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Replying To tonguey: "anyone know who is on the late late show tomorrow night??" I am surprised people still watch that rubbish ...
johnocarroll17 (Limerick) - Posts: 408 - 29/04/2021 14:52:18
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Replying To SaffronDon: "I just gave you an example of how you described unionism with an ugly stereotype. It's a familiar old rant I've heard many times. Maybe that wasn't your intentions as you seem to be deflecting from it now. I can only go by what you typed, so what are you trying to tell us if that's not what you meant?" I never said unionists attend parades and you can't show me where I did so if anyone should deflect it's you baby coz you have been found out jumping to conclusions
the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 29/04/2021 14:53:35
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Replying To yew_tree: "The DUP favourite as next leader believes the Earth is only 4,000 years old. There is no reasoning with those people. They would rather eat each other than have anything to do with the GAA but the good news is their support is plummeting. Young people don't want to have anything to do with evangelical Christian nut jobs who believe in gay conversion therapy...I mean come on. It's laughable even such a bill would be brought before a western democracy in 2021." Let us be thankful for Christians.
Without them modern progressive Irish citizens wouldn't have an outlet for their hatred and bigotry.
Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1720 - 29/04/2021 14:58:51
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Replying To tonguey: "I never said unionists attend parades and you can't show me where I did so if anyone should deflect it's you baby coz you have been found out jumping to conclusions" I did ask you to enlighten us by what you wrote since I'm obviously jumping to conclusions but still I've heard nothing but petty point scoring over exact wording since. If that's your thing I'll leave you to it. If you want to discuss something meaningful on the topic then I'm listening kid
SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2386 - 29/04/2021 15:38:29
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Plans are great in that they do focus the mind on what is required for the future. There is no doubting their efficacy IF the resources are put in place to ensure that they come to fruition.
Essential to ensuring their success is regular and consistent evaluation of progress.
Let's be realistic here ! Plans are great by nature and they do give those involved in the process a sense of satisfaction and gratification even. But that in itself is only part of the process- the easy part !!
To me there are a number of issues and the GAA will respond to these by stating that their hands are tied due to the lack of resources, ie money. And dear friends, this is not going to charge this year or next or the year after either.
So, the doom in me thinks, its a good idea and essential planning is important so ss not to stand still, but what real resources are going to be there to effect change ? None.
Instead I predict that the plan will be aspirational as opposed to short term achievable goals that WILL be achieved.
Not hopeful of any change that will make a difference.
carlowman (Carlow) - Posts: 1821 - 29/04/2021 15:56:19
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I see mention here that there may not be enough money/ resources to achieve anything. That's exactly why a strategy is needed and how all the pieces are linked. The biggest potential money spinner the GAA has is the All Irelands and getting that right provides the funds for so much else. A shake up of the Football Championship in particular could increase the number of meaningful competitive matches, but without that the GAA will indeed struggle for funds.
On the other topic, Unionism ain't a monolith. There will be those in the Orange Order etc. who wouldn't attend a GAA club under any circumstances but there may be those in the middle ground who would at least think about it. Not saying we have to remove GAA symbols or anything to achieve that. Infact keep the flag flying in the ground and since it symbolises peace and harmony between green and orange, we may as well give it a go. Not saying Unionists would come in large numbers but as part of a strategic plan for an Irish sporting organisation it would seem sensible to reach out and just ask.
tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 753 - 29/04/2021 18:21:34
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Replying To Viking66: " Replying To supersub15: "what towns/cities would you suggest new clubs to be created
how would you attempt to broaden appeal to unionists?
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2169 - 28/04/2021 20:35:37 2339207
Replying To supersub15: "If the playing field was leveled there would be no need for the back door."
How would you level the playing field and if the playing field was leveled it would mean there would be even more of a need for a better structure for the main inter county competition of the year
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2169 - 18/04/2021 19:44:38 2337744
Replying To supersub15: "I would base any changes I would make on the lgfa and take it from their, I'm led to believe they have an all-inclusive very worthwhile structure in place, financially promising if not altogether stable. Their association ( lgfa ) is based on one unit, no elitism, no super 8's just an all-inclusive one unit. For the obvious reasons they are not going to give me a free pass into how they operate so on that note I would ask for their assistance in setting up a recovery program in how to close the back gate for good, I'm sure I'll have put in place a plan of my own in the not too distant future.
By the way, would you care to help me with one or two of your suggestions, they would be appreciated."
KillingFields, I'm still waiting patiently for your suggestions.
supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2240 - 28/04/2021 09:58:59 2339056
KillingFields (Limerick) if you don't mind me suggesting you are playing a blinder here and getting away with it, in your many posts you seem to have perfected a way in avoiding an explanation by asking a question, and in avoiding answering a question by asking another, included are a couple of examples, Because the Back Door issue runs parallel with the GAA Strategic Plan I'll post this here," If you just make statements and include no questions then usually the dialogue stops fairly quickly like conversations in any other format."
supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2908 - 29/04/2021 19:58:21
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Replying To KillingFields: "Not splitting Dublin in 2 either disenfranchises the rest of Leinster who have no chance, or gives the others a chance only by deliberately under investing in the huge population that lives in Dublin. Either way the GAA is turning it's back on a large number of people which is not a good strategic decision.
In terms of new clubs in towns and cities, for example in Dublin. Also for example in Derry City which has only 4 clubs. It's got a population larger than county Cavan but one tenth of the number of clubs.
How would you attempt to broaden appeal to unionists? Start by asking them as part of this strategic plan.
tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 705 - 28/04/2021 21:48:05
Well the system of how the competitions are structured and played out totally disenfranchises sides a lot more.
Dublin being split does nothing to help those counties.
How would you broaden appeal to unionists. ask them what exactly?
The only way you could try to appeal seriously to unionists would be to remove the tricolour from grounds, stop singing the anthem and basically removing all vestiges of Irish nationalism, history of GAA support for independence etc. And for all that, most of them would still either hate us or not be bothered and it would all have been for nothing.
London125 (UK) - Posts: 19 - 28/04/2021 21:58:56does national anthem need to be played at all major games. reduce it to finals and some key games then maybe you could attract more unionists.
I'd means test distributions directly allocated to county teams.
I don't really like the idea of more clubs in large population areas. If anything in the GAA, there's a problem with there being too many clubs and them not being able to service the underage side of the game properly.
I'd remove the development squad system, in favour of more direct coaching in the clubs.
The calendar is in a much better state now that the split season is implemented.
The championship will need to be looked at. The super 8s isn't great and the backdoor system is unfair on Leinster counties where so many more enter into the first or second round than coming from Munster and Connacht. In any new system the National league should gain more prominence or there should be a graded championship implemented. Teams need more meaningful games linked to the main competition.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 3298 - 29/04/2021 08:25:24 Name any major team sport that doesnt have a development system in place where you talent id the best players to get more training at regional/county/provincial level ie higher standard
if you want the national league to get more prominence then dont run it all off to completion well before championship even starts." It's very hard to just talent at such a young age.
I honestly think a large part of Dublin's success is due to their coaching being decentralised and with the clubs and giving a wider net an opportunity to develop and improve each other.
There's a discussion at present in Irish soccer circles at the minute where there's a belief that the relatively new elite underage league system is too elitist at too young of an age and is concentrated resources too soon and in a sub optimal manner.
You've got bias when selecting young talent that those born in January and February are much more likely to make it to elite level because they have been the best of their age group over the years but that doesn't mean that those players had the most potential, there's talent that gets wasted and not an equal shot and the overall pool can be better utilised by resources being spread wider.
You should read up more on it. The development squad system is something that sounds like the right thing to do but it is actually out of date in terms of best practices.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4236 - 29/04/2021 20:58:40
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Is the GAA in a good place currently?
It may look good when we see Croke Park full for A I finals and Munster hurling and Ulster football finals but outside of those big money spinners, is it in a good place ?
Looking at Carlow, I don't think so.
A young lad looking at playing sports has 4 options for team sports, gaa as its called meaning gaelic football, hurling, soccer and rugby. 2 big rugby clubs and numerous soccer teams with nearly every area served by soccer teams.
Carlow Town and Tullow have rugby teams. Soccer and rugby have guaranteed games. GAA games have become more plentiful for under age teams over the years.
Practically no GAA games in primary schools and rugby teams in almost all secondary schools now.
Plenty of challenges there i think in trying to attract the young into GAA clubs.
With respect to Unionism and its cultural status I think that we have plenty of challenges closer to home to deal with.
For me, its definitely about growing the numbers especially at younger ages. Our full resources need to be placed in that sphere. A full games schedule needs to be there starting in primary and the big towns need serious remedial work as a small percentage of the young are currently playing.
If the new PLAN is not about that I think the GAA WILL STRUGGLE EVEN MORE THAN IT IS AT THE MOMENT.
ANY PLAN NEEDS TO BE ABOUT GROWING THE NUMBERS.
Stadia and putting more money into county teams is not going to bring about better county squads into the future.
carlowman (Carlow) - Posts: 1821 - 29/04/2021 21:56:47
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Replying To carlowman: "Is the GAA in a good place currently?
It may look good when we see Croke Park full for A I finals and Munster hurling and Ulster football finals but outside of those big money spinners, is it in a good place ?
Looking at Carlow, I don't think so.
A young lad looking at playing sports has 4 options for team sports, gaa as its called meaning gaelic football, hurling, soccer and rugby. 2 big rugby clubs and numerous soccer teams with nearly every area served by soccer teams.
Carlow Town and Tullow have rugby teams. Soccer and rugby have guaranteed games. GAA games have become more plentiful for under age teams over the years.
Practically no GAA games in primary schools and rugby teams in almost all secondary schools now.
Plenty of challenges there i think in trying to attract the young into GAA clubs.
With respect to Unionism and its cultural status I think that we have plenty of challenges closer to home to deal with.
For me, its definitely about growing the numbers especially at younger ages. Our full resources need to be placed in that sphere. A full games schedule needs to be there starting in primary and the big towns need serious remedial work as a small percentage of the young are currently playing.
If the new PLAN is not about that I think the GAA WILL STRUGGLE EVEN MORE THAN IT IS AT THE MOMENT.
ANY PLAN NEEDS TO BE ABOUT GROWING THE NUMBERS.
Stadia and putting more money into county teams is not going to bring about better county squads into the future." Sorry to hear about this situation. It is the same in Galway city. New Rugby clubs springing up. Not GAA ones. Hope though that the Gaeilscoileanna situation will help the GAA. I have always thought that using the Irish language and culture is the way ahead for the GAA. Reason being that GAA will never have the international appeal of soccer and rugby. Both these sports have international competitions. Hopefully the GAA has the Irish language. Tá súil agam go raibh an teanga Gaeilge ag an CLG.
galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 2520 - 29/04/2021 22:38:28
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Replying To carlowman: "Is the GAA in a good place currently?
It may look good when we see Croke Park full for A I finals and Munster hurling and Ulster football finals but outside of those big money spinners, is it in a good place ?
Looking at Carlow, I don't think so.
A young lad looking at playing sports has 4 options for team sports, gaa as its called meaning gaelic football, hurling, soccer and rugby. 2 big rugby clubs and numerous soccer teams with nearly every area served by soccer teams.
Carlow Town and Tullow have rugby teams. Soccer and rugby have guaranteed games. GAA games have become more plentiful for under age teams over the years.
Practically no GAA games in primary schools and rugby teams in almost all secondary schools now.
Plenty of challenges there i think in trying to attract the young into GAA clubs.
With respect to Unionism and its cultural status I think that we have plenty of challenges closer to home to deal with.
For me, its definitely about growing the numbers especially at younger ages. Our full resources need to be placed in that sphere. A full games schedule needs to be there starting in primary and the big towns need serious remedial work as a small percentage of the young are currently playing.
If the new PLAN is not about that I think the GAA WILL STRUGGLE EVEN MORE THAN IT IS AT THE MOMENT.
ANY PLAN NEEDS TO BE ABOUT GROWING THE NUMBERS.
Stadia and putting more money into county teams is not going to bring about better county squads into the future." No it is not about growing the numbers. It is about using Gaelic culture and the Irish language. That is the way the GAA should go. One of the biggest success stories from Ireland over the last 30 years has been TG4. It has imho revolutionised GAA and is the only Irish media outfit to encourage it. Thaitin mé TG4.
galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 2520 - 29/04/2021 22:43:06
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Replying To Loughduff Lad: "No one is on about the DUP. They are the extremists. You are never going to entice the hardliners, extremists etc. But there are many moderates who do not identify as either community and many mild unionists who are in the centre and these would be who I'd talk about. Everyone fully knows what the DUP are about like you mention, and they are imploding. As they should. Not to disparage all who vote for them, some have simply no option when they get to the ballot box. That's a failing of the DUP and the fear of themmuns and SF that they push to keep their votes up" Your correct. It's great to see a club setup in East Belfast. I have zero issue with a unionist not wanting to have anything to do with the GAA....but of course some, especially the younger kids may want to play and the option is there. The GAA to me was always inclusive..:
nobody cares what religion or color you are. Just get on with the games.
yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11236 - 29/04/2021 23:09:53
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Replying To tonguey: " Replying To KillingFields: "I would not bother with Unionists if it involved changing what the GAA has stood for over the years to pander to them. Why should we lose our cultural identity to appease them?? Leave things as they are- we have managed fine without them so far so why change now?? They do not do a lot to include us in their culture/heritage. We should not be bowing before every other culture etc like we have in this country. I for one am sick to the teeth of it. We are losing so much as a result of this- they would come in and take over- would want Amhran na bhFiann stopped, tricolour removed, club names changed, ground names changed etc etc. And the PC brigade would keel over and do it for them to cater to their needs and to be inclusive and not discriminate etc. What about the hard working GAA people who would not want it- it always seems to be oh we need to change this or that to keep the minority happy and to protect their rights etc. What about the rights/wishes of teh majority who may not want it??? Very sickening country we have become.
tonguey (Cavan) - Posts: 334 - 29/04/2021 10:10:21
What sports organisations do unionists have that is like the GAA with the cultural in terms of language, irish flag, anthem at all games....
Some club names and ground names being changed wouldnt be a major issue and you could gain a huge amount from that" What could you gain by removing names from grounds?? I never said they had the Irish flag or anthem at their events?? What are you on about? Can you imagine the Unionists changing their marching regimes to include Catholics and removing their sashes?? Yea I think not"
omahant (USA) - Posts: 2614 - 30/04/2021 01:23:01
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Replying To carlowman: "Is the GAA in a good place currently?
It may look good when we see Croke Park full for A I finals and Munster hurling and Ulster football finals but outside of those big money spinners, is it in a good place ?
Looking at Carlow, I don't think so.
A young lad looking at playing sports has 4 options for team sports, gaa as its called meaning gaelic football, hurling, soccer and rugby. 2 big rugby clubs and numerous soccer teams with nearly every area served by soccer teams.
Carlow Town and Tullow have rugby teams. Soccer and rugby have guaranteed games. GAA games have become more plentiful for under age teams over the years.
Practically no GAA games in primary schools and rugby teams in almost all secondary schools now.
Plenty of challenges there i think in trying to attract the young into GAA clubs.
With respect to Unionism and its cultural status I think that we have plenty of challenges closer to home to deal with.
For me, its definitely about growing the numbers especially at younger ages. Our full resources need to be placed in that sphere. A full games schedule needs to be there starting in primary and the big towns need serious remedial work as a small percentage of the young are currently playing.
If the new PLAN is not about that I think the GAA WILL STRUGGLE EVEN MORE THAN IT IS AT THE MOMENT.
ANY PLAN NEEDS TO BE ABOUT GROWING THE NUMBERS.
Stadia and putting more money into county teams is not going to bring about better county squads into the future." Good points. I know of one major school in a large town in Kildare that changed from being a gaa-oriented school to a rugby-oriented school over the course of just a few years. I presume there are other examples throughout the country. Gaa doesn't automatically win the hearts and minds of young people like it would have a generation ago. It is struggling to keep a foothold in many cases.
PoolSturgeon (Galway) - Posts: 1904 - 30/04/2021 08:15:54
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As mentioned before the most important problem facing GAA particularly in my own county is rural depopulation, and that includes the new shiny plans to have everyone living in towns and villages and nare a body to be had out in the countryside, fill it up with sitka spruce abominations instead. It isn't fair, or right or proper.
the_creeler (Leitrim) - Posts: 119 - 30/04/2021 09:21:38
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Replying To PoolSturgeon: "Good points. I know of one major school in a large town in Kildare that changed from being a gaa-oriented school to a rugby-oriented school over the course of just a few years. I presume there are other examples throughout the country. Gaa doesn't automatically win the hearts and minds of young people like it would have a generation ago. It is struggling to keep a foothold in many cases." That's true. There are examples of it going the other way. Success drives this. I think huge strides have been made in parts of Dublin when it comes to GAA interest and development. Limerick a rugby city seems to be in the middle of a hurling revival when we were told not long ago rugby was king...where have all the thousands following Munster everywhere gone? People follow successful teams.
In Mayo for example Westport was always known as a soccer and rugby town. In the last 10 years GAA has flourished and they are now an established senior club, building new GAA grounds with big money behind them.
Hearts and minds.
yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11236 - 30/04/2021 09:58:32
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The GAA's biggest strength is also its biggest weakness. Parochialism. With changing demographics clubs will have to swallow hard, amalgamate in certain areas and new clubs in others.
Also as another poster said the focus of spending should be on games promotion and not building stands and I/C teams. There should be a schedule of coaching in every school in every county by the GDO. Every school should know the schedule for the school term. Educating club volunteers to a minimum level of coaching is also crucial. the more people with a decent level of knowledge the easier it is to promote the games.
Even in big counties like my own there is a very distinct hurling area and football area.
Hurling is dying and needs serious attention. Don't let watching the top counties fool anyone. The gap to the next level is huge. Getting into national schools, spend money on hurleys, helmets, balls and coaching of 6, 7, 8, 9 year olds in every national school. Is this happening in Carlow, Louth, West Galway etc
Mayonman (Galway) - Posts: 1834 - 30/04/2021 10:04:40
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Replying To yew_tree: "Your correct. It's great to see a club setup in East Belfast. I have zero issue with a unionist not wanting to have anything to do with the GAA....but of course some, especially the younger kids may want to play and the option is there. The GAA to me was always inclusive..:
nobody cares what religion or color you are. Just get on with the games." Exactly let them play it by all means but at the cost of changing traditions etc. I know people here who are of other religions and none playing GAA but we didn't have to change anything in order for them to play. Let them play by all means but we keep our traditions and cultures not remove them to keep the minority happy.
the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 30/04/2021 10:10:25
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I was genuinely wondering why Pat Gilroy is on this strategic review committee?? Insofar as to why was he picked over any other former manager/player/GAA person? Why did they go for a random GAA individual from one county (which happens to be Dublin)? Who decides on these people? Why not pick a former footballer from Cavan, Down, Donegal, Tipperary etc etc. Why was Gilroy as opposed to any other random person picked?? Genuinely wondering how they arrived with him on the committee.
the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 30/04/2021 11:04:30
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Replying To tonguey: "Exactly let them play it by all means but at the cost of changing traditions etc. I know people here who are of other religions and none playing GAA but we didn't have to change anything in order for them to play. Let them play by all means but we keep our traditions and cultures not remove them to keep the minority happy." A "New Ireland" will mean a new identity of sorts, otherwise there's absolutely no point in having a united country but a divided people. Surely no real republican would put his love of a sporting organization before the love of his country. You mentioned religions, but it has nothing to do with religion, it's all about identity. The Irish abandoning their "traditions and cultures" is nothing new, all you have to do is look back at the "Celtic Tiger" era to see that.
AfricanGael (UK) - Posts: 1947 - 30/04/2021 11:33:49
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