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Indeed it hadn't been for lack of trying that's for sure, one thing that's certain is that a lot of players from far and side have been given the opportunity to show their worth at county level and the truth is they haven't been good enough, and there are some on the current panel that in all honesty I don't believe are good enough but then, as you say, we have some very promising players in Morris, Reilly, Scully etc who do certainly look the part, and are young with lots of improving to do yet. The problems are part of a bigger picture, the standard of the club scene and our underage performances, particularly U21/20, have been an issue. The new championship structures are good and I think will help in time as will the work at underage of course and there is a real importance on the work of Bernard Flynn and the U20 team this year, the gap from minor to senior has been a real problem identified by the fact that we have no Leinster title at that grade in 20 years and have only been in a final once in that time and for many years we're gone early doors. Injuries have played a big part in recent years, we always seem to loose someone important at a crucial time and that happened in Mick O'Dowds time too so no you can't blame management for everything at all, sure I've been annoyed at some of the selection decisions the past two games and the flatness for most of the game last Sunday was a real issue but reality is we haven't been happy with our place in the football world for 20 years now save for a rally between '07 and '10 so it's not as if we are in strange territory here.
Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3744 - 16/06/2021 12:41:36 2351399 Link 18 |
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Interesting that the title of this thread has been change, the original post removed and posts not being added. I have tried posting a couple of responses three times and each time its not been allowed... brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 16/06/2021 17:41:45 2351471 Link 16 |
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On appointing a new man or team duo whatever you want call it.this management needs a plan to be put in place and let it be known what is acheiveable,what we need to work on,who is goin to sign up to 3/5 year plan.this will i feel give them a chance to keep experience players and blood the lads in the team at minute and get the 20s, minors coming involved. Borderroyal (Meath) - Posts: 496 - 16/06/2021 18:09:21 2351472 Link 1 |
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You and me both Brian. Understand change of title, dont understand why many posts that were critical of current set up were removed. Especially considering some of the posts on main forum that have nothing to do with GAA
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2196 - 16/06/2021 18:24:17 2351476 Link 14 |
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big time...something going on
Thelongwoodslasher (Meath) - Posts: 403 - 16/06/2021 18:24:33 2351477 Link 1 |
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I think he would. Not sure he's interested though, even at club level. Very astute.
Crinigan (Meath) - Posts: 1352 - 16/06/2021 19:17:21 2351492 Link 10 |
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Nothing personal or defamatory was said from what I read and nearly every post has said they respect the manager and his efforts. But it says a lot. Certain people don't own Meath football and shouldn't think they are immune from constructive criticism. Crinigan (Meath) - Posts: 1352 - 16/06/2021 19:25:02 2351493 Link 16 |
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Stretching it a bit to say we should have beaten Donegal or Mayo, lost both games by nine points. All counties have to contend with injuries and lads heading away Meath are no different. We used other counties missfortunes in this regard when we got promoted ( is this the brilliant year ?) . We took full advantage playing understrength teams to achieve our goal and thats the luck of the draw. When shoe is on other foot we use injuries as excuse, we cant have it both ways. Free taking. kickouts, style of play to mention just a few of our shortcomings can and should be laid firmly at managers door. His remit was select the best players in Meath and mould them into a balanced team, have in place a coach who can improve the players and the way we play. Maybe I am missing something, but I see little or no improvement over last few years.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2196 - 16/06/2021 20:18:49 2351498 Link 18 |
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The problem is that he's not selecting the best players in the county
Selwyn (Meath) - Posts: 387 - 16/06/2021 21:12:07 2351510 Link 2 |
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Give Andy another year enough of all this nonsense talk, pre covid world we were clearly making strides, the man cant catch a break either, Ronan Jones and Shane Walsh easily 2 of our best players break bones before the league even starts. The man bleeds green blood and his passion for Meath to do well is unmatched -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- All i hear are excuses. Every county has bad luck and injuries, you deal with the hand you're dealt with. Dublin have lost numerous players off their panel and got on with it.They lost players to the AFL, they're dealing with it. They've had players leave to take a year or two out and gotten on with it. Cork and Kerry have lost players to the AFL, so have Tyrone and Derry as well as dealing with injuries. Mayo have had huge squad turnover due to an aging panel, they're not whinging and complaining about it. Nash if he'd stayed in Ireland was unlikely to have stayed playing football as he was on a Leinster academy contract and would've likely turned pro at rugby and played in another green jersey. We were never likely to have seen him in a Meath jersey so claiming he was a loss is not understanding the choices the lad had available to him. McBride is not an elite prospect and if he was why did Andy not use him last winter when he was available to him. McBride's AFL club allowed him play and Andy didn't think he was worthy of using. 1 brilliant year - in the league.... yes he was promoted but we were wiped out in the leinster final and they were ran into the ground in all three super 8 games. Shoulda, woulda, coulda won and if my granny had balls and all that. We weren't close in any of them and trying to suggest we were is a laugh. think the winner margins for ecah team were 8+ points. I'm going off memory on that so if it's inaccurate so be it. Free taking is Andy's problem, he's the manager the buck stops with him. I don't think the county board have refused him any request he's made. In 5 years we've not had a consistent free taker, in the game v Westmeath not a month ago, we'd 6 or 7 different players attempting free's and 45's. That's pathetic and lies at the door step of the manager for not sorting it out. Go back to the 80's Brian Stafford wasn't a free taker at all, but Sean Boylan got him Ollie Campbell's phone number, got them introduced and they over the phone worked on technique, pattern and approach to kicking the dead ball. I don't believe they ever meet but had several long calls and Brian developed his routine and was one of the best free takers we've ever seen. Are we saying in 2021 that Andy couldn't organise something similar for his team. We've consistently left 3-5 scores on the field through the lack of a free taker in his 5 years. Brian Stafford, Trevor Giles and Cian Ward three outstanding exponents of kicking a dead ball, could all have been approached and asked for a bit of help with the free takers. But it doesn't look like they have been. Look at Jack Flynn v Mayo and Matthew Costello v Kildare both taking long range frees.... no routine or standard approach to taking the free's other than put the foot through it and hope it has the distance and accuracy is a bonus. The fault for that is on the manager for not preparing his team adequately for the challenges placed in front of them. brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 17/06/2021 09:15:22 2351557 Link 16 |
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Goalkeepers - who's fault is it he's tried 13+ in the 5 years (not 4) that he's been in charge. He's fallen out with half of them. I suppose that's there fault and there's not a common denominator in Andy McEntee. Who hauled Dominic Yorke off at half time in his first league match? And replaced him with a corner forward? Who brought a 38 year old who'd not played in goals in 5+ years back onto the panel? Who recalled Joe Sheridan who hadn't played as a keeper since he was a teenager. Its no wonder Paddy O'Rourke, Jack Hannigan, Robbie Burlingham walked away. McDermott and Beakey were brought in and never even got an opportunity. What's the common thread.. Andy McEntee........... Free takers See my previous post. He's not helped himself by bringing in or getting a kicking coach involved. Clubs work with their free takers on it. But Andy doesn't seem to think it's important. Donal Lenihan is one of the best free takers in the county and yet Andy has consistently fallen out with him, failed to pick him and Donal's dropped himself off the panel twice... i suppose it's Donal's fault that v Westmeath he watched 6 or 7 have a go hero's attempt free's whilst he kicked his heels on the bench waiting on a chance. Rotten Luck/Injuries/Covid Every single team is dealing with it. Meath are not the only team affected by it. It's an excuse Credit for young players How has he brought them through.... is Andy not supposed to pick the best players available to him. Costello and Hickey are the u20 captain and vice captain this year i believe. Is Andy supposed to not bring them into the senior panel. Fionn Reilly (who's 25 next month) has been ignored for years by Andy until its was at the point Fionn couldn't be ignored any longer. How has he brought him through, his hand was forced and we lost 2/3 years of Reilly being involved with Meath. brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 17/06/2021 09:16:52 2351558 Link 15 |
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Love these vague posts. Who is he not selecting that should be on the panel?
Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 1012 - 17/06/2021 09:31:47 2351560 Link 0 |
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ON this who are the players that he's not selecting? Now i accept he's fallen out with plenty of lads so they're written off straight away but who within the county that's not included with significantly improve the team. Goalkeeper - Burlingham, Hannigan (back playing for D/A) are two he's fallen out with. Yorke is another ruled out. McDermott and Beakey have been in and involved and gone again. Defenders - Gallagher, Kane and McGrath (dunno if injuries are still at play) McGovern Twins (were on the panel dunno if they'd massively improve things) Eoin Lynch was involved and looked ok and then disappeared again Midfield - Harry Rooney won't play so no point talk about that. The McGowan brothers from Ratoath, both play very well for club but Andy doesn't seem to fancy them. Liam Ferguson was in and around the panel but not involved now. Forwards - Aaron Lynch - Should be there but dunno what's going on. Mattimoe has been done to death, Andy doesn't fancy him as a player, but neither did Mick O'Dowd so it not just Andy. Donal Lenihan should be starting but Andy and him clash and he's probably at the limit of being an intercounty player as he's close to 30 i believe I'm sure there's plenty of other i've missed so woud be interested to see other peoples thoughts and opinions. brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 17/06/2021 09:51:16 2351563 Link 14 |
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Agreed .......Excuses,Excuses,Excuses.... I think it is down to the CB to now take charge from here. Andy gave it plenty of passion ,It wasn' t enough ,but thanks for giving it a go anyway. It does seem the CB may not be well placed to examine , take corrective action, implement a plan to move forward from here. A key focus has to be the attitude around the appointment of manager etc. That is why the idea of the 3 directors of football or the 3 wise men should be re visited. I understand the terms of reference included special responsibility for examining the role of manager,and finding a person to fit the role with any developments required for the role included . So monitoring progress in the job,and attending to any development needs as a result was seen as a priority . Would now like to see the CB show leadership by re visiting the 3 wise men idea. It looked like a great idea at the time.! nobull456 (Meath) - Posts: 1266 - 17/06/2021 10:26:02 2351571 Link 17 |
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I wholeheartedly agree with everything you say. That's why i have no faith in anything changing this year and Andy will be in charge for 2022. In his five years i don't recall any serious discussions being held or a review of performance of where is Andy at, where the senior team is going, what are the problems, what needs to be looked at and what needs to be improved upon and how can the county board assist in doing so. Surely after the season a sit down and review of a performance is the very starting point of being allowed to continue in the role. Everyone in a professional working environment is subject to an annual performance review and yet this seems to be the last thing on the minds of our county board. They've dedicated their last x number of years to their white elephant of upgrading PT and abdicated any responsibility for running of the county teams. Any success has been in spite of them. And after those x number of years they're no closer to being shovel ready to execute an upgrade of 1 side of PT never mind all 4 which was originally planned. PT is an absolute microcosm of whats happening in Meath GAA. Foundations we're improved in the 80's and we looked decent for a while, we were ok into the 90's and then everything started crumbling and nothing has been done in the 30+ years to improve the foundations. They can point to Dunganny all the like but let's be honest its 1/2 the number of pitches it needs and the buildings are 1/3 of whats needed. A hatchet job to say we've done something with no vision of improving things as a whole, whilst the clubs footed the bill for the majority of it cos the county board couldn't raise funds. brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 17/06/2021 11:18:00 2351587 Link 14 |
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Well as another poster and myself have pointed out, he's fallen out with soooo many players. That's one reason he's not selecting the best players. Multiple players have passed through the panel in the 5 seasons who should be there still. With regards to the best players in the county that he a) hasn't ever selected or b) fallen out with, I'm not so sure as I'm not a regular attendee of club championship games apart from my own club. But I've mentioned Seamus Mattimoe already as one. And, has he really picked the 2 best Goalkeepers in the county in Andy Colgan and Harry Hogan?
Selwyn (Meath) - Posts: 387 - 17/06/2021 12:10:23 2351602 Link 2 |
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So you've said Andy doesn't pick the best players in the county but then say you've only gone to your own clubs matches... how do you that he's not selecting the best players in the county from such a small sample size? So come on then who are all these players under Andy McEntee's reign who fall into category a.... hasn't ever selected. If there's one criticism i think its unfair to level at Andy is that he hasn't given people a chance. Yes he might've pnly given 2/3 training sessions to guys but i think anyone who's showing form has been given a chance over the term he's been involved. Maybe there's some younger players in the early 20's who've been with Minors/ U20's or are just out those age groups, who he's not selected thus far but he might be looking at them for 2022. Who are the alternatives to Hogan and Colgan. A 39 year old Mark/Marcus Brennan? A 40 year old Gary Rodgers who's coaching the Monaghan goalkeepers I believe, a 19 year old Jimmy Corcoran who's playing League of Ireland!!!! Easy to throw out statements about are players x and y the bext but not back it up and say who is, so come on, share your wisdom... brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 17/06/2021 13:12:43 2351615 Link 13 |
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Im sick saying if you bring in lads not getting game time of any sort how can you say there not fit for it.and please not challenges that not real chance for a lad.
Borderroyal (Meath) - Posts: 496 - 17/06/2021 13:41:20 2351624 Link 0 |
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Out of curiosity do you know for a fact that Andy has "fallen out" with all these players? Or are you just speculating. Is it possible that some of these lads just didn't fancy the commitment of being an inter County footballer? Yorke clearly not good enough. The mcgovern twins are living abroad as far as i know and would only be borderline making the panel IMO. The 2 McGowans I've seen lots of and they are really good club footballers but thats about it. Probably good enough to make the panel but they wouldn't make the starting 15 and aren't really much better if at all than the panel players that are already in there. Gallagher and Kane not being involved is down to injuries issues and nothing else from what I gather. Liam Ferguson. Again another top club player and wouldn't bring the standard of the panel down but wouldn't improve it either. Eoin lynch like you said looked ok but nothing more than that so would just be a squad member and no better than whats in there. Aaron lynch I'll give you that one I would like to see him involved. Rooney. Forget it. Doesn't want to play. Mattimoe has been in on 2 separate occasions and walked away both times so why would any manager call a lad in for a 3rd time if he's already jacked it twice. Hannigan and Burlingham it seems the longer they don't play for meath the better they've become. Both really good keepers but as the years have gone by you would swear they are our answer to Cluxton. Are they better than Colgan?? Maybe marginally but i don't think things would improve massively in the goalkeeping and kick out area by having 1 of these in goal. McDermott not good enough IMO . Beakey has potential and would like to see him in and given a chance. Lenihan IMO should definitely be further up the pecking order. don't know why he wasn't but at 30/31 he's right not to hang around to be 10th choice forward. There's no doubting that Andy has fallen out with some players but there seems to be this narrative that he has fallen out with dozens of players who would improve our squad and it simply isn't true. Alot of the names mentioned above either don't want to commit to inter county football , are living abroad , their body won't stand up to the rigours of inter County training and matches or some simply aren't good enough or any better than what is there. And i am sure there is a few that andy has fallen out with but certainly not as many as people seem to think. Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 1012 - 17/06/2021 13:53:39 2351628 Link 0 |
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I understand the point you make here, and you're right it we won't know how guys can do unless they get game time. However a manager has 8/9 games a year at a minimum (7 league, 2 championship) and if they don't get things right they're job will be on the line. Take ourselves for example, we think we should be in division 1 of the league. Now if say we rest 4/5 of our front line players to give for example 5 newer players on the panel a chance to see how they get on and ended up going down to division three would people genuinely be happy about it? I don't think they would. So it's up to the manager to give these players a chance in training and challenge matches, see if they are good enough and make a call. Andy has always brought in players if they're showing form and measure up. Shane Walsh in 2019, Morris, Costello, Hickey and Harkin last year. To equate it to a work environment, if you go for an interview you get 1 or 2 chances (interviews) to impress. Its on you to show you have something in you that the position you're going for needs. That you're as good as and better than what they already have and will improve their team. Its the same with a county team. The manager only has so long to evaluate if someone is up to scratch and make a call thereon. brian (Meath) - Posts: 1973 - 17/06/2021 14:16:58 2351636 Link 12 |