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Will the GAA's new strategic plan seize the opportunity to move the organisation forward? A few things I would suggest it should deal with
- A proper Calendar for the year with guaranteed time for clubs, counties and off season known in advance
- Dublin to be divided in 2
- New clubs set up in major towns and cities where population has grown but clubs haven't
- Football All Ireland to be All Ireland League. Provincials retained as stand alone competitions.
- Attempt to broaden appeal to Unionist Community
tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 753 - 28/04/2021 20:17:18
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Replying To tyroneed: "Will the GAA's new strategic plan seize the opportunity to move the organisation forward? A few things I would suggest it should deal with
- A proper Calendar for the year with guaranteed time for clubs, counties and off season known in advance
- Dublin to be divided in 2
- New clubs set up in major towns and cities where population has grown but clubs haven't
- Football All Ireland to be All Ireland League. Provincials retained as stand alone competitions.
- Attempt to broaden appeal to Unionist Community" Except Dublin being split in 2 wont really move the whole organisation forward.
disenfranchises/annoys dubs. and wont make most counties any bit more competitive
what towns/cities would you suggest new clubs to be created
how would you attempt to broaden appeal to unionists?
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3511 - 28/04/2021 20:35:37
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Replying To KillingFields: "Except Dublin being split in 2 wont really move the whole organisation forward.
disenfranchises/annoys dubs. and wont make most counties any bit more competitive
what towns/cities would you suggest new clubs to be created
how would you attempt to broaden appeal to unionists?" Not splitting Dublin in 2 either disenfranchises the rest of Leinster who have no chance, or gives the others a chance only by deliberately under investing in the huge population that lives in Dublin. Either way the GAA is turning it's back on a large number of people which is not a good strategic decision.
In terms of new clubs in towns and cities, for example in Dublin. Also for example in Derry City which has only 4 clubs. It's got a population larger than county Cavan but one tenth of the number of clubs.
How would you attempt to broaden appeal to unionists? Start by asking them as part of this strategic plan.
tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 753 - 28/04/2021 21:48:05
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Replying To tyroneed: "Will the GAA's new strategic plan seize the opportunity to move the organisation forward? A few things I would suggest it should deal with
- A proper Calendar for the year with guaranteed time for clubs, counties and off season known in advance
- Dublin to be divided in 2
- New clubs set up in major towns and cities where population has grown but clubs haven't
- Football All Ireland to be All Ireland League. Provincials retained as stand alone competitions.
- Attempt to broaden appeal to Unionist Community" I'd agree with all of those bar the one about splitting Dublin.
I'd split them in 4. I'm only joking. I'm not sure what the answer to that is. Perhaps levelling the playing field in other ways but what that might be I don't know.
thegadfly (Cavan) - Posts: 290 - 28/04/2021 21:53:31
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The only way you could try to appeal seriously to unionists would be to remove the tricolour from grounds, stop singing the anthem and basically removing all vestiges of Irish nationalism, history of GAA support for independence etc. And for all that, most of them would still either hate us or not be bothered and it would all have been for nothing.
London125 (UK) - Posts: 55 - 28/04/2021 21:58:56
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Replying To KillingFields: "Except Dublin being split in 2 wont really move the whole organisation forward.
disenfranchises/annoys dubs. and wont make most counties any bit more competitive
what towns/cities would you suggest new clubs to be created
how would you attempt to broaden appeal to unionists?" what towns/cities would you suggest new clubs to be created
how would you attempt to broaden appeal to unionists?
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2169 - 28/04/2021 20:35:37 2339207
Replying To supersub15: "If the playing field was leveled there would be no need for the back door."
How would you level the playing field and if the playing field was leveled it would mean there would be even more of a need for a better structure for the main inter county competition of the year
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2169 - 18/04/2021 19:44:38 2337744
Replying To supersub15: "I would base any changes I would make on the lgfa and take it from their, I'm led to believe they have an all-inclusive very worthwhile structure in place, financially promising if not altogether stable. Their association ( lgfa ) is based on one unit, no elitism, no super 8's just an all-inclusive one unit. For the obvious reasons they are not going to give me a free pass into how they operate so on that note I would ask for their assistance in setting up a recovery program in how to close the back gate for good, I'm sure I'll have put in place a plan of my own in the not too distant future.
By the way, would you care to help me with one or two of your suggestions, they would be appreciated."
KillingFields, I'm still waiting patiently for your suggestions.
supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2240 - 28/04/2021 09:58:59 2339056
KillingFields (Limerick) if you don't mind me suggesting you are playing a blinder here and getting away with it, in your many posts you seem to have perfected a way in avoiding an explanation by asking a question, and in avoiding answering a question by asking another, included are a couple of examples, Because the Back Door issue runs parallel with the GAA Strategic Plan I'll post this here,
supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2908 - 28/04/2021 22:37:53
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Replying To tyroneed: "Will the GAA's new strategic plan seize the opportunity to move the organisation forward? A few things I would suggest it should deal with
- A proper Calendar for the year with guaranteed time for clubs, counties and off season known in advance
- Dublin to be divided in 2
- New clubs set up in major towns and cities where population has grown but clubs haven't
- Football All Ireland to be All Ireland League. Provincials retained as stand alone competitions.
- Attempt to broaden appeal to Unionist Community" Re last point - now with Arlene as a private citizen, recruit her to drum up interest :)
Seriously - if I were a Unionist, I wouldn't want my club to have a 'finger-in-my-eye' name called after an Irish liberator. Why can't all clubs be called after the town or village only ?
omahant (USA) - Posts: 2614 - 29/04/2021 01:46:42
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Replying To supersub15: "what towns/cities would you suggest new clubs to be created
how would you attempt to broaden appeal to unionists?
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2169 - 28/04/2021 20:35:37 2339207
Replying To supersub15: "If the playing field was leveled there would be no need for the back door."
How would you level the playing field and if the playing field was leveled it would mean there would be even more of a need for a better structure for the main inter county competition of the year
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 2169 - 18/04/2021 19:44:38 2337744
Replying To supersub15: "I would base any changes I would make on the lgfa and take it from their, I'm led to believe they have an all-inclusive very worthwhile structure in place, financially promising if not altogether stable. Their association ( lgfa ) is based on one unit, no elitism, no super 8's just an all-inclusive one unit. For the obvious reasons they are not going to give me a free pass into how they operate so on that note I would ask for their assistance in setting up a recovery program in how to close the back gate for good, I'm sure I'll have put in place a plan of my own in the not too distant future.
By the way, would you care to help me with one or two of your suggestions, they would be appreciated."
KillingFields, I'm still waiting patiently for your suggestions.
supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2240 - 28/04/2021 09:58:59 2339056
KillingFields (Limerick) if you don't mind me suggesting you are playing a blinder here and getting away with it, in your many posts you seem to have perfected a way in avoiding an explanation by asking a question, and in avoiding answering a question by asking another, included are a couple of examples, Because the Back Door issue runs parallel with the GAA Strategic Plan I'll post this here," If you just make statements and include no questions then usually the dialogue stops fairly quickly like conversations in any other format.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12028 - 29/04/2021 07:10:34
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Replying To London125: "The only way you could try to appeal seriously to unionists would be to remove the tricolour from grounds, stop singing the anthem and basically removing all vestiges of Irish nationalism, history of GAA support for independence etc. And for all that, most of them would still either hate us or not be bothered and it would all have been for nothing." Agree, all that might have to change in time but I would question if it would make any difference now and would only create divisions within the GAA. Attitudes will change but that has to change at the grassroots levels where people will have to let go of the past. If it was all about a song and a flag then all the Unionist players playing rugby would play in green.
zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1805 - 29/04/2021 08:12:01
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I'd means test distributions directly allocated to county teams.
I don't really like the idea of more clubs in large population areas. If anything in the GAA, there's a problem with there being too many clubs and them not being able to service the underage side of the game properly.
I'd remove the development squad system, in favour of more direct coaching in the clubs.
The calendar is in a much better state now that the split season is implemented.
The championship will need to be looked at. The super 8s isn't great and the backdoor system is unfair on Leinster counties where so many more enter into the first or second round than coming from Munster and Connacht. In any new system the National league should gain more prominence or there should be a graded championship implemented. Teams need more meaningful games linked to the main competition.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4236 - 29/04/2021 08:25:24
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Replying To omahant: "Re last point - now with Arlene as a private citizen, recruit her to drum up interest :)
Seriously - if I were a Unionist, I wouldn't want my club to have a 'finger-in-my-eye' name called after an Irish liberator. Why can't all clubs be called after the town or village only ?" I would not bother with Unionists if it involved changing what the GAA has stood for over the years to pander to them. Why should we lose our cultural identity to appease them?? Leave things as they are- we have managed fine without them so far so why change now?? They do not do a lot to include us in their culture/heritage. We should not be bowing before every other culture etc like we have in this country. I for one am sick to the teeth of it. We are losing so much as a result of this- they would come in and take over- would want Amhran na bhFiann stopped, tricolour removed, club names changed, ground names changed etc etc. And the PC brigade would keel over and do it for them to cater to their needs and to be inclusive and not discriminate etc. What about the hard working GAA people who would not want it- it always seems to be oh we need to change this or that to keep the minority happy and to protect their rights etc. What about the rights/wishes of teh majority who may not want it??? Very sickening country we have become.
the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 29/04/2021 10:10:21
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I would not bother with Unionists if it involved changing what the GAA has stood for over the years to pander to them. Why should we lose our cultural identity to appease them?? Leave things as they are- we have managed fine without them so far so why change now?? They do not do a lot to include us in their culture/heritage. We should not be bowing before every other culture etc like we have in this country. I for one am sick to the teeth of it. We are losing so much as a result of this- they would come in and take over- would want Amhran na bhFiann stopped, tricolour removed, club names changed, ground names changed etc etc. And the PC brigade would keel over and do it for them to cater to their needs and to be inclusive and not discriminate etc. What about the hard working GAA people who would not want it- it always seems to be oh we need to change this or that to keep the minority happy and to protect their rights etc. What about the rights/wishes of teh majority who may not want it??? Very sickening country we have become.
tonguey (Cavan) - Posts: 334 - 29/04/2021 10:10:21
What sports organisations do unionists have that is like the GAA with the cultural in terms of language, irish flag, anthem at all games....
Some club names and ground names being changed wouldnt be a major issue and you could gain a huge amount from that
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3511 - 29/04/2021 11:40:29
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Not splitting Dublin in 2 either disenfranchises the rest of Leinster who have no chance, or gives the others a chance only by deliberately under investing in the huge population that lives in Dublin. Either way the GAA is turning it's back on a large number of people which is not a good strategic decision.
In terms of new clubs in towns and cities, for example in Dublin. Also for example in Derry City which has only 4 clubs. It's got a population larger than county Cavan but one tenth of the number of clubs.
How would you attempt to broaden appeal to unionists? Start by asking them as part of this strategic plan.
tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 705 - 28/04/2021 21:48:05
Well the system of how the competitions are structured and played out totally disenfranchises sides a lot more.
Dublin being split does nothing to help those counties.
How would you broaden appeal to unionists. ask them what exactly?
The only way you could try to appeal seriously to unionists would be to remove the tricolour from grounds, stop singing the anthem and basically removing all vestiges of Irish nationalism, history of GAA support for independence etc. And for all that, most of them would still either hate us or not be bothered and it would all have been for nothing.
London125 (UK) - Posts: 19 - 28/04/2021 21:58:56does national anthem need to be played at all major games. reduce it to finals and some key games then maybe you could attract more unionists.
I'd means test distributions directly allocated to county teams.
I don't really like the idea of more clubs in large population areas. If anything in the GAA, there's a problem with there being too many clubs and them not being able to service the underage side of the game properly.
I'd remove the development squad system, in favour of more direct coaching in the clubs.
The calendar is in a much better state now that the split season is implemented.
The championship will need to be looked at. The super 8s isn't great and the backdoor system is unfair on Leinster counties where so many more enter into the first or second round than coming from Munster and Connacht. In any new system the National league should gain more prominence or there should be a graded championship implemented. Teams need more meaningful games linked to the main competition.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 3298 - 29/04/2021 08:25:24 Name any major team sport that doesnt have a development system in place where you talent id the best players to get more training at regional/county/provincial level ie higher standard
if you want the national league to get more prominence then dont run it all off to completion well before championship even starts.
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3511 - 29/04/2021 11:45:38
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Replying To KillingFields: "I would not bother with Unionists if it involved changing what the GAA has stood for over the years to pander to them. Why should we lose our cultural identity to appease them?? Leave things as they are- we have managed fine without them so far so why change now?? They do not do a lot to include us in their culture/heritage. We should not be bowing before every other culture etc like we have in this country. I for one am sick to the teeth of it. We are losing so much as a result of this- they would come in and take over- would want Amhran na bhFiann stopped, tricolour removed, club names changed, ground names changed etc etc. And the PC brigade would keel over and do it for them to cater to their needs and to be inclusive and not discriminate etc. What about the hard working GAA people who would not want it- it always seems to be oh we need to change this or that to keep the minority happy and to protect their rights etc. What about the rights/wishes of teh majority who may not want it??? Very sickening country we have become.
tonguey (Cavan) - Posts: 334 - 29/04/2021 10:10:21
What sports organisations do unionists have that is like the GAA with the cultural in terms of language, irish flag, anthem at all games....
Some club names and ground names being changed wouldnt be a major issue and you could gain a huge amount from that" What could you gain by removing names from grounds?? I never said they had the Irish flag or anthem at their events?? What are you on about? Can you imagine the Unionists changing their marching regimes to include Catholics and removing their sashes?? Yea I think not
the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 29/04/2021 12:15:24
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Replying To tyroneed: "Will the GAA's new strategic plan seize the opportunity to move the organisation forward? A few things I would suggest it should deal with
- A proper Calendar for the year with guaranteed time for clubs, counties and off season known in advance
- Dublin to be divided in 2
- New clubs set up in major towns and cities where population has grown but clubs haven't
- Football All Ireland to be All Ireland League. Provincials retained as stand alone competitions.
- Attempt to broaden appeal to Unionist Community" I'll take you up on your last point. It simply won't happen without many changes that would be needed, but which would be unpalatable to current members. I know a fair few people of a Unionist persuasion, and simply put they see the GAA as the sporting wing of the IRA. Now we all know that isn't the case, but it's how it is portrayed to them. First step that would need to be done would be the removal of glorification of IRA members, hunger strikers etc. in the North on team names, cups, club grounds and so forth. That would need to be done for them to even consider it (and even then it'd be a stretch) and it probably won't happen due to members pushing back against these changes. Lots then to do after that to bring them in (East Belfast GAA is doing good work there in that regard) but there's your answer...
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2401 - 29/04/2021 12:21:04
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Great to see the small counties represented on it anyway. Wonder who will Pat Gilroy favour or the Kerry chairman??
the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 29/04/2021 12:22:56
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Replying To tonguey: "I would not bother with Unionists if it involved changing what the GAA has stood for over the years to pander to them. Why should we lose our cultural identity to appease them?? Leave things as they are- we have managed fine without them so far so why change now?? They do not do a lot to include us in their culture/heritage. We should not be bowing before every other culture etc like we have in this country. I for one am sick to the teeth of it. We are losing so much as a result of this- they would come in and take over- would want Amhran na bhFiann stopped, tricolour removed, club names changed, ground names changed etc etc. And the PC brigade would keel over and do it for them to cater to their needs and to be inclusive and not discriminate etc. What about the hard working GAA people who would not want it- it always seems to be oh we need to change this or that to keep the minority happy and to protect their rights etc. What about the rights/wishes of teh majority who may not want it??? Very sickening country we have become." As an aside to your comment, you've a perfectly succinct reply on why there would always be issues with a United Ireland. Are people really that attached to a flag and anthem in the event it would be not used as much, or changed for inclusivity, or for a new country/state created in a United Ireland? Some things about the GAA need to change as a minimum anyway, but until we can have the conversation without ourselves, then we'll keep on going our own road.
Naming clubs/grounds/cups after IRA members and also Slavers needs to go, and we cannot just say ah sure look, it's part of our history/culture so lets keep it. It's too divisive for many. You can take the Unionist way and dig your heels in and say No, or Never, or we won't change (and see how well that goes for them), or you can grow and change and be inclusive and not call it pandering. Be better than they ever were to us. Are we really that attached to these names and flags/anthems?
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2401 - 29/04/2021 12:28:18
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Replying To KillingFields: "I would not bother with Unionists if it involved changing what the GAA has stood for over the years to pander to them. Why should we lose our cultural identity to appease them?? Leave things as they are- we have managed fine without them so far so why change now?? They do not do a lot to include us in their culture/heritage. We should not be bowing before every other culture etc like we have in this country. I for one am sick to the teeth of it. We are losing so much as a result of this- they would come in and take over- would want Amhran na bhFiann stopped, tricolour removed, club names changed, ground names changed etc etc. And the PC brigade would keel over and do it for them to cater to their needs and to be inclusive and not discriminate etc. What about the hard working GAA people who would not want it- it always seems to be oh we need to change this or that to keep the minority happy and to protect their rights etc. What about the rights/wishes of teh majority who may not want it??? Very sickening country we have become.
tonguey (Cavan) - Posts: 334 - 29/04/2021 10:10:21
What sports organisations do unionists have that is like the GAA with the cultural in terms of language, irish flag, anthem at all games....
Some club names and ground names being changed wouldnt be a major issue and you could gain a huge amount from that" I got to say, even beyond what I've said above, I would be interested to see what would happen if the name changes occurred. That is the one thing Unionists go to when they point to the GAA not being for them. If the names changed, what ready made excuse would they go to then? Because they still would have some...
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2401 - 29/04/2021 12:30:41
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Replying To Loughduff Lad: "As an aside to your comment, you've a perfectly succinct reply on why there would always be issues with a United Ireland. Are people really that attached to a flag and anthem in the event it would be not used as much, or changed for inclusivity, or for a new country/state created in a United Ireland? Some things about the GAA need to change as a minimum anyway, but until we can have the conversation without ourselves, then we'll keep on going our own road.
Naming clubs/grounds/cups after IRA members and also Slavers needs to go, and we cannot just say ah sure look, it's part of our history/culture so lets keep it. It's too divisive for many. You can take the Unionist way and dig your heels in and say No, or Never, or we won't change (and see how well that goes for them), or you can grow and change and be inclusive and not call it pandering. Be better than they ever were to us. Are we really that attached to these names and flags/anthems?" Well I am yes and I have no issue with admitting that- inclusive you say?? Of the people who you said in your following post that do not want to be part of organsiation in the first place? Makes good sense alright- let's change the names, the anthem, the flag etc and then what??? They still won't participate- that is sensible.
Maybe let them make the first move for a change and start wearing green on their parades???
the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 29/04/2021 12:39:55
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Replying To Loughduff Lad: "As an aside to your comment, you've a perfectly succinct reply on why there would always be issues with a United Ireland. Are people really that attached to a flag and anthem in the event it would be not used as much, or changed for inclusivity, or for a new country/state created in a United Ireland? Some things about the GAA need to change as a minimum anyway, but until we can have the conversation without ourselves, then we'll keep on going our own road.
Naming clubs/grounds/cups after IRA members and also Slavers needs to go, and we cannot just say ah sure look, it's part of our history/culture so lets keep it. It's too divisive for many. You can take the Unionist way and dig your heels in and say No, or Never, or we won't change (and see how well that goes for them), or you can grow and change and be inclusive and not call it pandering. Be better than they ever were to us. Are we really that attached to these names and flags/anthems?" What would you call the stands in "Croke" Park (obviosuly would have to be renamed as well going by this bizarre logic. Hogan Stand, Cusack Stand, Davin Stand. We would have to change O Connell Street too would we or they may not travel down it. Could call it the Dodds Road, or Foster Drive
the creeler (Cavan) - Posts: 512 - 29/04/2021 12:44:05
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