Replying To JimB1991:  "No."]Provincials late jan - mid March.

League beginning end of March
Around 10 weeks to run off 7 rounds of the league.

Senior All Ireland:
Top 4 teams in division 1 straight to QF
7&8 division 1 play 3&4 division 2.
Winners go into prelim QF with 5&6 Div 1 and 1&2 Div2.

Intermediate:
5&6 Division 2 and 1&2 Division 3 straight to QF.
7&8 Division 2 play 5&6 Division 3
Winners go to prelim QF v 3&4 Division 3

Junior:
1&2 Division 4 straight to SF
7&8 Division 3 v 5&6 Division 4
Winners play 3&4 Division 4 in prelim SF


League promtion and relegations stay as is."]I like it - same general idea as my AILC.

Similarities:
Teams ranked 1-32
League ranking used for 3-tier AIC

Differences:
30 teams play in an AIC tier (I have 28)
4-tier league (I have 2)
7-game league phase (I have 12 or 10, with 'groups' reducing from 15)
Prov KO presumably separate (I double 'many' as league)
AIC tiers 12-10-8 (I have 8-12-8)

Possible error in yours (unless I don't understand)?
Senior (Sam) has 12 teams, so start with Prelim QFs?
5 v D2 4th; 6 v D2 3rd; 7 v D2 2nd; & 8 v D2 1st
Maybe you have another round that's not well presented?"]No you're right I've an error also think I spotted one in intermediate.
Both easily fixed though, straight to a prelim Quarters in the 12 team All Ireland.
In the intermediate the better performing league teams (5&6 Div2 and 1&2 Div3) get home Quarters and the first post league phase is a playoff to join them in the quarters.

Anyway the general idea is teams are playing plenty of games at their level deep into the year, much more even playing field running into an All Ireland series.
People will obviously argue it devalues provincials playing them early in the year and not linked to the All Ireland but you can't have everything and realistically provincial titles mean the most to the weaker counties, the shocks needed to make that happen are probably more likely to happen in January and February than in May.

No system is perfect but continuing to pretend that a team that wins Ulster or Leinster being at the exact same stage in the race for an All Ireland as a team that wins Munster is in anyway an acceptable system is just madness."]On your last paragraph, I would even say munster losers are in a better position than other provincial finalists?

Replying To JimB1991:  "No."]Provincials late jan - mid March.

League beginning end of March
Around 10 weeks to run off 7 rounds of the league.

Senior All Ireland:
Top 4 teams in division 1 straight to QF
7&8 division 1 play 3&4 division 2.
Winners go into prelim QF with 5&6 Div 1 and 1&2 Div2.

Intermediate:
5&6 Division 2 and 1&2 Division 3 straight to QF.
7&8 Division 2 play 5&6 Division 3
Winners go to prelim QF v 3&4 Division 3

Junior:
1&2 Division 4 straight to SF
7&8 Division 3 v 5&6 Division 4
Winners play 3&4 Division 4 in prelim SF


League promtion and relegations stay as is."]I like it - same general idea as my AILC.

Similarities:
Teams ranked 1-32
League ranking used for 3-tier AIC

Differences:
30 teams play in an AIC tier (I have 28)
4-tier league (I have 2)
7-game league phase (I have 12 or 10, with 'groups' reducing from 15)
Prov KO presumably separate (I double 'many' as league)
AIC tiers 12-10-8 (I have 8-12-8)

Possible error in yours (unless I don't understand)?
Senior (Sam) has 12 teams, so start with Prelim QFs?
5 v D2 4th; 6 v D2 3rd; 7 v D2 2nd; & 8 v D2 1st
Maybe you have another round that's not well presented?"]No you're right I've an error also think I spotted one in intermediate.
Both easily fixed though, straight to a prelim Quarters in the 12 team All Ireland.
In the intermediate the better performing league teams (5&6 Div2 and 1&2 Div3) get home Quarters and the first post league phase is a playoff to join them in the quarters.

Anyway the general idea is teams are playing plenty of games at their level deep into the year, much more even playing field running into an All Ireland series.
People will obviously argue it devalues provincials playing them early in the year and not linked to the All Ireland but you can't have everything and realistically provincial titles mean the most to the weaker counties, the shocks needed to make that happen are probably more likely to happen in January and February than in May.

No system is perfect but continuing to pretend that a team that wins Ulster or Leinster being at the exact same stage in the race for an All Ireland as a team that wins Munster is in anyway an acceptable system is just madness."]In hurling - the Munster Championship is all with the Leinster championship being an amalgamation of all the others.

I we really wanted to use provincials as the basis of a fair all Ireland race we would have to do the following

Mix Connacht with Leinster and Ulster with Munster.

A Connacht/Leinster championship with
Mayo v Longford
Galway v Wicklow
Roscommon v Carlow
Dublin V Leitrim
Meath V Sligo
Louth V Wexford
Kildare V London
Offaly V Westmeath

Then open draw qfinals - semis and final

Munster/ULster
Kerry - Antrim
Cork - Fermanagh
Donegal - New York
Armagh - Waterford
Tyrone - Tipperary
Monaghan - Limerick
Derry - Clare
Cavan - Down

Good competition from Qfinals onwards

Then on alternate years

Kerry - Longford
Cork - Wicklow
Dublin - Waterford
Meath - Tipperary
Louth - Limerick
Kildare - Clare
Offaly - Carlow
Westmeath - Wexford

Mayo v Antrim
Galway v Fermanagh
Roscommon v Down
Donegal - London
Armagh - Leitrim
Tyrone - Sligo
Monaghan - New York
Derry - Cavan

Run each championship off
Top 4 in each go to All Ireland last 16
backdoor round robin to produce the other 4 for the All Ireland last 16 -

Plenty of knock out football - trips to NY and London shared around - 3 tough knock out games fore anyone to win a provincial title. What's not to like

Replying To Eddie the Exile:  "Its games we want, with matched opposition, a chance to recover from early season set-backs, and ever-increasing risk as the tournament progresses. Also, a clear path to knockout football that an outsider can intuitively understand.
Every team tournament worthy of the name aims for these but football is in a heap on all these points. So much so that the championship itself infects a team's ambitions in the league right through to the final.

You cannot for example reward Munster football winners and Ulster football winners equally within year (it doesn't happen in hurling). Until we stop trying we are going nowhere. Provincial winners should be next year's All Ireland series, not this year's. Trying to fit the reward into the same year as the achievement is part of the problem.

Tailteann is not fit for purpose either. No relegated team should be favourite for a subsequent competition within the same year."

Replying To Tadhg2020:  "It does happen in hurling. The winners of Munster and Leinster go straight to the semi finals and are kept apart.( unless I an misunderstanding you somehow)
The problem football faces is that there are 4 strong provincial boards and many counties within them that will resist any attempt to break the link between provincial championship and all ireland series. While winning Munster may not mean a whole lot to Kerry it does to Cork and its the holy grail to Limerick, Clare, Tipp and Waterford. There are similar counties in each province and they want it to mean something big should they ever win it. That includes seeding in the All Ireland series.
I think that they were on the right track with the Sam/Tailteann split with league ranking . They just didnt go far enough and made an error or 2 along the way.
For me the Sam competition should comprise of 12 teams. The 8 provincial finalists plus the top 4 teams ranked from league that dont feature in the 8. The provincial winners would be seeded 1, the runners up seeded 2 and the other 4 teams seeded 3.
There would be 4 groups of 3 with each group comprising of one team from each seed grouping. Provincial finalists could not be grouped together.Each team in the group play each other once home or away with the top 2 going on to quarter finals.
The tailteann cup would comprise of the next 12 teams based on league performance. The seedlings would be done by league performance so top 4 seeded 1 etc. The group format would replicate the Sam Competition.
Finally there should be a third tier competition.
This will comprise of the remaining 8 teams plus New York and Kilkenny. The top 4 based on league position would be seeded 1 and bottom 4 seeded 2. New York and KK seeded 3.
It would be 2 groups of 5 with 2 home and 2 away games each(subject to agreement on New York) with the top 2 from each group to the semi finals. It could be extended if required.
Promotion/relegation in league should apply to the following season and not the current one.

Whatever the format decided upon it will have to retain the link to the provincial. To most counties that is the extent of their dreams and that cannot be taken away from them or watered down in any way."

Replying To JimB1991:  "No."]Provincials late jan - mid March.

League beginning end of March
Around 10 weeks to run off 7 rounds of the league.

Senior All Ireland:
Top 4 teams in division 1 straight to QF
7&8 division 1 play 3&4 division 2.
Winners go into prelim QF with 5&6 Div 1 and 1&2 Div2.

Intermediate:
5&6 Division 2 and 1&2 Division 3 straight to QF.
7&8 Division 2 play 5&6 Division 3
Winners go to prelim QF v 3&4 Division 3

Junior:
1&2 Division 4 straight to SF
7&8 Division 3 v 5&6 Division 4
Winners play 3&4 Division 4 in prelim SF


League promtion and relegations stay as is."]I like it - same general idea as my AILC.

Similarities:
Teams ranked 1-32
League ranking used for 3-tier AIC

Differences:
30 teams play in an AIC tier (I have 28)
4-tier league (I have 2)
7-game league phase (I have 12 or 10, with 'groups' reducing from 15)
Prov KO presumably separate (I double 'many' as league)
AIC tiers 12-10-8 (I have 8-12-8)

Possible error in yours (unless I don't understand)?
Senior (Sam) has 12 teams, so start with Prelim QFs?
5 v D2 4th; 6 v D2 3rd; 7 v D2 2nd; & 8 v D2 1st
Maybe you have another round that's not well presented?"]No you're right I've an error also think I spotted one in intermediate.
Both easily fixed though, straight to a prelim Quarters in the 12 team All Ireland.
In the intermediate the better performing league teams (5&6 Div2 and 1&2 Div3) get home Quarters and the first post league phase is a playoff to join them in the quarters.

Anyway the general idea is teams are playing plenty of games at their level deep into the year, much more even playing field running into an All Ireland series.
People will obviously argue it devalues provincials playing them early in the year and not linked to the All Ireland but you can't have everything and realistically provincial titles mean the most to the weaker counties, the shocks needed to make that happen are probably more likely to happen in January and February than in May.

No system is perfect but continuing to pretend that a team that wins Ulster or Leinster being at the exact same stage in the race for an All Ireland as a team that wins Munster is in anyway an acceptable system is just madness."]Would awarding match pts for Prov KO ties (like Prov SHCs, same tier only), and incorporating them into the 'regular season', be a reasonable approach?
12 (or 10) of 15 match partial round robin, with groups drawn to determine teams who WON'T meet.

Replying To tirawleybaron:  "@Tadhg2020 (Limerick)

Why is the delusion that Waterford, Tipperary, Limerick, Clare winning Munster, Sligo, Leitrim, London winning Connacht, Antrim, Fermanagh, Down, Cavan winning Ulster, Wicklow, Carlow, Laois, Offaly, Longford winning Leinster all have to impact the All Ireland.

They will all get a good result every now and then. But that should be confined to a standalone Provincial championship that doesn't give Cork/Kerry/Mayo/Galway/Dublin a head start on other counties because their province is weak (at a given time)
The Senior All Ireland championship should be for the bet teams in the country, all with an equal footing before they start.
Why should we allow a handicapping system as if it was a horse race."

Replying To Tadhg2020:  "There is no way that any of the counties that you have listed of the provincial councils that run the respective provincial championships will ever vote for any system that demotes the provincial championships standing in any way. It just wont happen and why should it. It means something now to win a provincial championship. They are finished if that ever changes."