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If the rumours are true, it looks as if the current manager will be staying on for another two years...watch this space....

cavanblueman (Cavan) - Posts: 636 - 04/07/2023 08:59:10    2492031

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Replying To cavanblueman:  "If the rumours are true, it looks as if the current manager will be staying on for another two years...watch this space...."
Well let's hope he changes his approach to the game so…!!

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1900 - 04/07/2023 10:17:30    2492057

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Replying To cavanblueman:  "If the rumours are true, it looks as if the current manager will be staying on for another two years...watch this space...."
Well he definitely has one year left. Where did you hear about it being 2 years now? I am ok with this though. This year was highly disappointing, but Division 2 next year, the chance to stay there at least and get into Sam, get players back (both injured players and ones who opted out this year), then we can be in a better place. But make no mistake, it's a big project to rebuild and get us to the standard we both expect and should be at. Some players have to move on, some have to be integrated in and become the new spine of the team. We need to build from there, stay up at that level so we get exposed to that football so we can push on. I am ok with this, as otherwise who else is there? We can't make the mistakes of appointing McGleenan or such. I still think he's the best option for where we'll be next year and where we need to look forward to.

Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2380 - 04/07/2023 10:24:56    2492061

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I agree with all that but back room team need to be changed

[email protected] (Cavan) - Posts: 138 - 04/07/2023 11:09:10    2492076

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Replying To Loughduff Lad:  "Well he definitely has one year left. Where did you hear about it being 2 years now? I am ok with this though. This year was highly disappointing, but Division 2 next year, the chance to stay there at least and get into Sam, get players back (both injured players and ones who opted out this year), then we can be in a better place. But make no mistake, it's a big project to rebuild and get us to the standard we both expect and should be at. Some players have to move on, some have to be integrated in and become the new spine of the team. We need to build from there, stay up at that level so we get exposed to that football so we can push on. I am ok with this, as otherwise who else is there? We can't make the mistakes of appointing McGleenan or such. I still think he's the best option for where we'll be next year and where we need to look forward to."
Well he definitely has one year left. Where did you hear about it being 2 years now? I am ok with this though. This year was highly disappointing, but Division 2 next year, the chance to stay there at least and get into Sam, get players back (both injured players and ones who opted out this year), then we can be in a better place. But make no mistake, it's a big project to rebuild and get us to the standard we both expect and should be at. Some players have to move on, some have to be integrated in and become the new spine of the team. We need to build from there, stay up at that level so we get exposed to that football so we can push on. I am ok with this, as otherwise who else is there? We can't make the mistakes of appointing McGleenan or such. I still think he's the best option for where we'll be next year and where we need to look forward to.
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2115 - 04/07/2023 10:24:56 2492

McGleenan didn't do badly it's not as if he brought the team to Division 4.

In his last season we got promoted to Division 1 and got to round 3 of the qualifiers losing to Tyrone.

People talk about changing the back room team but it's the manager who has responsibility for how a team plays and he sent the team out against Westmeath in the TC final last year, Armagh in Ulster this year and Down in TC this year looking like they hadn't played together before and totally clueless against packed defenses.

I think his time is up and a rebuild of the panel needs to start now and i don't have any faith in MG to do that and think he will land us back in Division 3. Even with a new manager we may end up relegated but at least we will be a year further on with a rebuild.

RHF (Cavan) - Posts: 845 - 04/07/2023 11:46:34    2492097

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Replying To Loughduff Lad:  "Well he definitely has one year left. Where did you hear about it being 2 years now? I am ok with this though. This year was highly disappointing, but Division 2 next year, the chance to stay there at least and get into Sam, get players back (both injured players and ones who opted out this year), then we can be in a better place. But make no mistake, it's a big project to rebuild and get us to the standard we both expect and should be at. Some players have to move on, some have to be integrated in and become the new spine of the team. We need to build from there, stay up at that level so we get exposed to that football so we can push on. I am ok with this, as otherwise who else is there? We can't make the mistakes of appointing McGleenan or such. I still think he's the best option for where we'll be next year and where we need to look forward to."
The whole approach needs to change. It's lazy negative tactics the reason players are leaving the panel. Come on would you want to play that kind of *****?
Antrim and Down , Meath have changed their approach , becoming more attack minded. And you can see the improvement in those 3 since the start of the league.
We changed nothing. Didn't even try .

Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 04/07/2023 12:01:33    2492104

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Replying To RHF:  "Well he definitely has one year left. Where did you hear about it being 2 years now? I am ok with this though. This year was highly disappointing, but Division 2 next year, the chance to stay there at least and get into Sam, get players back (both injured players and ones who opted out this year), then we can be in a better place. But make no mistake, it's a big project to rebuild and get us to the standard we both expect and should be at. Some players have to move on, some have to be integrated in and become the new spine of the team. We need to build from there, stay up at that level so we get exposed to that football so we can push on. I am ok with this, as otherwise who else is there? We can't make the mistakes of appointing McGleenan or such. I still think he's the best option for where we'll be next year and where we need to look forward to.
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2115 - 04/07/2023 10:24:56 2492

McGleenan didn't do badly it's not as if he brought the team to Division 4.

In his last season we got promoted to Division 1 and got to round 3 of the qualifiers losing to Tyrone.

People talk about changing the back room team but it's the manager who has responsibility for how a team plays and he sent the team out against Westmeath in the TC final last year, Armagh in Ulster this year and Down in TC this year looking like they hadn't played together before and totally clueless against packed defenses.

I think his time is up and a rebuild of the panel needs to start now and i don't have any faith in MG to do that and think he will land us back in Division 3. Even with a new manager we may end up relegated but at least we will be a year further on with a rebuild."
McGleenan did get us to Div1 but for all the good that did us, he did nothing in Championship. No point in being good in Spring with no returns in summer. We were very bad some of those years in Championship. I think of the Donegal game, falling past Down in Enniskillen, losing to Tipp at home. He did a lot less with a lot of our better players in their prime, as they proved in the 2 years after him. I do agree rebuild is needed, and think he can do it. I just don't see any other options there. Who is good enough in the county, or who would come to us? Either way, it's a rebuild and integrating in players and seeing some away

Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2380 - 04/07/2023 12:21:07    2492110

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Replying To Breffni1969:  "The whole approach needs to change. It's lazy negative tactics the reason players are leaving the panel. Come on would you want to play that kind of *****?
Antrim and Down , Meath have changed their approach , becoming more attack minded. And you can see the improvement in those 3 since the start of the league.
We changed nothing. Didn't even try ."
A lot of things need to change. The whole system takes getting used to. Even some of the top sides are finding it tougher - getting ready for League to stay where you need to, coming down from League to get ready for Provincials, being right for the round robin and being set for preliminaries/quarters. It's a balancing act, and we did try this year to me (going well in League with 5 games won, then winding down a bit) but yeah it didn't work - whatever it was they did. It is a big job needed, to rebuild, stay in Division 2 at least, and then be able to have the squad in the right place for Sam so we can continue to get exposed to those games. Everyone is figuring it out. Mayo and Galway even messed it this year, Tyrone too. Cork stumbled on a bit of a formula, that while limited got them to the quarters even going out in the provincials. We do need to change alright, and we have the opportunity from next year.

That's not the reason players are leaving the panel. By all accounts management were annoyed that discussed systems were not being implemented by players on the pitch. It's not one or the other here - it's both. Players are not blameless either

Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2380 - 04/07/2023 12:29:10    2492111

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People need to accept the fact that the talent just isn't there. It's a wider issue that needs to be addressed at underage, but at the end of the day, a manager picks a team, and its up the players on the field to step up to the mark.

You can look back at any of our matches, people will say Graham should've did this and did that, but take the Tailteann Cup, we were winning comfortably and would've won, only for Martin Reilly to try a stupid cross field pass which was intercepted and led to the Westmeath goal. There was other occasions too, take the Armagh match this year, we had possession of the ball for a lot of the match, but where was the movement, the creativity, the run's of the shoulder, why did they decide to kick 16 long range shots, surely, you'd expect senior intercounty players to be better than that. Its been the same for previous managers, they picked the team, they choose the tactics, but do people really believe that any manager will instruct a team to go out and simply play possession football and play endlessly in their own back line, absolutely not, the instruction is to defend, win the ball back and attack at speed, or keep possession of the ball, be patient and then look for the space to get behind, but unfortunately, Cavan lack enough players with the intelligence to do this.

The other thing I can think of is that the players have stopped playing for the manager and a refresh is needed, the players may not be there, but a new manager might give the current crop of players a new lease of life.

cavanblueman (Cavan) - Posts: 636 - 04/07/2023 12:43:13    2492118

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Replying To Loughduff Lad:  "McGleenan did get us to Div1 but for all the good that did us, he did nothing in Championship. No point in being good in Spring with no returns in summer. We were very bad some of those years in Championship. I think of the Donegal game, falling past Down in Enniskillen, losing to Tipp at home. He did a lot less with a lot of our better players in their prime, as they proved in the 2 years after him. I do agree rebuild is needed, and think he can do it. I just don't see any other options there. Who is good enough in the county, or who would come to us? Either way, it's a rebuild and integrating in players and seeing some away"
McGleenan did get us to Div1 but for all the good that did us, he did nothing in Championship. No point in being good in Spring with no returns in summer. We were very bad some of those years in Championship. I think of the Donegal game, falling past Down in Enniskillen, losing to Tipp at home. He did a lot less with a lot of our better players in their prime, as they proved in the 2 years after him. I do agree rebuild is needed, and think he can do it. I just don't see any other options there. Who is good enough in the county, or who would come to us? Either way, it's a rebuild and integrating in players and seeing some away
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2117 - 04/07/2023 12:21:07

You don't know who might be interested or available until you go looking it wouldn't be an attractive job for a manager at the moment i get that but i don't think that someone who isn't doing a good job should remain in a job for the sake of it.

RHF (Cavan) - Posts: 845 - 04/07/2023 12:47:51    2492121

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Replying To Breffni1969:  "The whole approach needs to change. It's lazy negative tactics the reason players are leaving the panel. Come on would you want to play that kind of *****?
Antrim and Down , Meath have changed their approach , becoming more attack minded. And you can see the improvement in those 3 since the start of the league.
We changed nothing. Didn't even try ."
Down became more attack minded!! Sorry but that's a bizarre point to make. Are you for real? Down play an absolutely horrible style where, the moment they lose the ball, every player retreats inside their 45, making no effort whatsoever to tackle higher than this. You obviously didn't bother going to the tailteann cup quarter final or you would not be making such a point. As for Antrim, They're playing the same turgid style that had the Meath players revolt against McEntee.

Fontofwisdom (Cavan) - Posts: 128 - 04/07/2023 12:59:31    2492126

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Kerry and Dublin are the best teams in the Country by a mile. Then you have the likes of the Tier Two Teams, Mayo, Galway, Tyrone always knocking on the door, then occasionally, along come the Tier three teams, Roscommon, Monaghan, Derry (recent times), Donegal (slowly disappearing but will rebuild) Armagh and Cork (slowly improving.

Dublin and Kerry will always make an Ireland Semi-Final or Final at best (if drawn apart).

The you have the tier 4 teams and I include Cavan in those teams along side the likes of Clare, Down, Westmeath, Sligo, Tipperary, Kildare, Meath, Fermanagh, and that my friends is where Cavan Football is at the moment and has been for quite a while. So I think people need to be very realistic about Cavan Football and acknowledge that Graham got the best out of this team and it could be another 30 years before another manager wins another Provincial title. So whilst its easy to criticise management, I think people need to take a good look at above and acknowledge the truth.

cavanblueman (Cavan) - Posts: 636 - 04/07/2023 14:54:07    2492171

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Kerry and Dublin are the best teams in the Country by a mile. Then you have the likes of the Tier Two Teams, Mayo, Galway, Tyrone always knocking on the door, then occasionally, along come the Tier three teams, Roscommon, Monaghan, Derry (recent times), Donegal (slowly disappearing but will rebuild) Armagh and Cork (slowly improving.

Dublin and Kerry will always make an Ireland Semi-Final or Final at best (if drawn apart).

The you have the tier 4 teams and I include Cavan in those teams along side the likes of Clare, Down, Westmeath, Sligo, Tipperary, Kildare, Meath, Fermanagh, and that my friends is where Cavan Football is at the moment and has been for quite a while. So I think people need to be very realistic about Cavan Football and acknowledge that Graham got the best out of this team and it could be another 30 years before another manager wins another Provincial title. So whilst its easy to criticise management, I think people need to take a good look at above and acknowledge the truth.

cavanblueman (Cavan) - Posts: 550 - 04/07/2023 14:54:07 249

Who are the tier 3 teams??

RHF (Cavan) - Posts: 845 - 04/07/2023 15:22:54    2492188

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Replying To RHF:  "Kerry and Dublin are the best teams in the Country by a mile. Then you have the likes of the Tier Two Teams, Mayo, Galway, Tyrone always knocking on the door, then occasionally, along come the Tier three teams, Roscommon, Monaghan, Derry (recent times), Donegal (slowly disappearing but will rebuild) Armagh and Cork (slowly improving.

Dublin and Kerry will always make an Ireland Semi-Final or Final at best (if drawn apart).

The you have the tier 4 teams and I include Cavan in those teams along side the likes of Clare, Down, Westmeath, Sligo, Tipperary, Kildare, Meath, Fermanagh, and that my friends is where Cavan Football is at the moment and has been for quite a while. So I think people need to be very realistic about Cavan Football and acknowledge that Graham got the best out of this team and it could be another 30 years before another manager wins another Provincial title. So whilst its easy to criticise management, I think people need to take a good look at above and acknowledge the truth.

cavanblueman (Cavan) - Posts: 550 - 04/07/2023 14:54:07 249

Who are the tier 3 teams??"
Read the post:

Tier 1: Dublin & Kerry (100% chance of winning an All Ireland)
Tier 2: Mayo, Galway, Tyrone (a good chance of winning an All Ireland (although Mayo really dont)
Tier 3: Roscommon, Monaghan, Derry, Donegal (a very slim, slim outside chance)
Tier 4; Cavan, Clare, Tipperary, Down, Westmeath, Sligo, Tipperary etc etc etc (Never gonna happen)

cavanblueman (Cavan) - Posts: 636 - 04/07/2023 15:44:45    2492200

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Replying To cavanblueman:  "People need to accept the fact that the talent just isn't there. It's a wider issue that needs to be addressed at underage, but at the end of the day, a manager picks a team, and its up the players on the field to step up to the mark.

You can look back at any of our matches, people will say Graham should've did this and did that, but take the Tailteann Cup, we were winning comfortably and would've won, only for Martin Reilly to try a stupid cross field pass which was intercepted and led to the Westmeath goal. There was other occasions too, take the Armagh match this year, we had possession of the ball for a lot of the match, but where was the movement, the creativity, the run's of the shoulder, why did they decide to kick 16 long range shots, surely, you'd expect senior intercounty players to be better than that. Its been the same for previous managers, they picked the team, they choose the tactics, but do people really believe that any manager will instruct a team to go out and simply play possession football and play endlessly in their own back line, absolutely not, the instruction is to defend, win the ball back and attack at speed, or keep possession of the ball, be patient and then look for the space to get behind, but unfortunately, Cavan lack enough players with the intelligence to do this.

The other thing I can think of is that the players have stopped playing for the manager and a refresh is needed, the players may not be there, but a new manager might give the current crop of players a new lease of life."
I would disagree slightly. Like last day v Down, if we have Thomas Galligan, James Smith, Paddy Lynch, Jason McLoughlin (and Conor Brady for more than 10 mins) and even a fit Gunner then we'd have been better. That's a lot of talent a county like us can't afford to be without. 3 of those are your bulk and muscle centre of the field. There's enough talent there to punch our weight or even above it with the right system and tactics. There's counties like Monaghan, Roscommon etc who punch their weight and they're not miles above us on talent. In fact they do more with less pick than us

Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2380 - 04/07/2023 17:43:52    2492239

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I agree Cavan are currently in tier 4 and the future is bleak. I have never seen Cavan supporters so disconnected and un interested in Cavans fortunes. Maybe it is the manure we are playing but we should be up in arms with now the whole underage set is run and how our good neighbours Monaghan have moved so far ahead of us in 5 years 3 teams competing in the Mcrory cup minors challenging for ulster every year and very good under 20 teams. We need to copy their template is there any coaching done by the county board in breffni college who have 650 plus students or are we just concentrating on st pats. We have no players to replace the 8 or 9 players that retire in the next 2 years and more will follow like James smith once they realise that they are on a hiding to nothing.
Mickey needs to go i fully supported him staying on this year but some thing is seriously wrong either 90 percent of the players have gone backwards or they are not playing for him and he is far to loyal to players that are over the hill this must be soul destroying for all the younger players on the panel who get 10 minutes in a dr mckenna cup to prove themselves and that it for the year why would they stick around. He like most of the coaches in ulster is far to conservative keep it tight early on regardless of who you are playing and even though we only needed one win in the round robin serious of the tailteann cup he went with his strongest 15 every day even against london a sure sign of a man that has lost his nerve.
We need Mickey gone and Director of football gone. Then we can start the long road again and maybe in 8 or 9 years we will be competitive in ulster again and thats the best we can hope for, Sam maguire is a 2 horse race most years.

breffnibluewhite (Cavan) - Posts: 452 - 04/07/2023 17:51:12    2492241

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Replying To RHF:  "McGleenan did get us to Div1 but for all the good that did us, he did nothing in Championship. No point in being good in Spring with no returns in summer. We were very bad some of those years in Championship. I think of the Donegal game, falling past Down in Enniskillen, losing to Tipp at home. He did a lot less with a lot of our better players in their prime, as they proved in the 2 years after him. I do agree rebuild is needed, and think he can do it. I just don't see any other options there. Who is good enough in the county, or who would come to us? Either way, it's a rebuild and integrating in players and seeing some away
Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2117 - 04/07/2023 12:21:07

You don't know who might be interested or available until you go looking it wouldn't be an attractive job for a manager at the moment i get that but i don't think that someone who isn't doing a good job should remain in a job for the sake of it."
I get you, but I mean more in terms of tested quality management. We've made multiple times the bad decisions than the good decisions since McHugh, and this has affected us as a county going forward. Likes of James Horan turned us down in 16/17 as a Division 1 side. Pat Gilroy, Pillar Caffrey turned us down in the past as well I think. Others too. The CB constantly ask around when we need a manager, and we either look inside, or get a poor outside manager. Like who better is actually available? Or is it change for changes sake?

Loughduff Lad (Cavan) - Posts: 2380 - 04/07/2023 18:00:44    2492246

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Replying To Fontofwisdom:  "Down became more attack minded!! Sorry but that's a bizarre point to make. Are you for real? Down play an absolutely horrible style where, the moment they lose the ball, every player retreats inside their 45, making no effort whatsoever to tackle higher than this. You obviously didn't bother going to the tailteann cup quarter final or you would not be making such a point. As for Antrim, They're playing the same turgid style that had the Meath players revolt against McEntee."
Well watching Down against us they were a lot more attack minded than we were and than they were in the league. Against Laois they cut loose , poor opposition I will admit but we didn't do much attacking against London. In fact it was the other way round.
Antrim ran us ragged in the league . Waltzing through for score after score while we failed to lay a glove on them.
Their performance against Meath was very credible at least they moved the ball at pace and played to their strengths.
Meath going forward have a great scoring inside full forward line .
We play the same ***** regardless of the opposition . No variation whatsoever . Players afraid to shoot until in the scoring zone( where's that by the way?) it's all I hear from the sideline.
We didn't even try to use GMC efficiently. Spraying 10m passes latterly won't win much as it proved. Paddy Lynch 60m from goal no threat either.
London cut us wide open down the middle. We never learned from that and Down exploited that in 15 minutes.

Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 04/07/2023 19:13:52    2492266

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Replying To Fontofwisdom:  "Down became more attack minded!! Sorry but that's a bizarre point to make. Are you for real? Down play an absolutely horrible style where, the moment they lose the ball, every player retreats inside their 45, making no effort whatsoever to tackle higher than this. You obviously didn't bother going to the tailteann cup quarter final or you would not be making such a point. As for Antrim, They're playing the same turgid style that had the Meath players revolt against McEntee."
Well Down scored 8-16 in Taltainn semifinal and their play didn't look one bit horrible… We wouldn't get 8 goals over a whole season yet you believe we are more attack minded… Down saw Laois had no legs and went at them and all was over in 10 minutes yet we managed to keep the same team in the game until the last 10 minutes with our slow ponderous play…. And we are the better team to watch… mind blowing logic

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1900 - 04/07/2023 19:24:22    2492268

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Replying To cavanblueman:  "Read the post:

Tier 1: Dublin & Kerry (100% chance of winning an All Ireland)
Tier 2: Mayo, Galway, Tyrone (a good chance of winning an All Ireland (although Mayo really dont)
Tier 3: Roscommon, Monaghan, Derry, Donegal (a very slim, slim outside chance)
Tier 4; Cavan, Clare, Tipperary, Down, Westmeath, Sligo, Tipperary etc etc etc (Never gonna happen)"
Not while there a hole in your xxxx will Roscommon , Derry, Monaghan or Donegal win an All Ireland with the type of football they all played this year.

Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 05/07/2023 06:34:20    2492308

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