National Forum

BANNING SHOULDER TACKLES?

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Absolutely not. Gaelic football is a contact game. My main issue is with Lane and his assistants not stopping the game when MacLoughlin fell to the ground unconscious. It was a serious error in player welfare.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 10841 - 18/08/2021 22:06:25    2372890

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Good God Almighty, there's nothing wrong with a shoulder challenge when it's delivered properly. A shoulder challenge must make contact with the opponents shoulder and not his chest or back. You can't deliver a legal shoulder from the front.
Leave well enough alone and enforce the rule as it stands. The GAA need to issue video on what is a legal shoulder and what isn't.

cluichethar (Mayo) - Posts: 357 - 18/08/2021 22:09:10    2372892

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Good God Almighty, there's nothing wrong with a shoulder challenge when it's delivered properly. A shoulder challenge must make contact with the opponents shoulder and not his chest or back. You can't deliver a legal shoulder from the front.
Leave well enough alone and enforce the rule as it stands. The GAA need to issue video on what is a legal shoulder and what isn't.

cluichethar (Mayo) - Posts: 357 - 18/08/2021 22:09:16    2372893

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Definitely not. The physical element of the game has been significantly diluted for two reasons. The first reason is the possession game. The second is the manner in which the game is refereed. If you put your hand on a players back the player will go down and the default reaction from the referee is to blow for a free. Referees like Derek O' Mahoney will consistently blow for the slightest infraction and rack up fifty plus frees a game. There is very little incentive for a player to stay on his feet. We can't dilute the physical element of the game any more than has been done already. Keep the shoulder tackle in the game.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 5707 - 18/08/2021 22:23:53    2372901

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "I don't think so. It takes physicality away from the game if it was banned. Also it is a great skill if done right. Séamus Moynihan of Kerry was brilliant at it. I remember Frank Cummins of Kilkenny when I was a child being so good at it. Anyone who saw James Mccarthy s shoulder v Nathan Mullins in a club game would love it. It can be seen on YouTube."
Wonder how the two dads saw that, two wild men right there :D

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8285 - 18/08/2021 22:53:22    2372908

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Replying To Greengrass:  "Definitely not. The physical element of the game has been significantly diluted for two reasons. The first reason is the possession game. The second is the manner in which the game is refereed. If you put your hand on a players back the player will go down and the default reaction from the referee is to blow for a free. Referees like Derek O' Mahoney will consistently blow for the slightest infraction and rack up fifty plus frees a game. There is very little incentive for a player to stay on his feet. We can't dilute the physical element of the game any more than has been done already. Keep the shoulder tackle in the game."
Good post, I agree generally with you but the problem is that if a player falls to the ground, whether its from a gentle tap or from a hard but fair shoulder, a ref kind of has to blow the whistle.

If he doesn't he's potentially leaving himself open to all manner of screeching self righteous keyboard junkies and commentators accusing him of not caring about players or neglecting player welfare and how because of him the sky is falling yadayadayada.

Better for the ref just to cover his back in this situation.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 957 - 18/08/2021 22:53:49    2372909

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I remember Stephen O'Neill did a textbook shoulder in 05 I think. Nobody injured at all, but he got a yellow card anyway. I like a good shoulder (it was about the only thing I was half way good at), but you see very few nowadays, and of the ones you do see, plenty are mis-timed. There should at least be consequences if you get it wrong; enough to make any player think twice unless he's sure he can execute it properly.

essmac (Tyrone) - Posts: 1074 - 18/08/2021 23:00:35    2372910

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The problem is not with the shoulder per se, its the fact most are incorrectly executed and player welfare is compromised. GAA really needs to look at the available weight of medical science, I repeat its days are numbered.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4733 - 18/08/2021 23:14:59    2372915

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Define a tackle which is far better than what exists now and then give referees better coaching on how to ref and manage games but this will take plenty of time to change and who actually wants to invest that time? virtually noone...

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2580 - 18/08/2021 23:44:34    2372920

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Absolutely not. We need more physical contact in our games, not less.

icehonesty (Wexford) - Posts: 2519 - 18/08/2021 23:57:53    2372921

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We have to keep the hard tackles and send off the fellas that are diving and feigning injury, if we don't we'll end up like soccer, full of cheats that will ruin the games.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jSWZcgg14c

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 1822 - 19/08/2021 01:49:12    2372927

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No get some proper referees. Lane lost control of that match at the weekend it was too big for him.

seanie08 (Monaghan) - Posts: 1589 - 19/08/2021 09:08:06    2372939

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Replying To arock:  "The problem is not with the shoulder per se, its the fact most are incorrectly executed and player welfare is compromised. GAA really needs to look at the available weight of medical science, I repeat its days are numbered."
Agree. For me, there was honour in a shoulder when the other fella saw it coming and both gave as good as they got. But I'm very uncomfortable with so-called shoulder tackles when the person being "tackled" is un-prepared, that is, un-sighted or off balance or un-tensed. Big difference between hitting a man who's set himself for the hit and somebody who is caught off guard. The latter is easy, cowardly and dirty. The former is manly and great for the game. Not sure how you legislate for one over the other though.

essmac (Tyrone) - Posts: 1074 - 19/08/2021 09:55:39    2372944

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No, the responsibility is on the player executing the shoulder, if you get it right then fine but you have a duty of care to get it right. It's not something that should be banned but the player doing it should get a ban for a couple of games if they get it wrong, particularly to the extent that Smalls did on Saturday.

PK57 (Louth) - Posts: 1597 - 19/08/2021 09:56:07    2372945

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Replying To PK57:  "No, the responsibility is on the player executing the shoulder, if you get it right then fine but you have a duty of care to get it right. It's not something that should be banned but the player doing it should get a ban for a couple of games if they get it wrong, particularly to the extent that Smalls did on Saturday."
So if the player in possession sees the shoulder coming lined up straight but decides to turn away at the last second knowing it will be a red card thats ok?

bad.monkey (USA) - Posts: 4536 - 19/08/2021 10:14:18    2372950

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Replying To seanie08:  "No get some proper referees. Lane lost control of that match at the weekend it was too big for him."
How would you do that?
Whats a proper referee?

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2580 - 19/08/2021 10:37:15    2372957

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Replying To essmac:  "Agree. For me, there was honour in a shoulder when the other fella saw it coming and both gave as good as they got. But I'm very uncomfortable with so-called shoulder tackles when the person being "tackled" is un-prepared, that is, un-sighted or off balance or un-tensed. Big difference between hitting a man who's set himself for the hit and somebody who is caught off guard. The latter is easy, cowardly and dirty. The former is manly and great for the game. Not sure how you legislate for one over the other though."
Such drivel, " can ye see me coming", "are ye ready for a shoulder" " I'll wait till yer ready, I'm not one of essmac's cowards".

sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 383 - 19/08/2021 11:04:52    2372969

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Replying To bad.monkey:  "So if the player in possession sees the shoulder coming lined up straight but decides to turn away at the last second knowing it will be a red card thats ok?"
There are obvious exceptions that can be made but If you are going in with the intention of leaving something on your opponent, you have to ensure you get it right.

PK57 (Louth) - Posts: 1597 - 19/08/2021 11:16:48    2372977

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It seems to be impossible in todays games to execute a shoulder charge fairly and correctly...I don't know why,perhaps the speed of movement and the athleticism of players,also because of its infrequency players are not ready/expecting it.I have always been in favour of the shoulder charge but I have doubts about it in the way its executed currently.It has become very dangerous and is causing serious injury to players.Perhaps in todays free flowing and fast moving games the shoulder charge has no place and has become outdated,a throw back to the past when the games were much slower and the shoulder charge was frequently executed by players moving at a much slower speed.
Also the speed of thought and hand to eye coordination is so much more developed than in times past when players ran in straight lines at a slower pace more often and their movements were more predictable.I know there were speedy players in the past and there were exceptions to my point,but the way the games are played and teams in general play have changed completely since inception.

ONdeDITCH (Limerick) - Posts: 873 - 19/08/2021 11:30:44    2372986

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Replying To sligo joe:  "Such drivel, " can ye see me coming", "are ye ready for a shoulder" " I'll wait till yer ready, I'm not one of essmac's cowards"."
'Ring me just before you get here'.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 6310 - 19/08/2021 11:34:35    2372988

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