croke Park?

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post


Replying To DUALSUPPORT:  "My answer to the original question on this thread is yes unvaccinated should be allowed attend Croke Park and other events. It's someone personal choice if they take the covid vaccinations as these vaccines wether people want to admit it or not have being rushed through and haven't gone through the full process of trails and experimentation, I have talked to a medical profession and to a scientific researcher for advice who are not taking the vaccine either. When these vaccines are fully trailed and tested I'll get mine, until then call me what ye want I don't care. If these vaccines are the silver bullet for the virus, well then the vaccinated population have nothing to fear from the unvaccinated population."
Well, unvaccinated people are contributing greatly to the emergence of new variants so when your decision has the potential to affect other peoples health and a continuance of restrictions then I'm sorry but I think the majority should have the right to decide whether to share their space with an unvaccinated variant factory or not.

There are no vaccines or medications without the potential of side effects.

Explain clearly what you mean by "fully trialed and tested".

As for your supposed conversation with a medical professional and a scientific researcher, unless you can name them it's pure uncorroborated hearsay.

I do accept peoples right not to get vaccinated but people who wish not to get vaccinated must also accept that those who are vaccinated also have the right to protect themselves from variants which may break through the protective barrier of their initial vaccination and the driving force behind the emergence of new variants are the unvaccinated.

AfricanGael (UK) - Posts: 1946 - 29/08/2021 18:20:42    2376097

Link

Replying To BarneyGrant:  "
Replying To timmyhogan:  "[quote=Peadarw:  "[quote=timmyhogan:  "[quote=Peadarw:  "[quote=timmyhogan:  "Well unvaccinated fans are being allowed into Croker for the SF so it's a moot point.
And at this late stage the same rules will obviously apply for the Final. Fans will have to take their chances, make up their own minds - they have a choice and the games can carry on without those who opt to stay away.

However this is not the case with the players, the GAA have a duty of care there. It might be worthwhile if they looked at not allowing players who are unvaxxed to play in the final. Indeed given that the vaccine doesn't provide complete protection lets err on the side of caution. Players who come into close contact with the unvaxxed should also be excluded.
Today's game goes ahead under the current 'anything goes' regime obviously. But for the Final any Tyrone lads who are in either segment are excluded. And we have 2 weeks to study the match video to see which Kerry players are a risk - should they win today.

It may seem harsh but to my mind it's the fairest solution. We have to take players health seriously."
players who come into contact with the unvaxxed
are you having a laugh these are amatuer players what do you suggest have them vet everybody they encounter ..maybe stay out of the shops and everything and live on fresh air
im sorry but cop on"
No obviously not "have them vet everybody they encounter". That would be ridiculous.
This isn't a totalitarian state - despite what the numpties may claim. So obviously the GAA cant or have no right to even wonder players mix with outside the confines of a football match.

But under my proposal all the current Tyrone squad would be excluded assuming they all shared a pitch or dressing room. Lucky for Mayo you might think but thems the breaks!!
I'm all about player safety in these troubling times & who could be opposed to that ;-)"]the tyrone squad have just come through getting the virus ...hence built up the antibodies the natural way ...in fact new data suggests that having had covid before is proving more effective at preventing catching the delta variant than the pfizer vaccine is so tyrone are looking pretty safe at the moment (even though your suggestion wouldnt make any sense at this point considering they just played kerry yesterday )"]OK obviously if you use science and rational arguments my proposal is ridiculous in the extreme.
But I don't come to HS for that kind of stuff. & That's not to say that my suggestion doesn't make sense from a certain perspective.

But you win - we can't exclude the current Tyrone panel from the AIF and make em' pick from the rest of the county.

How about this as a compromise. With my expertise in epidemiology I can tell from a visual inspection that certain Tyrone players have an indefinable patient Zero/Typhoid Mary look about them and should be barred from any contact with others. Shunned if you like , as was done in the good old days.
Can we agree to exclude Morgan, Hampsey, Mc Geary & McShane from the AIF.
Can't say fairer than that."]You had us going for a whole timmy.

Olympic standard trolling :-)

(Any punitive measures ought to include a sound thrashing of course.)"]had me hook line a sinker LOL

Peadarw (Donegal) - Posts: 15 - 29/08/2021 18:47:49    2376107

Link

Replying To DUALSUPPORT:  "My answer to the original question on this thread is yes unvaccinated should be allowed attend Croke Park and other events. It's someone personal choice if they take the covid vaccinations as these vaccines wether people want to admit it or not have being rushed through and haven't gone through the full process of trails and experimentation, I have talked to a medical profession and to a scientific researcher for advice who are not taking the vaccine either. When these vaccines are fully trailed and tested I'll get mine, until then call me what ye want I don't care. If these vaccines are the silver bullet for the virus, well then the vaccinated population have nothing to fear from the unvaccinated population."
They are clogging up our hospitals, taking precedence over cancer patients and others

97Cavans (Cavan) - Posts: 195 - 29/08/2021 20:17:48    2376141

Link

Replying To 97Cavans:  "They are clogging up our hospitals, taking precedence over cancer patients and others"
Where did you read there are more covid patients in hospital that are unvaccinated than vaccinated?

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 3333 - 29/08/2021 20:39:46    2376149

Link

Over 80% of over 18's fully vaccinated in Ireland & 90% partially vaccinated, which is one of the highest vaccine coverage rates in Europe & demonstrates significant vaccine confidence. Thankfully the few shouting loudly against the vaccine & ultimately against protecting the vulnerable in society, are part of an ignorant minority.

P.Mckenna (Louth) - Posts: 72 - 29/08/2021 21:05:01    2376160

Link

Replying To P.Mckenna:  "Over 80% of over 18's fully vaccinated in Ireland & 90% partially vaccinated, which is one of the highest vaccine coverage rates in Europe & demonstrates significant vaccine confidence. Thankfully the few shouting loudly against the vaccine & ultimately against protecting the vulnerable in society, are part of an ignorant minority."
Majority of those who have died have been old people under 24/7 care,

They were the "most vulnerable" and died mostly not of Covid solely but from other conditions which were both undertreated and falsely reported as "covid related" as part of the hysteria.

All the neglect of cancer and other illnesses will come back to haunt them if/when the panic ever ends.

The mortality rate, numbers and demographics have not changed one iota since all this started.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 312 - 29/08/2021 21:12:10    2376164

Link

Replying To 97Cavans:  "They are clogging up our hospitals, taking precedence over cancer patients and others"
Well that is not true as I write this post there is 347 people in hospital in the republic of Ireland with covid-19 hardly a number to clog the system and there is a percentage of those patients too vaccinated. you're saying those in hospitals with covid-19 are taking precedence over cancer patients, I bet there would be alot of Doctors and nurses working in hospitals with cancer patients would be very upset with that statement.

DUALSUPPORT (Limerick) - Posts: 1038 - 29/08/2021 23:16:51    2376215

Link

Replying To BarneyGrant:  "Majority of those who have died have been old people under 24/7 care,

They were the "most vulnerable" and died mostly not of Covid solely but from other conditions which were both undertreated and falsely reported as "covid related" as part of the hysteria.

All the neglect of cancer and other illnesses will come back to haunt them if/when the panic ever ends.

The mortality rate, numbers and demographics have not changed one iota since all this started."
Aye but imagine if we'd let covid just ravage the country from the start. .

They'd look a lot different then!

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 4555 - 29/08/2021 23:26:17    2376219

Link

Replying To Galway9801:  "If its only been tweaked slightly then why are do so many people fall ill after taking it?
A girl in work took two days off after her 2nd jab and when she came back could still barely walk, her right leg had gone dead.
I'm sure you've heard similar cases, albeit the after effects are usually only temporary."
fair enough, dont get the vaccine and risk getting Covid and getting really sick or worse, or get the vaccine where the majority of people will have no side effects, some will have minor, and some will have severe enough side effects but will get better (my own son was only one in our house to have any side effects) ...and if anyone thinks the above is unreasonable, stay at home and mind themselves, society cannot be held to ransom because some people dont want to get Covid or the vaccine, its mind yourself if you are in that bracket, the reason why people aare showing some side effects (very few people now to be fair) is because due to the severity and suddenness of the onset of the pandemic (digging trenches in Italy to bury bodys - alot have forgotten those scenes) the vaccine had to be tweeked rapidly and i am sure it was done as fast and as safe as possible...I knew there were risks but still thought it better to chance it. Dog in a manger is not an option here, if your not vaccinated, you cannot expect society to be put on hold because what you think might happen you because it happened someone else...its tough i know but people have to be practical about this or a few genuine and not so genuine people will hold the rest of us to ransom...

Fairplayalways (Offaly) - Posts: 866 - 30/08/2021 13:47:30    2376404

Link

My initial suggestion that, regardless of Saturdays result, the winners should be forced to exclude all or the majority of their SemiFinal match day squads from the AIF wasn't really trolling. More in the spirit of a modest proposal!

timmyhogan (UK) - Posts: 237 - 30/08/2021 14:00:19    2376412

Link

Rules should be set to allow maximum people attend

If GAA have to exclude the non vaccinated population to permit a full attendance then so be it.

The majority should not have to suffer because of a minority

tirawleybaron (Mayo) - Posts: 879 - 01/09/2021 02:54:34    2376919

Link

To safeguard attendees at any event going forward it will be neccessary to have health checks on the approach to venues.
Such systems would include scanning for vaccination record, temperature checks etc. They would need trialling with smaller attendance and like everything else would get more efficient with trial and error.

Excluding the unvaccinated is important. It will drive the remainder to get vaccinated and make it more difficult for the virus to transmit and thus get rid of it eventually .Of course this would be part of an overall plan with testing at borders and other measures.

Ashrules (Dublin) - Posts: 391 - 01/09/2021 09:34:10    2376940

Link

Replying To DUALSUPPORT:  "Well that is not true as I write this post there is 347 people in hospital in the republic of Ireland with covid-19 hardly a number to clog the system and there is a percentage of those patients too vaccinated. you're saying those in hospitals with covid-19 are taking precedence over cancer patients, I bet there would be alot of Doctors and nurses working in hospitals with cancer patients would be very upset with that statement."
Those covid patients require isolation ,require extra PPP wearing of staff and put hospital staff in danger.
You can bet Doctors and Nurses are more upset about the anti vacc. rabble and scum who did not support them in their hour of need when some of their colleagues were lost to the virus.

Ashrules (Dublin) - Posts: 391 - 01/09/2021 09:38:06    2376942

Link

Replying To Ashrules:  "Those covid patients require isolation ,require extra PPP wearing of staff and put hospital staff in danger.
You can bet Doctors and Nurses are more upset about the anti vacc. rabble and scum who did not support them in their hour of need when some of their colleagues were lost to the virus."
Firstly I'm not anti-vacination, I'm just not comfortable taking the covid-19 vaccines until I'm fully convinced of their safe and I wouldn't dis-courage anyone from taking them it's their choice, also I don't deny the seriousness of covid-19 I take my precautions everyday. Not trying to get into a tit for tat argument but there is serious precautions needed for cancer patients too, especially after chemotherapy and radiotherapy, they require isolation and special ppe too when being treated, but yes covid patients are more of a threat to staff than cancer patients I'll admit that.

Plenty of my wider family work in health and to say I don't support them and to describe myself and others who choose not to take the vaccine until they are fully convinced of its safety as "scum" is a low act. I'm not out to cause problems or anything, especially now when I'm hearing on the news about some vaccines being recalled, vaccines not as effective as first thought, boosters and my wife got her first jab and her eyes swilled up and now our GP want her to take her 2nd vaccine in the hospital for fear of reaction so I don't it's out the way for me to air on the side of caution. So you can call me more names if you want, it won't change my mind.

DUALSUPPORT (Limerick) - Posts: 1038 - 01/09/2021 10:43:25    2376952

Link

Replying To Ashrules:  "To safeguard attendees at any event going forward it will be neccessary to have health checks on the approach to venues.
Such systems would include scanning for vaccination record, temperature checks etc. They would need trialling with smaller attendance and like everything else would get more efficient with trial and error.

Excluding the unvaccinated is important. It will drive the remainder to get vaccinated and make it more difficult for the virus to transmit and thus get rid of it eventually .Of course this would be part of an overall plan with testing at borders and other measures."
By October Vaccination certs won't be required to attend events they will just be required for international travel.

ecad123 (Galway) - Posts: 206 - 01/09/2021 10:59:14    2376959

Link

Replying To Ashrules:  "To safeguard attendees at any event going forward it will be neccessary to have health checks on the approach to venues.
Such systems would include scanning for vaccination record, temperature checks etc. They would need trialling with smaller attendance and like everything else would get more efficient with trial and error.

Excluding the unvaccinated is important. It will drive the remainder to get vaccinated and make it more difficult for the virus to transmit and thus get rid of it eventually .Of course this would be part of an overall plan with testing at borders and other measures."
Do keep up.

Not even the Zero Covid idiots you obviously listen to believe any longer in getting rid of the virus.

Nor are you aware of the transmission between, and from, vaccinated people.

Many people are either naturally immune from Covid or don't even know they have it because they are generally healthy.

You are probably typical of someone - and don't worry you are probably in the majority - who would go along with almost anything someone you defer to tells you is right. and denigrate anyone who has the temerity to question as "scum and rabble."

You remind me of lots of unpleasant people I've known.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 312 - 01/09/2021 12:50:51    2376981

Link

Replying To DUALSUPPORT:  "Firstly I'm not anti-vacination, I'm just not comfortable taking the covid-19 vaccines until I'm fully convinced of their safe and I wouldn't dis-courage anyone from taking them it's their choice, also I don't deny the seriousness of covid-19 I take my precautions everyday. Not trying to get into a tit for tat argument but there is serious precautions needed for cancer patients too, especially after chemotherapy and radiotherapy, they require isolation and special ppe too when being treated, but yes covid patients are more of a threat to staff than cancer patients I'll admit that.

Plenty of my wider family work in health and to say I don't support them and to describe myself and others who choose not to take the vaccine until they are fully convinced of its safety as "scum" is a low act. I'm not out to cause problems or anything, especially now when I'm hearing on the news about some vaccines being recalled, vaccines not as effective as first thought, boosters and my wife got her first jab and her eyes swilled up and now our GP want her to take her 2nd vaccine in the hospital for fear of reaction so I don't it's out the way for me to air on the side of caution. So you can call me more names if you want, it won't change my mind."
So when does it become safe for you to take it? is it a length of time the number of people - what exactly is your criteria of when it becomes safe and who are the people who are going to tell you that? mRNA has been around for a bit although its considered a new technology, the problems up to now was never about safety but around delivery which still exist but were solved for covid with the amount of money that was put into it. The modern world has always been able to accelerate things when the need or money was there. What is happening on a worldwide scale in terms of vaccines is unprecedented - its reckoned its 5.33billion doses given already, some of the stories you read about may be true, some not but behind all of that you have to think 5.33 billion worldwide and that will put them into perspective

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1310 - 01/09/2021 14:10:37    2377010

Link

Replying To zinny:  "So when does it become safe for you to take it? is it a length of time the number of people - what exactly is your criteria of when it becomes safe and who are the people who are going to tell you that? mRNA has been around for a bit although its considered a new technology, the problems up to now was never about safety but around delivery which still exist but were solved for covid with the amount of money that was put into it. The modern world has always been able to accelerate things when the need or money was there. What is happening on a worldwide scale in terms of vaccines is unprecedented - its reckoned its 5.33billion doses given already, some of the stories you read about may be true, some not but behind all of that you have to think 5.33 billion worldwide and that will put them into perspective"
The length of time really would be big 1, I was told by a MD last August 2020 when I asked about a covid vaccine on the subject of something which is my personal business. I was told it would take at least 5 to 6 years to develop a proper vaccine if it was fully trailed and tested to see full side-effects and effectiveness and alot of other vaccines have taken 10 to 15 years from concept to commission, the HPV vaccine took 30 years. The full side-effects of these vaccines won't be known for a few years yet. I have no problem with others challenging my views and opinions on this, I have put them them on a public forum and I expect that but it's nasty to call me and others scum for what, for being cautious. All the vaccines available now don't stop infection and transmission, I know they give you a better chance of fighting covid-19 but there is still vaccinated people getting sick too and some others getting bad reactions too. Not 1 company who developed a covid vaccine that is on the market are taking on the responsibility of potential of legal action against them, they passed all that off to the government's of the country's where they are being administered. At this present moment the criteria for me to get a vaccine is, if there was a vaccine that would stop infection and transmission I would take the risk for reasons that are my business.

DUALSUPPORT (Limerick) - Posts: 1038 - 01/09/2021 18:52:11    2377095

Link

Replying To DUALSUPPORT:  "The length of time really would be big 1, I was told by a MD last August 2020 when I asked about a covid vaccine on the subject of something which is my personal business. I was told it would take at least 5 to 6 years to develop a proper vaccine if it was fully trailed and tested to see full side-effects and effectiveness and alot of other vaccines have taken 10 to 15 years from concept to commission, the HPV vaccine took 30 years. The full side-effects of these vaccines won't be known for a few years yet. I have no problem with others challenging my views and opinions on this, I have put them them on a public forum and I expect that but it's nasty to call me and others scum for what, for being cautious. All the vaccines available now don't stop infection and transmission, I know they give you a better chance of fighting covid-19 but there is still vaccinated people getting sick too and some others getting bad reactions too. Not 1 company who developed a covid vaccine that is on the market are taking on the responsibility of potential of legal action against them, they passed all that off to the government's of the country's where they are being administered. At this present moment the criteria for me to get a vaccine is, if there was a vaccine that would stop infection and transmission I would take the risk for reasons that are my business."
as is your right
i find it ironic that us "scum" respect that other people have the freedom to choose for themselves what they want to do ..i even commend them on it but god forbid we have any fears or worries ourselves about potential side effects
i agree with you if it stopped infection or transmission it would make the risk a little easier to accept but since it only lessens the chances im gonna hold out for a while yet

Peadarw (Donegal) - Posts: 15 - 01/09/2021 21:32:45    2377125

Link

Replying To DUALSUPPORT:  "Well that is not true as I write this post there is 347 people in hospital in the republic of Ireland with covid-19 hardly a number to clog the system and there is a percentage of those patients too vaccinated. you're saying those in hospitals with covid-19 are taking precedence over cancer patients, I bet there would be alot of Doctors and nurses working in hospitals with cancer patients would be very upset with that statement."
As someone with a family member with cancer who has had scans etc cancelled due to covid I can tell you covid is and will have a massive impact on cancer treatment and care. I know a man currently in ICU fighting for his life who refused the vaccine…thought he knew better. He is rightly being treated and I hope he pulls through but he shouldn't be there if only he took the vaccine.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 10820 - 01/09/2021 22:19:07    2377136

Link