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All of the management's shortcomings were evident on Saturday night.
No plan to attack, no plan to defend, just absolute chaos out on the pitch. It was glaringly obvious what team had a plan and which team didn't, which was ironic because one team had six weeks to prepare, the other had two.
People can go on and on about county board failings, but that dosen't excuse O' Rourke. He has constantly shouted that he's bringing new improved players through, but started Cillian O'Sullivan at the weekend after having no minutes in the league? Constantly talks about working on a defensive plan that they are working on in training, we conceded 3 goals in the first 20 minutes against Louth. He claimed after 'meath's doubts' appeared after Louth got their first goal, why the hell would we have doubts against Louth. They were 5 up in the league against us and we bet them 2 months ago, why would we be the team that has doubts?
It is excuse after excuse after excuse, numerous players have dropped off the panel, Jack Flynn and Dirmuid Moriarty in particular. For some reason Sean Brennan has been dropped out of no where, probably our best performing player all league. It just dosen't add up. He claimed that if after 2 years there was no improvement he would walk away, I think even his most optimistic supporters would admit that we have only gone backwards.
contributingtoamelee (Meath) - Posts: 55 - 27/05/2024 19:00:01
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Replying To contributingtoamelee: "All of the management's shortcomings were evident on Saturday night.
No plan to attack, no plan to defend, just absolute chaos out on the pitch. It was glaringly obvious what team had a plan and which team didn't, which was ironic because one team had six weeks to prepare, the other had two.
People can go on and on about county board failings, but that dosen't excuse O' Rourke. He has constantly shouted that he's bringing new improved players through, but started Cillian O'Sullivan at the weekend after having no minutes in the league? Constantly talks about working on a defensive plan that they are working on in training, we conceded 3 goals in the first 20 minutes against Louth. He claimed after 'meath's doubts' appeared after Louth got their first goal, why the hell would we have doubts against Louth. They were 5 up in the league against us and we bet them 2 months ago, why would we be the team that has doubts?
It is excuse after excuse after excuse, numerous players have dropped off the panel, Jack Flynn and Dirmuid Moriarty in particular. For some reason Sean Brennan has been dropped out of no where, probably our best performing player all league. It just dosen't add up. He claimed that if after 2 years there was no improvement he would walk away, I think even his most optimistic supporters would admit that we have only gone backwards." Brennan had an excellent league. Jack Flynn was a mainstay and our best player in Tailteann cup final. Moriarty was best player in O'Byrne Cup but somehow got little or no league game time.
What is going on? When did Brennan leave panel?
We are clearly in a terrible state at the moment and we actually do look further back than when O'Rourke took the job.
winatallcost (Meath) - Posts: 594 - 27/05/2024 21:54:32
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Replying To winatallcost: "Brennan had an excellent league. Jack Flynn was a mainstay and our best player in Tailteann cup final. Moriarty was best player in O'Byrne Cup but somehow got little or no league game time.
What is going on? When did Brennan leave panel?
We are clearly in a terrible state at the moment and we actually do look further back than when O'Rourke took the job." Brennan's performance against Longford was reason he was dropped.
Belt (Meath) - Posts: 272 - 28/05/2024 07:09:07
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Replying To winatallcost: "Brennan had an excellent league. Jack Flynn was a mainstay and our best player in Tailteann cup final. Moriarty was best player in O'Byrne Cup but somehow got little or no league game time.
What is going on? When did Brennan leave panel?
We are clearly in a terrible state at the moment and we actually do look further back than when O'Rourke took the job." Brennan hasn't left the panel I don't think. He was on the bench against Louth
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1527 - 28/05/2024 08:15:51
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I was really worried at end of year with the news Eivers and Garrigan were let go. If you want to be a top 8 team you need a top 8 backroom team and manager. Players in my opinion are in Meath to be a top 8 team but need a huge amount of top class coaching to get there.
HARRYM (Wicklow) - Posts: 70 - 28/05/2024 10:51:22
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Replying To HARRYM: "I was really worried at end of year with the news Eivers and Garrigan were let go. If you want to be a top 8 team you need a top 8 backroom team and manager. Players in my opinion are in Meath to be a top 8 team but need a huge amount of top class coaching to get there." We really need the management to be serious from the get go about being a serious, competitive team. Initially the message was to be competitive with Dublin in 2 years. Now we are further away than ever with it being stated that players are young and will make lots of mistakes etc. I can't see any drive or actual plan being put into practice. Honestly thought there were encouraging sign in Tailteann cup win but in off season and pre season, the work, research and planning was not done at all. That was a clear sign when the panel still included players that were already found out in previous years while the early rounds of the league were very discouraging. I suspect there are good players in Meath. We have 50 plus clubs for God sake. It can be hard to compare and I don't think we necessarily have the talent that the likes of Donegal have but Mcguinness has gone in there and went straight for it! Even without the talent I think our efforts are very tame. There is little or no belief. Let's see how remaining matches go but it's not looking hopeful.
winatallcost (Meath) - Posts: 594 - 28/05/2024 11:45:21
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Couple of points:
1. This season is over now. There is no way we can salvage it now realistically. I don't think we'll beat Monaghan.
2. O'Rourke was never going to be the saviour of Meath football. It should have been obvious from his punditry in recent times that he didn't understand modern football. He deserves plenty respect for what he's achieved and done for Meath football but his time to be Meath manager was about 20 years ago. Same for Giles and Bray in terms of respect.
3. We should be searching now for a new management team and coaching personnel.
4. The new manager/coaches should all have experience with or been involved in winning a senior All Ireland winning team, the most obvious being the Dublin set up given our proximity.
5. O'Bric should be involved in the new set up and in time step into the Managers role.
6. An independent committee needs to be set up to give advice / recommendations to the county board and also hold them accountable if they don't take the necessary actions.
LoyalRoyal (None) - Posts: 464 - 28/05/2024 14:32:46
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Replying To LoyalRoyal: "Couple of points:
1. This season is over now. There is no way we can salvage it now realistically. I don't think we'll beat Monaghan.
2. O'Rourke was never going to be the saviour of Meath football. It should have been obvious from his punditry in recent times that he didn't understand modern football. He deserves plenty respect for what he's achieved and done for Meath football but his time to be Meath manager was about 20 years ago. Same for Giles and Bray in terms of respect.
3. We should be searching now for a new management team and coaching personnel.
4. The new manager/coaches should all have experience with or been involved in winning a senior All Ireland winning team, the most obvious being the Dublin set up given our proximity.
5. O'Bric should be involved in the new set up and in time step into the Managers role.
6. An independent committee needs to be set up to give advice / recommendations to the county board and also hold them accountable if they don't take the necessary actions." An independent committee presumably appointed by the county board (?) will hold the county board accountable?? Really ??
royalproxy (Meath) - Posts: 46 - 28/05/2024 16:50:14
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Replying To LoyalRoyal: "Couple of points:
1. This season is over now. There is no way we can salvage it now realistically. I don't think we'll beat Monaghan.
2. O'Rourke was never going to be the saviour of Meath football. It should have been obvious from his punditry in recent times that he didn't understand modern football. He deserves plenty respect for what he's achieved and done for Meath football but his time to be Meath manager was about 20 years ago. Same for Giles and Bray in terms of respect.
3. We should be searching now for a new management team and coaching personnel.
4. The new manager/coaches should all have experience with or been involved in winning a senior All Ireland winning team, the most obvious being the Dublin set up given our proximity.
5. O'Bric should be involved in the new set up and in time step into the Managers role.
6. An independent committee needs to be set up to give advice / recommendations to the county board and also hold them accountable if they don't take the necessary actions." Careful now ;o) - quite a few on here were very adamant previously, NOT to have any Dubs involved in the Meath set up.... Some were very much opposed to it.
I seem to recall Mick Bohan's name been bandied about at one stage.
A few Meath posters got very irate at the thought of a Dub being involved.
We dont want them anywhere near us, or words to that affect...
BUT - when you look at what Ger Brennan is currently doing with a small county like Louth, it would definitely make sense.
I personally think O'Bric needs to be brought in at some capactiy next season, and if he leans on a Dub, to assist him, and Meath improve, then the mindset might change with some Meath posters and fans.
Fionn (Dublin) - Posts: 4051 - 28/05/2024 17:04:00
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Replying To LoyalRoyal: "Couple of points:
1. This season is over now. There is no way we can salvage it now realistically. I don't think we'll beat Monaghan.
2. O'Rourke was never going to be the saviour of Meath football. It should have been obvious from his punditry in recent times that he didn't understand modern football. He deserves plenty respect for what he's achieved and done for Meath football but his time to be Meath manager was about 20 years ago. Same for Giles and Bray in terms of respect.
3. We should be searching now for a new management team and coaching personnel.
4. The new manager/coaches should all have experience with or been involved in winning a senior All Ireland winning team, the most obvious being the Dublin set up given our proximity.
5. O'Bric should be involved in the new set up and in time step into the Managers role.
6. An independent committee needs to be set up to give advice / recommendations to the county board and also hold them accountable if they don't take the necessary actions." …and what winning manager are you suggesting takes over? If Jim Gavin not interested who else ?
How do we pay for this manager and his bus load of experts , all mad to get involved with Meath??
royalproxy (Meath) - Posts: 46 - 28/05/2024 17:19:09
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Replying To royalproxy: "…and what winning manager are you suggesting takes over? If Jim Gavin not interested who else ?
How do we pay for this manager and his bus load of experts , all mad to get involved with Meath??" Meath already pay 100k plus. Top managers as in Louth and Donegal are doing it for less
Ashrules (Dublin) - Posts: 553 - 28/05/2024 17:42:00
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Replying To royalproxy: "…and what winning manager are you suggesting takes over? If Jim Gavin not interested who else ?
How do we pay for this manager and his bus load of experts , all mad to get involved with Meath??" I think people have to realise coaching and management have moved on. Because a person was once an all star it doesn't necessarily mean they will be a super manager.
Many managers in many sports are made up of two "types" of former super stars and average or non elite players who are now high level performance coaches and managers.
Meath seems to be a county where we have a very narrow outlook.
There were some note worthy people in the original Meath Senior coaching set up but they vacated early days. Reasons unknown.
So first question is what do we want from a senior team manager. Then work back from there.
For me first attribute would be an established and recent track record of inter county or club success. But again no guarantee of future success. But we need to start somewhere.
Both or Senior and minor managers, do not fit this criteria.
COR last managed in........?
Plus Meath through years of negligence at development level (which has been addressed very well in recent years) and significant fact there are too many teams diluting the standards, it's not a very attractive proposition. Leinster club record demonstrates thos starkly.
Clubs and their attitude to learning, attending workshops etc is also a serious concern particularly in some smaller rural clubs.
So this is not a singular issue. However a good appointment would help steady the ship and the rot.
At the moment majority of Meath supporters are indifferent to Meath Senior Team. This is probably highlighted by attendances and the lack of discussion after defeat to louth. It seems to be accepted we are not longer a football county.
Overall it's very concerning.
Meathooooo (Meath) - Posts: 94 - 28/05/2024 19:04:18
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It's a chicken and egg situation, unless a Royal JP McManus figure emerges we can't afford to bring in a proven top-tier manager without the financial success that comes with being in the top-tier.
But I do still think we can build a top-class coaching team without top-tier finances. It just involves a little more imagination than taking the biggest name we can find. Who is doing great sessions, or coming up with innovative tactics? Canvas Sigerson players, or lads like Brian Farrell who is involved with Dublin clubs. Who are the less high-profile names that have consistently been doing great work behind the scenes in winning teams? Someone like Darren Daly has been involved as a player or selector in all recent Dublin-winning teams, I'm sure there are dozens of examples. Those type of figures can fill out a coaching ticket without breaking the bank.
Whatever the sources, be they from Meath, Dublin, Ulster or wherever, we need people who understand what it takes to compete in the modern game. The last time Meath were top-tier, the game was about 14 outfield matchups and winning individual battles. Anyone harking back to that or thinking there's some innate 'Meathness' that can compensate for not having a tactical plan should be ruled out.
But I still think a Meathman should lead things if possible. O'Bric seems the perfect candidate. But I'd like him to either stay with under 20s so he can consistently bring players through and take on the senior role at a later date OR take over for '25. I don't see the value in having him in the backroom team first. Succession plans rarely plan out and it removes one of the greatest weapons a new manager has, being a fresh voice for the players. As doom-and-gloom as it's felt this week I still believe we're some strong coaching away from being a top-tier team. Many counties will never be top-level, regardless of coaching team.
MeathAbroad (Meath) - Posts: 101 - 28/05/2024 19:07:18
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Replying To Ashrules: "Meath already pay 100k plus. Top managers as in Louth and Donegal are doing it for less" How do you know Louth and Donegal are less? I wouldn't be too sure but no matter how much more they ate getting value for money more so than us.
winatallcost (Meath) - Posts: 594 - 28/05/2024 20:21:45
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Wouldn't have been critical of COR before this game but honestly what were they doing for the last 6 weeks? You could say it was too long of a break but during the league there was too many games coming too fast, players getting injured etc. so what's the excuse now? Apart from Mulroy, are Louth much better than us in terms of personnel? This just shows you the difference coaching, tactics, planning, motivation, etc. can make. Donegal were nowhere last year, lost to Down who we beat twice and McGuinness comes back and look where they're at now.
In saying that, we are so blunt up front it's incredible. Seen a poster talk about the forwards we had 10/12 years ago. Not looking for a David Clifford but what we'd do for a Cian Ward, Stephen Bray or Brian Farrell right now.
NYRoyal (USA) - Posts: 31 - 28/05/2024 22:00:47
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Replying To NYRoyal: "Wouldn't have been critical of COR before this game but honestly what were they doing for the last 6 weeks? You could say it was too long of a break but during the league there was too many games coming too fast, players getting injured etc. so what's the excuse now? Apart from Mulroy, are Louth much better than us in terms of personnel? This just shows you the difference coaching, tactics, planning, motivation, etc. can make. Donegal were nowhere last year, lost to Down who we beat twice and McGuinness comes back and look where they're at now.
In saying that, we are so blunt up front it's incredible. Seen a poster talk about the forwards we had 10/12 years ago. Not looking for a David Clifford but what we'd do for a Cian Ward, Stephen Bray or Brian Farrell right now." Yes louth have better footballers at the moment, Mulroy, Downey, Burns, Grimes, Duffy, lennon to name but a few, would all walk onto our team now. Alot of that to do with experience aswell as ability, maybe some of our lads will develop into better players, but as it stands they aren't close to them lads, particularly the attacking ones.
southmeathgael (Meath) - Posts: 938 - 29/05/2024 07:02:57
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Replying To NYRoyal: "Wouldn't have been critical of COR before this game but honestly what were they doing for the last 6 weeks? You could say it was too long of a break but during the league there was too many games coming too fast, players getting injured etc. so what's the excuse now? Apart from Mulroy, are Louth much better than us in terms of personnel? This just shows you the difference coaching, tactics, planning, motivation, etc. can make. Donegal were nowhere last year, lost to Down who we beat twice and McGuinness comes back and look where they're at now.
In saying that, we are so blunt up front it's incredible. Seen a poster talk about the forwards we had 10/12 years ago. Not looking for a David Clifford but what we'd do for a Cian Ward, Stephen Bray or Brian Farrell right now." Prime Cian ward, Bray or Farrell would do absolutely nothing in this system. Im convinced Eoghan Frayne and Jordy Morris are classy forwards part of a terrible team system. Frayne against Louth spent more time in his own defense than attack, it was hard to watch. Jack OConnor and Daithi McGowan also are very talented players too where this management seems to only get the worst out of them.
Sheridan2010louth (Meath) - Posts: 184 - 29/05/2024 09:34:58
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Replying To winatallcost: "How do you know Louth and Donegal are less? I wouldn't be too sure but no matter how much more they ate getting value for money more so than us." I agree that value for money will come sharply into focus from here. Expenses up for preparation performance down sharply .Something wrong there. Could this be the start of a more business like approach that will spread its wings by the C.ounty Board. I HOPE so!
nobull456 (Meath) - Posts: 1266 - 29/05/2024 09:43:13
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Who are the realistic and genuine contenders should the job become available after this campaign, which it should given the well below par performances over the last two years. A list of the following from a mix of underage squads, club scene and outside the county:
- Cathal O'Bric
- Robbie Brennan
- Conor Gillespie
- Kevin Reilly
- Brian Farrell
- Declan Darcy (Dublin)
- Jim Gavin (Louth atleast approached him)
- Kieran McGeeney (May be finished with Armagh)
- Tony McEntee (Armagh)
- Anthony Moyles
- Andy McEntee (Don't rule it out)
- Lar Wall (Currently with Roscommon but should be involved in the next Meath set up)
Despite what people might think, the Meath job is a very attractive one. Good young players who need direction, big pick of players, no lack of facilities, finances and a support base that are crying out for a team to get behind. Really tired of the current set up saying there will be more pain ahead and it's a long road with a young team etc etc which was bandied out again after Saturdays horror show.
BigJoe14 (Meath) - Posts: 998 - 29/05/2024 10:20:38
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Replying To BigJoe14: "Who are the realistic and genuine contenders should the job become available after this campaign, which it should given the well below par performances over the last two years. A list of the following from a mix of underage squads, club scene and outside the county:
- Cathal O'Bric
- Robbie Brennan
- Conor Gillespie
- Kevin Reilly
- Brian Farrell
- Declan Darcy (Dublin)
- Jim Gavin (Louth atleast approached him)
- Kieran McGeeney (May be finished with Armagh)
- Tony McEntee (Armagh)
- Anthony Moyles
- Andy McEntee (Don't rule it out)
- Lar Wall (Currently with Roscommon but should be involved in the next Meath set up)
Despite what people might think, the Meath job is a very attractive one. Good young players who need direction, big pick of players, no lack of facilities, finances and a support base that are crying out for a team to get behind. Really tired of the current set up saying there will be more pain ahead and it's a long road with a young team etc etc which was bandied out again after Saturdays horror show." Anthony Moyles ?? How did he make that list ? Because he's on the radio every week waffling about everything the powers that be in Meath are doing wrong ?
Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 1012 - 29/05/2024 10:32:05
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