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Football Is Finished

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "in all honesty what any team spends on a team holiday is only relevant to the counties involved and supporters who might have contributed.The gaa did nt pay for Kerry s holiday.it was done by fundraising and donations from Kerry supporters.Dublin go on big holidays also with all the frills.I agree that teams deserve a holiday with mentors wives and girlfriends and I contribute myself to both Kerry and Dublin team holidays in a small way.I don't like the hangers on getting free holidays out of supporters donations though."
Mick username lost the funding battle to Genius Gerry last week and now he's just swiping out wildly at anything kerry.

Take no notice of him, sure he reckons he has the vaccine to the dublin football problem, I mean how this fella hasn't been picked up by an intercounty team at this stage il never know.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 13621 - 12/12/2020 21:05:25    2321702

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Replying To KillingFields:  "What team field sport at the top elite level employs a handicap in scoring?
Teams need more games in their primary competition of the year. Its ridiculous that many counties could play more games in their pre season leagues than in the championship."
It's amazing the speed that you seem to reduce a problem to its essentials albeit in your predictive replies to many posts on any subject matter simply by scanning the content, so let's try and keep it simple, here goes.
Firstly, I suggested in getting rid of the Back Door system as this year's knock out championship has proven it contradicts the window dressing exercise it brought into the game, etc,etc,etc.

Secondly I suggested in bringing in a score handicap, you ask, "What team field sport at the top elite level employs a handicap in scoring?" My answer, Gaelic games in my view doesn't facilitated the word "elite" you brought that word into this debate not me and that is what is partly wrong with our games today as in elitism, meanwhile back to the score handicap, I'm not aware of any team field sport at the top "elite" level that employs a handicap in scoring system, to me that's an insignificant comparator, however, our beloved game of Golf that has a massive membership and following right across the country and has a very user-friendly and successful handicap system in operation, elitism included, if it can be successful in the game of Golf, can't see any reason why it can't be applied to gaelic games.

As for it being ridiculous that many counties could play more games in their pre season leagues than in the championship; that's another argument for another day,

supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2463 - 12/12/2020 21:10:16    2321705

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "in all honesty what any team spends on a team holiday is only relevant to the counties involved and supporters who might have contributed.The gaa did nt pay for Kerry s holiday.it was done by fundraising and donations from Kerry supporters.Dublin go on big holidays also with all the frills.I agree that teams deserve a holiday with mentors wives and girlfriends and I contribute myself to both Kerry and Dublin team holidays in a small way.I don't like the hangers on getting free holidays out of supporters donations though."
Wouldn't disagree Mick, I wouldn't begrudge players having a holiday or any perk they get out of the game really.

But the cost and scale is a long way from the image projected on the previous page of county board members doing tin rattle collections outside church's as was mentioned.

The Kerry county board topped up the holiday fund I believe to the tune of 10's of thousands, again I don't have an issue with that, but you could imagine the reaction if the DCB did the same thing.

Have to say 300k is an eye watering figure I was surprised at, I'm sure other counties are the same

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4150 - 12/12/2020 22:11:09    2321725

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Football is not finished, I expect and hope Mayo will show up these doom merchants in the All Ireland final. But where is Meath and where is Kildare. Why are these two giant counties population wise, not putting it up to the Dubs in Leinster.
Maybe Meath should amalgamate with West Meath, and Kildare with Laois and Offaly.

galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 2273 - 12/12/2020 22:17:08    2321727

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Replying To galwayford:  "Football is not finished, I expect and hope Mayo will show up these doom merchants in the All Ireland final. But where is Meath and where is Kildare. Why are these two giant counties population wise, not putting it up to the Dubs in Leinster.
Maybe Meath should amalgamate with West Meath, and Kildare with Laois and Offaly."
Agreed. These county boards are getting away with murder. Meath for example has regressed horribly over the last 20 years,, when their population boom should have seen an improvement,, ditto kildare .
I'd say the fellas running those shows are delighted to see so much focus on the dubs.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 936 - 12/12/2020 23:08:05    2321729

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Replying To galwayford:  "Football is not finished, I expect and hope Mayo will show up these doom merchants in the All Ireland final. But where is Meath and where is Kildare. Why are these two giant counties population wise, not putting it up to the Dubs in Leinster.
Maybe Meath should amalgamate with West Meath, and Kildare with Laois and Offaly."
You're right I have Meath/Westmeath/Longford and also Kildare/Laois/Offaly in my proposal for amalgamated teams.

ONdeDITCH (Limerick) - Posts: 863 - 12/12/2020 23:24:24    2321735

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Replying To galwayford:  "Football is not finished, I expect and hope Mayo will show up these doom merchants in the All Ireland final. But where is Meath and where is Kildare. Why are these two giant counties population wise, not putting it up to the Dubs in Leinster.
Maybe Meath should amalgamate with West Meath, and Kildare with Laois and Offaly."
its not doom and gloom its stating the obvious for the last 4/5 years.....such rediculous proposals...amalgamations are not going to happen so dont waste time proposing them...its only a post discussing the obvious demise of football while Dublin seem to have all the ingredients to dominate...Kerry and Mayo and Tyrone and Donegal possibly only counties who, on a good day with Dublin having a terrible day MIGHT beat them, but even that is unlikely...no doom and gloom its only a discussion thread...

Fairplayalways (Offaly) - Posts: 866 - 12/12/2020 23:26:05    2321736

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "The Championship has to be restructured, tiered and funded properly. And anyone who thinks a tiered championship wouldn't work is not worth listening to. It works at club level yet at county level it is deemed some sort of insult to be asked to play in the B competition. Make it rewarding, do it right and it can work because what we have now doesn't work."
I can't think of a single argument against a tiered championship,, however I have no idea how it will be funded properly or incentivised.
I've said numerous times that outside of the Sam Maguire cup,, the GAA avd media will prioritise the growth of the women's game in the coming years and this will come at the expense of any 2nd or 3rd tier competition.
Counties in the 3rd tier and most in the 2nd tier will be almost completely forgotten, in my opinion anyway. This could include teams like Cork, roscommon, derry, tipperary, meath, Westmeath, all of whom are bad enough to drop to division 3.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 936 - 12/12/2020 23:30:28    2321737

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Replying To galwayford:  "Football is not finished, I expect and hope Mayo will show up these doom merchants in the All Ireland final. But where is Meath and where is Kildare. Why are these two giant counties population wise, not putting it up to the Dubs in Leinster.
Maybe Meath should amalgamate with West Meath, and Kildare with Laois and Offaly."
None of these lads need worry once there's a bigger fish to fry. The news is over there boys don't be bothered with us
Badly organised and easier to blame someone else.

catch22 (USA) - Posts: 2148 - 12/12/2020 23:48:32    2321740

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Replying To TheUsername:  "Wouldn't disagree Mick, I wouldn't begrudge players having a holiday or any perk they get out of the game really.

But the cost and scale is a long way from the image projected on the previous page of county board members doing tin rattle collections outside church's as was mentioned.

The Kerry county board topped up the holiday fund I believe to the tune of 10's of thousands, again I don't have an issue with that, but you could imagine the reaction if the DCB did the same thing.

Have to say 300k is an eye watering figure I was surprised at, I'm sure other counties are the same"
Yes Username.The cost of the trip is mind boggling.Kerry were one of the first counties to start the exotic far away holidays which a lot of the big teams do now.I think Dubs went to Bali at the start of the year.Now most holidays as ive said are done by fundraising and I don't begrudge those involved.However I know if you win the all Ireland the gaa make a nice contribution to the winning teams holiday fund for both football and hurling.The figures a couple a couple of years ago was 80 grand each.I think league winners also get a much smaller donation but don't know the exact figures there.The 80,000 was for 2017 so im not sure whether the amount has increased or decreased since.Plenty of money to go around still but I do think its sad that money cannot be pumped into the counties that need it more.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2745 - 13/12/2020 01:00:19    2321751

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Replying To TheUsername:  "Wouldn't disagree Mick, I wouldn't begrudge players having a holiday or any perk they get out of the game really.

But the cost and scale is a long way from the image projected on the previous page of county board members doing tin rattle collections outside church's as was mentioned.

The Kerry county board topped up the holiday fund I believe to the tune of 10's of thousands, again I don't have an issue with that, but you could imagine the reaction if the DCB did the same thing.

Have to say 300k is an eye watering figure I was surprised at, I'm sure other counties are the same"
just on team holidays.I came across Galway hurlers spent 300,000e on their trip after all Ireland win eventhough county board in debt.Looking at a lot of money issues for teams is travel and hotel bills which are huge.Mayo spent over 370 grand in 2017 on route final after playing 8 games(7 0f which were away games).we can all talk about money till the cows go home but the plain and simple facts are that to even compete at the top level a lot of money is needed.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 2745 - 13/12/2020 01:29:48    2321753

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A holiday fund no problem these teams deserve that much. But what is not deserved is being a full time professional sportsman in an ametur organisation which is what dublin are about. Let's stop throwing up shadow screens here to protect what has gone wrong in the game
Of gaelic football. I urge you to read a book called.. In the name of the father. Written by j. J. Barrett it will give an insight into what this organisation of the gaa is all about and it sure was not founded to be an money oriented organisation as it is in Dublin today. Give them a car. Give them a holiday.. Give them expenses for travel etc. But do not give them 3/4 months off in the year to train and play. That is called being a professional and it is not a level playing field for all.. God bless the true gaels

traleegerry (Kerry) - Posts: 738 - 13/12/2020 03:28:14    2321757

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Replying To Galway9801:  "Agreed. These county boards are getting away with murder. Meath for example has regressed horribly over the last 20 years,, when their population boom should have seen an improvement,, ditto kildare .
I'd say the fellas running those shows are delighted to see so much focus on the dubs."
Kildare/Meath willing on Dublin neXt sunday, no doubt about it...keep them going throughout the winter moaning ..

They are invading threads complaining about the game and it unfairness, trying to bring other counties in to it..
Not on...!!
Boring at this stage..

In all fairness could you actually trust any of these counties with money... if they were funded ??

Their structures are Mickey Mouse and are clearly outdated, and it will take a decade to catch up with likes of
Kerry/Donegal/Mayo/Tyrone/galways of this world ....but most of these teams have structures in place , or in the process of doing so, and are more likely to challenge Dublin rather than regresses backwards over the next decade or so..

Leinster counties have fallen off a cliff.
That's the reality

BeJasus (UK) - Posts: 383 - 13/12/2020 03:57:49    2321759

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Mick username lost the funding battle to Genius Gerry last week and now he's just swiping out wildly at anything kerry.

Take no notice of him, sure he reckons he has the vaccine to the dublin football problem, I mean how this fella hasn't been picked up by an intercounty team at this stage il never know."
KBoy, can you direct me to the evidence of where the genius Gerry defeated username in the funding battle? It should make for some good readings, if nothing else.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 702 - 13/12/2020 06:02:04    2321763

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Replying To galwayford:  "Football is not finished, I expect and hope Mayo will show up these doom merchants in the All Ireland final. But where is Meath and where is Kildare. Why are these two giant counties population wise, not putting it up to the Dubs in Leinster.
Maybe Meath should amalgamate with West Meath, and Kildare with Laois and Offaly."
I get where you are coming from but it won't see the passion straight away anyway. I f we had to tag up with Armagh I'd feel very weird. It is not the same. Imagine Galway had to join with Mayo. What on earth would you call that team..Galyo? Mayway? That is not the biggest issue, I couldn't fully get behind a team that was mixed, if we joined with armagh I would barely celebrate an AI, it would take a very long time , prob 3 generations before kids and family come around to Tymagh.

I have a degree in history before I winded up is psych, but I know every division in history usually unifies over war, example Germany pre ww1 was diveded in the 1800's much like us with NI and the south with catholics and protestants. They hated each other. Under a man named bismark they went to war with another country and it brought them all together and he created modern germany in terms of a collective German identity(through war )...so I guess in theory, in the face of an outside threat, Tymagh beating Dublin would unify it as a county. . but this stuff takes time.

I feel weird about it but anything I guess to beat Dublin.

Up tymagh

GameofTyronesIsBackhere (Tyrone) - Posts: 46 - 13/12/2020 06:43:19    2321764

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Replying To supersub15:  "It's amazing the speed that you seem to reduce a problem to its essentials albeit in your predictive replies to many posts on any subject matter simply by scanning the content, so let's try and keep it simple, here goes.
Firstly, I suggested in getting rid of the Back Door system as this year's knock out championship has proven it contradicts the window dressing exercise it brought into the game, etc,etc,etc.

Secondly I suggested in bringing in a score handicap, you ask, "What team field sport at the top elite level employs a handicap in scoring?" My answer, Gaelic games in my view doesn't facilitated the word "elite" you brought that word into this debate not me and that is what is partly wrong with our games today as in elitism, meanwhile back to the score handicap, I'm not aware of any team field sport at the top "elite" level that employs a handicap in scoring system, to me that's an insignificant comparator, however, our beloved game of Golf that has a massive membership and following right across the country and has a very user-friendly and successful handicap system in operation, elitism included, if it can be successful in the game of Golf, can't see any reason why it can't be applied to gaelic games.

As for it being ridiculous that many counties could play more games in their pre season leagues than in the championship; that's another argument for another day,"
It can't employed in team sports and no other team sport gives one team a score handicap. Drop the stupid proposals and you might get people to take you seriously.

Straight knockout football is also crap and I was happy to see the nostalgia wear off after the SFs.

Rolo2010 (Donegal) - Posts: 439 - 13/12/2020 07:35:37    2321771

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "Yeah or have a league and championship combination with seedlings based on finishing positions. There are many, many ways."
League followed by straight knockout tiered championship based on final placings.

Or a tiered championship with a group stage followed by a knockout stage. 1st and 2nd go into QFs. Put in a system to avoid repeat pairings at the SF stage and you'd have a good championship. Same for Tier 2. Bottom 4 in Tier 1 go into relegation SFs.

Let's say the we have the following groups:

A: Kerry, Roscommon, Westmeath, Clare
B: Galway, Armagh, Kildare, Down
C: Dublin, Mayo, Donegal, Cork
D: Monaghan, Tyrone, Meath, Laois

Group C would be the one to watch.

Likely QFs:

Kerry v Armagh
Dublin v Monaghan

Galway v Roscommon
Tyrone v Mayo

I've placed the A and C group winners on one side of the draw to avoid a repeat pairing in the SFs which isn't important but does make for a unique draw.

Rolo2010 (Donegal) - Posts: 439 - 13/12/2020 08:05:19    2321774

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Replying To Galway9801:  "Agreed. These county boards are getting away with murder. Meath for example has regressed horribly over the last 20 years,, when their population boom should have seen an improvement,, ditto kildare .
I'd say the fellas running those shows are delighted to see so much focus on the dubs."
Very hard to disagree with this. There is no reason for meath and kildare not to me more competitive. Take dublin out of it and would meath or kildare for all irelands and the answer is realistically no and that's not good enough. They've both expanding populations with none of the commuting, migration/emigration challenges that the western counties have. Hopefully the money put into easy leinster project will bear fruit for them though it would seem that the gaa is just putting the plate in front of them as opposed to them doing enough themselves?
Why for example did the meath under 20 team perform so poorly this year despite decent minor teams in the last few years. Do they do any development between minor and under 20? Dublin seem to be miles ahead in this area. They look to have a decent minor team this year, beating both dublin and westmeath comfortably. In 2/3 years will dublin make the ground up and beat them again at under 20? Hopefully it will come though I'm not sure.

Ulsterchamps_32 (Donegal) - Posts: 454 - 13/12/2020 09:38:46    2321789

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Just on the holidays I was initially taken aback by the cost as well. But when you work it out you are talking about panel, coaches, county board and then partners etc you are probably looking at 90-100 people on the trip. The going rate for a 10 day inclusive holiday all in would be in and around the €3k so I can see how it would amount to €300k

It's an awful lot of money and I'm not trying to defend or condemn it, just trying to offer an explanation for the seemingly huge cost.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2098 - 13/12/2020 09:43:54    2321790

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More than football finished. Yous have little to be talkin about. Heads out of sand time was ages ago.

Live_Wire (Monaghan) - Posts: 37 - 13/12/2020 10:05:48    2321794

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