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Thats exactly the reason. In case a 2nd team won one of the championship. Made it easier for an average junior team to win one by getting rid of teams that could beat them. There is no other reason for it because it certainly isn't better for Meath football.
Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 1012 - 29/09/2023 09:38:44 2506200 Link 0 |
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What am i reading, players that cant make their first team can help the standard of meath football, lol,
Utdroyal (Meath) - Posts: 65 - 29/09/2023 10:19:51 2506206 Link 0 |
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In a roundabout way yes. The more competitive and harder to win the junior championship or any championship for that matter is the better it is for Meath football. Thats fairly basic stuff lad.
Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 1012 - 29/09/2023 10:30:18 2506209 Link 0 |
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The reason there were eight walkovers in the A league is that the big clubs were using some of the same players in both first and second team fixtures. The thought that clubs would agree to playing their league game against second teams on different days to allow second teams be stronger is ludicrous. It was certainly not written down on any proposal as it wouldn't get through. The idea of second team players not being allowed to participate in the first team championship was brought up, not in the recent changes but over 10-years ago. At the start of this year the CCC had a motion about letting second teams into the A championships. It was killed stone dead as there is no appetite for it anymore. Whether we agree or disagree, I don't think anyone can stand here and say this year's IHC was anything other than a shambles due to the second teams taking part it in and giving walkovers. FOUR in one single group. There are more games now for second team players between A league, Premier Cup, and two premier championships. I remember playing B league and you could have no games for months and then three in 10-days. The Premier works as clubs, depending on whether they are senior, intermediate or junior can use player at both first team and Premier level. It ensures games. Is it perfect, no, were B leagues and Junior C & D perfect, far from it, but it is an attempt to get more games for players. There is no one size fits all for GAA clubs in Meath. Everything doesn't have to rotate around the super Dublin commuter clubs, just as everything shouldn't be done for those that are struggling number wise. Roger (Meath) - Posts: 479 - 29/09/2023 11:02:23 2506213 Link 0 |
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You are both at two ends of the extreme. Goldback (Meath) - Posts: 58 - 29/09/2023 11:52:21 2506225 Link 1 |
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Roger: you make some valid points, especially in relation to the fiasco that used to be the scheduling of games in so-called secondary competitions e.g. B leagues. I would suggest strongly that the issue wasn't the B leagues themselves, and more to do with the way games were fixed in a haphazard manner. Thankfully, the scheduling of games has improved dramatically, and there is now a semblance of structure in relation to this matter. You are also correct in stating that there is no "one size fits all" for clubs in Meath. Of course there isn't: it would be impossible to look at two disparate clubs (for example Clonard and O'Mahonys) and come up with a competition structure that is to the satisfaction of both. I don't post here a lot, and I am not trying to have a go. But I do feel very passionately about the lot of the second team player and also the player who is older in years. (sometimes these are one and the same player!) Put two and two together and you may arrive at the logical conclusion that this player is me :) The current competition landscape for this type of player is absolutely god-awful. And especially so if you are a second team player who has the "privilege" of playing in Premier Div 3 or below..... Your season is essentially finished by June if your team doesn't get some sort of run in the competition. Sometimes it's over before then. I've played plenty of B league football. Junior D & C championship too. I have also played in the new Premier competitions over the past few years. There is zero comparison: these new competitions are being run off at break neck speed to tick a box and allow the county board to state that they are giving players more games. Players do not value these competitions. Look at the Master planner list for Premier Div 3 and below teams: they play 40 percent less games than their Premier Div 1/2 counterparts. How is this equitable? Fair? Catering for players???????? Yes, there is no "one size fits all" that will satisfy everyone. But the county board can, and should, be doing a whole lot better in fixing competitions for the "lesser lights". Mark my words: if things are left as they currently stand, the drop-off in player participation will go from a trickle to a raging torrent within the next 3 years. And by then it will be too late. oceanofnoise (Meath) - Posts: 52 - 29/09/2023 12:04:11 2506231 Link 1 |
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Some very good points in the last two posts about the scheduling of the Premier and seeing it finished in June. It is not working for everyone. The congestion that is A league, Premier and then second team A league must be difficult for bigger clubs to manage. For smaller clubs there is a large overlap with a A league and premier. The Premier competition at the start would be better being called a League and then the one after June include everyone again, in two groups of four rather than eight and be called championship, including every division from 1-8. Roger (Meath) - Posts: 479 - 29/09/2023 12:28:17 2506237 Link 1 |
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Basic?Basic is the level of thought that went into that statement,2nd teams in the championship proper was an absolute farce,completely different teams at the start of the competition to the end,made a mockery of the whole thing,how it ever was allowed is comical,also the premier championship should be run concurrent as to stop teams fielding 1st team players, also why this isn't happening is comical
Utdroyal (Meath) - Posts: 65 - 29/09/2023 13:11:36 2506253 Link 0 |
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the only comical thing is your post. Explain to me how a club can play first team lads on the second team. Maybe you should read the rules of the completions before putting up such a stupid post. Senior clubs must put in a list of 15 players to the county board before the start of the year. so how can they play second team. secondly if any of these lads get injured before the start of the championship and can't make the first team they can't get regraded and end up playing no football either championship or premier. This was the case with 2 lads in my club in the past couple of years.
latouche25 (Meath) - Posts: 540 - 29/09/2023 14:57:22 2506273 Link 0 |
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They put all the 2nd teams in one 2nd team group in the Junior A and they could only meet first teams in the 1/4 final stages which by then the 2nd teams had lost all the players to senior they were going to lose so the issue of one first team playing a team stacked with senior players in the first round and another first team playing them in round 3 minus 5 or 6 senior players was alleviated . This had been done for 3 or 4 years before the restructuring and the fact you don't seem to know that shows how clueless you are on the issue .
Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 1012 - 29/09/2023 16:08:26 2506285 Link 0 |
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Listing 15 players in itself is not enough to stop players playing across different teams. A club can list a registered player in their first 15 and that player may well be travelling, injured etc. How would this be monitored? I totally agree with you on players coming back from injury - they should be allowed play with lower graded teams to help them get back but I suppose it is difficult to monitor this too! Whatever about all of this - my experience is that the Premier League doe snot hold the same interest to players as say Junior Championship! I know this isn't of concern to many clubs in Meath as they struggle to field a second team but here's a thing! A couple of the larger clubs have had good minor players struggle to get into the first team once they transition and have lost them because the Premier stuff is so hit and miss! Ultimately the county loses them! I think is you look at St Colmcilles, Ashbourne, Dunboyne, Ratoath etc you will find this is the case! Personally, I think it was better when the second teams were in the Junior and Intermediate Championships but I do get why others wouldn't want that! I would also think it is a good idea to have a 'final' between the winners of the Premier and the winners of the Junior but again, I know the argument will be that the Junior winners have a Leinster to play! Royalblufill (Meath) - Posts: 515 - 29/09/2023 16:13:07 2506288 Link 0 |
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Lol ,where you born yesterday, teams have always named lads who that haven't played in years,so they get 1st team lads out playing 2nd team,so when the competitions run concurrent they can't do it,how this needs to be explained, jesus wept
Utdroyal (Meath) - Posts: 65 - 29/09/2023 17:01:01 2506297 Link 0 |
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The problem is the 15 they mame are usually not an honest 15
royal1967 (Meath) - Posts: 293 - 29/09/2023 20:11:08 2506309 Link 0 |
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1st teams most name top 15 to play league so they cannot play second team You cannot say premier is working, ask any big/senior club they will all say it does not work for them Only junior clubs say it works for all the reasons quoted in past posts They simply do not want second teams beating them Awaywin (Meath) - Posts: 116 - 29/09/2023 22:28:58 2506321 Link 0 |
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It is run concurrently! Ratoath played Dunshaughlin in the premier thing immediately before the seniors played Tones last Sunday! Between the two teams they togged out 50 players!
Royalblufill (Meath) - Posts: 515 - 30/09/2023 00:11:15 2506324 Link 0 |
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My silly comments according to you. Was about playing 2 jnr championship semis in club grounds and having game prob because it was one of these super clubs you mention in pairc tailteann. I'm not knocking the commitment of the fringe or second team players I'm making an argument for championship football especially semi finals to be played in navan. Now we have a situation where next Saturday there putting on a jnr b final at 11.30 in the morning if that is not a joke then I give up.cant remember games of these statures were played at such ridiculous times. Borderroyal (Meath) - Posts: 496 - 30/09/2023 20:42:47 2506404 Link 0 |
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Exactly
Utdroyal (Meath) - Posts: 65 - 02/10/2023 13:47:46 2506629 Link 0 |
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It's easy to monitor that Just make a rule that the named 15 have played in the first or second team in the last year Awaywin (Meath) - Posts: 116 - 02/10/2023 15:41:02 2506655 Link 0 |
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Yes in two ways. Firstly 17/18 year olds cut their teeth at a proper championship and not a premier competition. I'll give you a few examples of current/very recent Meath players. Seamus Lavin played a full year of Junior A for Dunboyne in 2013. As a minor marked Mickey Newman in a semi final who was Meath's top scorer that year. You don't think that benefited him? Take Liam Kelly for Ratoath, he will be Meath under 20's full back next year probably and he'll have barely played any club championship. If Ratoath were in Junior A playing proper championship football that would be a far better education for him. Jack Flynn won a Junior B championship with Ratoath in 2019 and that catapulted him onto the Meath 20's in 2020 having never been a Meath minor. If he was playing a premier competition there's a good chance that wouldn't have happened. And as other posters previously said a few strong second teams not only improves 2nd team players but it means junior teams have to be better too so the overall competition is better. It's the same reason I would be in favour of cutting senior from 16 teams to 10/12 even though this year it would have meant my club getting relegated. But this attitude of 2nd team footballers can never help Meath football. With minor at under 17 there's absolutely loads of county minors going into adult football and not being good enough for senior. They used to play with experienced veteran senior players in hard championship games against first teams at junior A, Junior B and in the case of Dunboyne and Don/Ash at the time inter. Now they play a nonsense competition that is basically under 21's without your best players, nobody cares about it. And then we wonder why our standards drop off a mile from under 17 - under 20. The regional and post minor development panel have been good steps, but even off the 2021 all Ireland minor winners I can think of 5 players who could have benefited from second teams being in Junior A and not premier
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1527 - 02/10/2023 16:34:10 2506671 Link 1 |
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Very well said.
oceanofnoise (Meath) - Posts: 52 - 02/10/2023 17:04:14 2506675 Link 0 |