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Dublin's Success Not Down To Money - GAA President

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Replying To oneoff:  "Some of them will write paragraphs of more or less nothing to try and make themselfs look intelligent, yet wont answer a very simple quetion when it's put to them"
A really unintelligent post .

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2842 - 14/06/2019 22:26:01    2195095

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Replying To Joxer:  "What centre of excellence? What stadium? Dubs want to play at the Neller, our home. Trust me. Put your self in our shoes for a minute. Home league games in a quarter full freezing stadium with no atmosphere v a tightly packed Neller with the fans breathing on opposition players' necks. Now think about this. Which would Dublin fans prefer? Which would opposition players prefer?"
Oh good God....Dublin doesn't have a center of excellence because they've be using state of the art facilities built by the college's around Dublin.

Dublin's stadium is not fit for purpose so you've been using the one the GAA built. If the CB wanted to build their own, they could. Guess what. They don't want to.

Therefore Dublin's capital outlay has been much smaller than most of the other counties of Ireland.

This is what I talk about when I say Dublin has all the advantages.

I will say this, they have been excellent at taking advantage of their advantages. In fairness to them. They are doing their job expertly.

SallinsMan (Kildare) - Posts: 77 - 14/06/2019 23:00:27    2195104

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Replying To KY4SAM2015:  "Yes no point even reading through them long winding excuses with facts and figures til the cows come home.

Simple point is that they have had a massive help from the Gaa which is plain to see to any reasonable person.

Thats the bottom line as you know who said so."
15 v 15. Get your medals out lad and stop making excuses.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4744 - 14/06/2019 23:55:09    2195116

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To say that money hasn't been the main instigator in Dublin's success is just patent nonsense of the highest order. Croke Park's 16 million Euros has allowed Dublin's young players to take advantage of good coaching and facilities and consequently any talent they had has been nurtured, encouraged and grown in the best of environments and surroundings. It is interesting that the only ones defending the status quo are Dubs, Dub officials, Croke Park and 'diminishing' elements of the media. It is myopic self interest on the part of these elements and all they can see is Dublin success and the money that flows from that. Thankfully more responsible and not as easily influenced journalists can see where Gaelic football is going and are starting to ask the right questions. The Association has buried it's head and is shouting deflective 'look squirrel' when this comes up. We have a saying up here "Don't p*ss on my back and tell me it's raining". That's what the GAA are doing at the minute, treating the rest of us like fools.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9818 - 15/06/2019 00:47:07    2195126

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Replying To Joxer:  "I know this is radical but could the "demise" of the game be down to systems introduced around 2011, Donegal duvet v Dublin for example, that just happened to coincide with Dublin's emergence? Mass defence has been a blight on the game since Kernan, McGuinness and Harte perfected it. Make no mistake, Dublin implemented various degrees of it since 2014 and that Donegal lesson but in general this park the bus tactic has destroyed the game and then planted the seed that anything other than this tactic couldn't be used to compete with the Jacks. Thankfully Mayo proved the opposite. But that blight on the game has to be addressed. Teams 8 points down and still defending en-masse hoping to hand pass their way to overcome a near double-digit deficit. Not gonna happen against real teams. Continuous rule tweaking or change in coaching culture required. Former so far but no real improvement."
I'm sorry but you are conveniently forgetting Pat Gilroy went ultra defensive for most of 2010. Pre McGuinness.

Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 15/06/2019 01:01:08    2195128

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Replying To Joxer:  "Yes 1 in Cork, 1 in Limerick and 1 in Antrim. What's your point? There's only 1 Brazilian soccer team too and 1 in Denmark. They are not club competitions they are geographical."
But Brazil do not get all of the fifa money to fund there soccer team like Dublin. Brazil dont play all there games at home imagine every world cup was held in Brazil?

brisbane (Galway) - Posts: 675 - 15/06/2019 02:15:19    2195133

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Replying To brisbane:  "But Brazil do not get all of the fifa money to fund there soccer team like Dublin. Brazil dont play all there games at home imagine every world cup was held in Brazil?"
Yeah but their players are the best paid in the world and their football association is one of the richest in the world. The TV rights to games involving Brazil are some of the most lucrative in the world. Compare this to Ireland and the FAI. Dublin playing "all of their games at home"??? I still laugh.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4744 - 15/06/2019 09:53:08    2195166

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Replying To Jack_Goff:  "I'm sorry but you are conveniently forgetting Pat Gilroy went ultra defensive for most of 2010. Pre McGuinness."
Yeah that's because Dublin had the floor wiped with then in the two previous years. Big Joe Kernan had invented and mastered the blanket when at the helm of Armagh before Gilroy. McGuinness brought it to an incredible level in 2011. I don't know where Meath were during all of this, rowing over managerial appointments probably.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4744 - 15/06/2019 09:57:24    2195169

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Replying To Joxer:  "Yeah that's because Dublin had the floor wiped with then in the two previous years. Big Joe Kernan had invented and mastered the blanket when at the helm of Armagh before Gilroy. McGuinness brought it to an incredible level in 2011. I don't know where Meath were during all of this, rowing over managerial appointments probably."
Scratching their heads wondering where the next golden generation was on the way

Unfortunately for Meath they greatly over achieved with back to back great teams

Meath achieved 4 out of 7 All Ireland's across a short enough period of time under one man. Completely unsustainable given their previous 3 wins across many decades and it spoiled them rotten. They got use to it without really understanding where it had come from and doing very little when times were good to maintain it.

The man that achieved 4 of their 7 left, players got old and that was that.

They went through many managers in a short space of time chasing the good times, thinking it was a management issue. I don't blame them when one manager won 4 but he only did that off the back of two golden crops of players back to back

It was an extraordinary anomaly in Meath GAA and the stars aligned to put Boylan in place at that time with those great players

Such sets of factors are very rare and nothing like that had come before it in Meath

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 15/06/2019 10:36:09    2195183

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Interesting to hear Cheddar Plunket speaking recently about funding in Dublin hurling. He reckons the funds originally earmarked for hurling in Dublin in the early noughties was eventually 'hijacked' by the football development in Dublin. I sure would like to hear him expand on this. Was it just coincidence that it was the footballers that flourished after so much money was thrown at hurling in the capital?

ZUL10 (Clare) - Posts: 708 - 15/06/2019 10:54:18    2195187

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I don't really mind the bit narrative and hype when it comes to our footballers to be honest.

I don't believe the success is funded to be honest and I've looked into it in great detail to be honest and tried to look at it with an open mind.

It's very hard to have a good discussion on it because on these threads you find people just vent and stick to dogmatic stuff in an entrenched position.

The one advantage I would acknowledge is the Croke Park, if your not playing Dublin in Croke Park your playing in a lifeless stadium, if you are playing then there your the away team, mostly in support, but even not your not depressing Croke Park from Dublin or Dublin from Croke Park, it's a part of what Dublin is.

Part of me wants to perpetuate money narrative, it serves to purposes one I think its a comfort blanket for supporters of other counties to say, we are not gash at football if we had Dublins money .,........:!

Secondly I think it seeping out there into the heads of the players, it's adding to the aura around Dublin and more and more creating a fear amongst county players. In the past two seasons I can't think of a team we've played in the championship that believed they were going to beat us, just can't. I think you have to go back to the 17 final.

Now don't get me wrong I think we are a have like the rest and majority of Div 1 Div 2 counties, rather then a have not. We don't want fir anything.

But I'm pretty comfortable with what we do financially, have yet to see a decent analytical smoking gun and certainly having looked into it detail can sit back and just enjoy the ball.

I'm happy enough for journos and anyone on here to keep taking swings, I really think it's undermining of any opposition we face, it's just adding to our aura really.

Jacks are back! ;)

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4517 - 15/06/2019 11:28:31    2195197

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Replying To SallinsMan:  "Oh good God....Dublin doesn't have a center of excellence because they've be using state of the art facilities built by the college's around Dublin.

Dublin's stadium is not fit for purpose so you've been using the one the GAA built. If the CB wanted to build their own, they could. Guess what. They don't want to.

Therefore Dublin's capital outlay has been much smaller than most of the other counties of Ireland.

This is what I talk about when I say Dublin has all the advantages.

I will say this, they have been excellent at taking advantage of their advantages. In fairness to them. They are doing their job expertly."
They were well able to spend 9 million on a 20 acre site in south Dublin and they are landlords to a few business down there, if they can afford to do that then why have got to take the GAAs money,

Like you say they have no real stadium to upkeep or have to build a center of excellence, I'd say the 12 million centre of excellence built on their door step but it's theyre for the whole country by the way.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 15/06/2019 11:53:24    2195206

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If, as John Horan says Dublin's success is down volunteerism as opposed to €1.8 million per annum being pumped in to Dublin GAA in games development grants whilst Cork who are next highest in terms of games development grants receive €140,000 per annum then it is time to hugely reduce the grants Dublin receive and redistribute them to the other 31 counties on a more equitable basis . Volunteerism will ensure Dublin's continued success ,

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6180 - 15/06/2019 12:14:01    2195213

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Replying To jimbodub:  "Scratching their heads wondering where the next golden generation was on the way

Unfortunately for Meath they greatly over achieved with back to back great teams

Meath achieved 4 out of 7 All Ireland's across a short enough period of time under one man. Completely unsustainable given their previous 3 wins across many decades and it spoiled them rotten. They got use to it without really understanding where it had come from and doing very little when times were good to maintain it.

The man that achieved 4 of their 7 left, players got old and that was that.

They went through many managers in a short space of time chasing the good times, thinking it was a management issue. I don't blame them when one manager won 4 but he only did that off the back of two golden crops of players back to back

It was an extraordinary anomaly in Meath GAA and the stars aligned to put Boylan in place at that time with those great players

Such sets of factors are very rare and nothing like that had come before it in Meath"
Waffle.

David (Meath) - Posts: 567 - 15/06/2019 12:39:25    2195221

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Replying To Greengrass:  "If, as John Horan says Dublin's success is down volunteerism as opposed to €1.8 million per annum being pumped in to Dublin GAA in games development grants whilst Cork who are next highest in terms of games development grants receive €140,000 per annum then it is time to hugely reduce the grants Dublin receive and redistribute them to the other 31 counties on a more equitable basis . Volunteerism will ensure Dublin's continued success ,"
Completely agree. Lets see the volunteerism work its magic when a level financial playing field exists.

Ah well its always worth dreaming!

David (Meath) - Posts: 567 - 15/06/2019 12:40:51    2195224

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Replying To Greengrass:  "If, as John Horan says Dublin's success is down volunteerism as opposed to €1.8 million per annum being pumped in to Dublin GAA in games development grants whilst Cork who are next highest in terms of games development grants receive €140,000 per annum then it is time to hugely reduce the grants Dublin receive and redistribute them to the other 31 counties on a more equitable basis . Volunteerism will ensure Dublin's continued success ,"
A perfect example of Ewan McKennaism there theflaker...

Completely skewed figures that have been debunked

Those figures do not tell of the other sources of funding that Cork etc receive that are unavailable to Dublin

It's a very skewed way of looking at the figures and doesn't tell in anyway the full and available sources of funding

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 15/06/2019 12:49:57    2195225

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Replying To Greengrass:  "If, as John Horan says Dublin's success is down volunteerism as opposed to €1.8 million per annum being pumped in to Dublin GAA in games development grants whilst Cork who are next highest in terms of games development grants receive €140,000 per annum then it is time to hugely reduce the grants Dublin receive and redistribute them to the other 31 counties on a more equitable basis . Volunteerism will ensure Dublin's continued success ,"
Gives us the facts of your proposal. How much per head of population should each county get? The population of Dublin is about 1.6m.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4744 - 15/06/2019 13:03:36    2195228

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Replying To David:  "Completely agree. Lets see the volunteerism work its magic when a level financial playing field exists.

Ah well its always worth dreaming!"
Like the 70s when Dublin and Kerry dominated, the 80s when Kerry dominated. Was that "financial doping" also? It is possible, you know, to put together a very good team without much money. This Dublin team were in their late teens, early 20s when Dublin started to get big money. It's not like it spawned them. It's amazing what a groundswell of organisation and hard work can achieve.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4744 - 15/06/2019 13:28:09    2195234

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Replying To jimbodub:  "Scratching their heads wondering where the next golden generation was on the way

Unfortunately for Meath they greatly over achieved with back to back great teams

Meath achieved 4 out of 7 All Ireland's across a short enough period of time under one man. Completely unsustainable given their previous 3 wins across many decades and it spoiled them rotten. They got use to it without really understanding where it had come from and doing very little when times were good to maintain it.

The man that achieved 4 of their 7 left, players got old and that was that.

They went through many managers in a short space of time chasing the good times, thinking it was a management issue. I don't blame them when one manager won 4 but he only did that off the back of two golden crops of players back to back

It was an extraordinary anomaly in Meath GAA and the stars aligned to put Boylan in place at that time with those great players

Such sets of factors are very rare and nothing like that had come before it in Meath"
That's not really accurate. It wasn't simply a case of a once off generation of players appearing out of nowhere. It was actually because Boylan started picking players who weren't playing for senior club teams and he made the county team the priority. Prior to that it was only players from senior clubs and club was the priority. Often times club games were scheduled at the same time as county matches and a lot of the best club players would stick with the club as it was considered to be a bigger deal. There was always good players just a very bad structure in place.

It is true though that the county board didn't make hay while the sun shined. Underage football was not looked after. The same issues still afflicted it. They picked all the players from the same big clubs. Lots of talented players just drifted from the game as a result.

One of the big advantages Meath had over Dublin in the 90s was actually greater investment. The owner of Kepak was very generous and a good friend of Boylans. While the likes of Dublin had poor training facilities and were badly looked after, the Meath lads were very well looked after. When Boylan started in the mid eighties they made sure lads had jobs. They'd be fed well, including Boylans own herbal potions and getting steaks from Kepak. They even had training camps abroad the odd time. They were provided with lots of advanced training gear at the time.

So you're right in saying that Boylan was important but there had always been good players. Boylan + investment and widening the pool of players to pick from was the key.

HighKings (Meath) - Posts: 271 - 15/06/2019 13:56:13    2195236

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Replying To Joxer:  "Gives us the facts of your proposal. How much per head of population should each county get? The population of Dublin is about 1.6m."
Dublin 1.6m. Cork 542,000. Latest figures I have (2008-2017) Dublin got ) )€18m and Cork got ) €1.4m . Cork have one third of Dublin's population yet they get one thirteenth of the money on average per year every year for ten years . Redistribute it proportionally nationwide . Meath have one eighth of Dublin's population yet they only get one eighteenth of Dublin's money . The games should be administered for everyone's benefit Joxer otherwise the competitions we all love will be damaged beyond repair . Leinster is already dead .

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6180 - 15/06/2019 14:09:07    2195237

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