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Question For Dubs

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If Dublin is split into 2/3/4,,, (if),,, from your experience living in the capital,, and attending games with other dubs, talking to them etc,,, would Dublin fans on the whole buy into the new reality and support their new "counties",, or would there be a drop off in interest,, kind of a "unified Dublin or nothing" situation.
If my county was split into 2 I'm not sure I'd be as emotionally invested in the new set up as the old one tbh.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1262 - 08/12/2020 11:34:37    2320160

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Replying To Galway9801:  "If Dublin is split into 2/3/4,,, (if),,, from your experience living in the capital,, and attending games with other dubs, talking to them etc,,, would Dublin fans on the whole buy into the new reality and support their new "counties",, or would there be a drop off in interest,, kind of a "unified Dublin or nothing" situation.
If my county was split into 2 I'm not sure I'd be as emotionally invested in the new set up as the old one tbh."
No

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2823 - 08/12/2020 11:43:36    2320163

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Replying To Galway9801:  "If Dublin is split into 2/3/4,,, (if),,, from your experience living in the capital,, and attending games with other dubs, talking to them etc,,, would Dublin fans on the whole buy into the new reality and support their new "counties",, or would there be a drop off in interest,, kind of a "unified Dublin or nothing" situation.
If my county was split into 2 I'm not sure I'd be as emotionally invested in the new set up as the old one tbh."
If it ever happens that will be my supporting days over.

ConnollyDub (Dublin) - Posts: 2000 - 08/12/2020 11:47:27    2320165

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Oh cool another thread on this. We need more of these.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 7297 - 08/12/2020 11:48:37    2320166

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Replying To Galway9801:  "If Dublin is split into 2/3/4,,, (if),,, from your experience living in the capital,, and attending games with other dubs, talking to them etc,,, would Dublin fans on the whole buy into the new reality and support their new "counties",, or would there be a drop off in interest,, kind of a "unified Dublin or nothing" situation.
If my county was split into 2 I'm not sure I'd be as emotionally invested in the new set up as the old one tbh."
Interest would drop off massively in the inter County game imo.

It could take successive generations of country migration back into Dublin for the new teams to take hold.

Just like it took until the 1950s for GAA to take hold in any real way amongst Dubliners.

This would be especially true if there's a split of Dublin and nothing else done to address the imbalances elsewhere I think.

If the split of Dublin was in conjunction with a major overhaul of the inter County teams then it would have a much better chance imo.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13493 - 08/12/2020 11:51:24    2320169

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Replying To Galway9801:  "If Dublin is split into 2/3/4,,, (if),,, from your experience living in the capital,, and attending games with other dubs, talking to them etc,,, would Dublin fans on the whole buy into the new reality and support their new "counties",, or would there be a drop off in interest,, kind of a "unified Dublin or nothing" situation.
If my county was split into 2 I'm not sure I'd be as emotionally invested in the new set up as the old one tbh."
I think its a silly suggestion myself. The Dublin team at present are a seriously naturally talented group who have obviously benefited from financial funding throughout the underage structures. That much is true.

I think though other counties more than likely also have a lot of talented individuals too but they just need access to the same level of development and structures Dublin players get.

This has nothing to do with popluation etc. It's enabling counties to put the correct structures in place. They need the money the dubs get to do that. But Dublin are the flagship teams as far as GAA central management are concerned.

You see by splitting Dublin in two you would be enabling the creation of two super powers. That wouldn't be good.

daytona11 (Kildare) - Posts: 4006 - 08/12/2020 11:57:35    2320173

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Replying To Galway9801:  "If Dublin is split into 2/3/4,,, (if),,, from your experience living in the capital,, and attending games with other dubs, talking to them etc,,, would Dublin fans on the whole buy into the new reality and support their new "counties",, or would there be a drop off in interest,, kind of a "unified Dublin or nothing" situation.
If my county was split into 2 I'm not sure I'd be as emotionally invested in the new set up as the old one tbh."
I can't see it being well supported. If you consider what a 4 way split in your own county would do to support, the same would apply. As per other cities, the local government splits are invisible to the population on a day to day basis and there is no allegiance to a district such as SDCC, Fingal, DL/Rath or DC. A North/South split may be more successful but I still think that a large majority wouldn't buy into the breaking up of almost 150 years of inter-county history and tradition. Perhaps if the GAA announced a countrywide overhaul consisting of amalgamations and splits then it might get more support but I can't see anything other than that getting support from fans.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4497 - 08/12/2020 12:35:28    2320193

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A Cavan man is a Cavan man.
A Kerry man is a Kerry man.
A Mayo man is a Mayo man.

But what is a "Dublin man"? As a county it is a melting pot. Dublin just doesn't have a coherent identity on the same terms as the rest of the country. There is a massive cultural divide among Dublin people. North vs South, blue collar vs white collar, public vs private school.

So why would it pain someone from Drumcondra if his new Dublin team didn't contain players from Dun Laoighire?

Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 08/12/2020 12:57:56    2320202

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Replying To Cavan_Shambles:  "A Cavan man is a Cavan man.
A Kerry man is a Kerry man.
A Mayo man is a Mayo man.

But what is a "Dublin man"? As a county it is a melting pot. Dublin just doesn't have a coherent identity on the same terms as the rest of the country. There is a massive cultural divide among Dublin people. North vs South, blue collar vs white collar, public vs private school.

So why would it pain someone from Drumcondra if his new Dublin team didn't contain players from Dun Laoighire?"
Dubliner or Dub.

Anyone from, or even just living in the city or county is a Dub if they want to be.

It's pretty simple really.

It's a diverse county in terms of wealth, religion, ethnic background etc but I don't see it anymore divided than any other county to be honest.

The fact you're using the North v South divide in terms of public v private etc shows that you don't have much knowledge of the city and county. That's OK, as I don't know much about the difference between Virginia and Blacklion.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13493 - 08/12/2020 13:36:16    2320220

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You think football is finished now? Split Dublin and watch it die!

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8372 - 08/12/2020 13:43:32    2320227

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Replying To Cavan_Shambles:  "A Cavan man is a Cavan man.
A Kerry man is a Kerry man.
A Mayo man is a Mayo man.

But what is a "Dublin man"? As a county it is a melting pot. Dublin just doesn't have a coherent identity on the same terms as the rest of the country. There is a massive cultural divide among Dublin people. North vs South, blue collar vs white collar, public vs private school.

So why would it pain someone from Drumcondra if his new Dublin team didn't contain players from Dun Laoighire?"
What is this massive cultural divide that you speak of? I've lived in Dublin all of my life and your perception here is way off the mark. You'll get every kind of collar on both sides of the liffey.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4497 - 08/12/2020 13:45:34    2320229

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Replying To Cavan_Shambles:  "A Cavan man is a Cavan man.
A Kerry man is a Kerry man.
A Mayo man is a Mayo man.

But what is a "Dublin man"? As a county it is a melting pot. Dublin just doesn't have a coherent identity on the same terms as the rest of the country. There is a massive cultural divide among Dublin people. North vs South, blue collar vs white collar, public vs private school.

So why would it pain someone from Drumcondra if his new Dublin team didn't contain players from Dun Laoighire?"
Poor attempt.

Jackeen (Dublin) - Posts: 4093 - 08/12/2020 13:47:22    2320231

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Replying To MesAmis:  "Dubliner or Dub.

Anyone from, or even just living in the city or county is a Dub if they want to be.

It's pretty simple really.

It's a diverse county in terms of wealth, religion, ethnic background etc but I don't see it anymore divided than any other county to be honest.

The fact you're using the North v South divide in terms of public v private etc shows that you don't have much knowledge of the city and county. That's OK, as I don't know much about the difference between Virginia and Blacklion."
I have plenty of knowledge of the type of cultural divide that exists there, mainly from the fact that I lived in it for years, and most of my family are Dubs.

Virginia and Blacklion are not particularly different places, both small rural villages in Cavan who enjoy Gaelic football.
Can the same be said for Ranelagh and Ballymun? Stillorgan and Tallaght? Swords and Dun Laoghire?

The answer is no. You see where I'm coming from.

Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 08/12/2020 13:47:48    2320232

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GAA would be killed stone dead in Dublin.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4273 - 08/12/2020 14:03:57    2320237

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Be Jaysus the cavan lads have become very vocal on the Dubs since they got eaten alive by them, stings a bit doesn't it!

lilypad (Kildare) - Posts: 1363 - 08/12/2020 14:07:50    2320239

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Replying To Jackeen:  "Poor attempt."
Why would football die if dublin were split realdub?

From 87 to 2011 there was a great championship with lots of teams winning the big prize with 10 different winners in 24 years, in the last 10 years the dubs will have won 8/10 from now on its safe to say dublin will win 8/10 in every decade, will that not kill football?

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 08/12/2020 14:13:54    2320240

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Replying To TheUsername:  "GAA would be killed stone dead in Dublin."
Bit like what's happening senior intercounty football in multiple counties

bostonredsox (Wexford) - Posts: 4368 - 08/12/2020 14:17:47    2320244

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Replying To Cavan_Shambles:  "I have plenty of knowledge of the type of cultural divide that exists there, mainly from the fact that I lived in it for years, and most of my family are Dubs.

Virginia and Blacklion are not particularly different places, both small rural villages in Cavan who enjoy Gaelic football.
Can the same be said for Ranelagh and Ballymun? Stillorgan and Tallaght? Swords and Dun Laoghire?

The answer is no. You see where I'm coming from."
Stillorgan and Tallaght are both on the Southside. How about Howth v Crumlin, Castleknock v Ballyfermot and so on. You'll get all kinds on both sides of the liffey. Speak to your family if most of them are Dubs and they'll give you the lowdown.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4497 - 08/12/2020 14:26:33    2320246

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Replying To Cavan_Shambles:  "I have plenty of knowledge of the type of cultural divide that exists there, mainly from the fact that I lived in it for years, and most of my family are Dubs.

Virginia and Blacklion are not particularly different places, both small rural villages in Cavan who enjoy Gaelic football.
Can the same be said for Ranelagh and Ballymun? Stillorgan and Tallaght? Swords and Dun Laoghire?

The answer is no. You see where I'm coming from."
So there's no difference between Blacklion and Virginia and no similarities between Ballymun and Ranelagh?

I see the point you're making but I just don't think it's the winning argument you think it is.

You do realise that if Dublin was split in four that Ballymun and Ranelagh would still be in the same area team?

All these, real and imagined cultural divides exist in all four of the administration areas of Dublin in anyways!

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13493 - 08/12/2020 14:34:43    2320247

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God, there is some strange stuff on here. To deny Dublin people an identity is fairly low, and not worth commentating on really. But it's nasty.

But in general I think there is a heap of misconception about Dublin's funding. It is primarily development funding for areas where the GAA is underdeveloped. It isn't going on elite clubs or elite players. Every county has urban areas where the game is not as strong as it should be, but instead of focusing on on increasing participation counties are focusing on ego projects or quick fixes. But the urban / rural divide for the GAA isn't only a Dublin / rest of Ireland thing, it is within every county and most counties are not addressing it.

Dublin spend a decent amount on inter county activities, but it is along the same lines as Kerry and Mayo. Probably less on the senior football team when it is considered that hurling would be funded to a higher degree on Dublin. But the spend on the senior team is not outside the realms of possibility for most of the larger counties. So if it guarantees success, why don't they do it. The answer is that it doesn't guarantee success as we have seen from a number of counties.

Dublin senior footballers are the beneficiaries of decent training and good knowledge and structures. But nothing they have got is remotely out of the reach of any other county. Gyms are gyms where-ever they are. Likewise a pitch is a pitch (and there is much better examples then the Innisfail's one they currently train on). Dublin have no expensive outside managers. I assume the technical guys in the background team get some recompense, but again what in reality here is the cost of this? The cost of getting 36 guys fit and trained and keeping them that way is not beyond the reach of most counties. You can't buy better weights or better footballs, they just are what they are. Sure it's not for nothing, but manageable for a lot of counties.

Dublin have two advantages, (three if you include having better footballers at the moment). They have a bigger population to leverage and a smarter management structure. On the population, they do not have the most amount of registered players, Cork does - but they have worked harder then other counties to bring them in the most amount of people they can. Practically every other county (except maybe Kerry) have loads of room to increase participation, but they don't do it. Unless you maximize your own resources you shouldn't be complaining about other people. But long term population will be a problem particularly if Dublin continue to grow the sport. There are a few fixes for this, sure one is to reduce the size of Dublin by splitting it, but the other is to increase the size of other places by amalgamations. But even the splitting option is of limited value - the Dublin team usually includes between 10 to 12 guys from an area of North Dublin that would hardly have a radius 10km. Maybe a team from this area only would beat Cavan by 11 or 12 points instead of 15, but the difference wouldn't be massive.

There are definite improvements that can be made, but if people are only looking at it from the point of view of stopping Dublin, or bringing up their own county it is not going to work. The Dublin success is due to selflessness, they went out and tried to increase participation without focusing on immediate success. They also funded hurling very heavily, something that is more or less ignored in some other counties. A solution is needed, but I don't think it will be found in these pages of ill informed comment (not all) and borderline racism of denying Dublin people an identity.

dougal123 (Louth) - Posts: 9 - 08/12/2020 14:48:18    2320249

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