Cavan Forum

National Football League 2020

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Clarke and McVitty owe Cavan nothing, Clarke has been playing for the county as a minor, Under 21 and as a senior player. If you look back to the Tyrone game in the summer it was obvious that both of them had enough. I think one of them was sent off and the other did his best to get send off early in the game.

Time for Mickey to find replacements and move on. Maybe sometime in the future the boys will return refreshed and able to make a contribution.

kildare blue (Cavan) - Posts: 578 - 28/11/2019 15:05:22    2251967

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Replying To fredflint:  "As have most players with most counties. Any comments why this issue is so prevalent in Cavan versus our neighbours in Monaghan or say Fermanagh? Are Cavans players training harder?

How do you think Mickey Graham is taking this. He had a pretty good year 1, hes putting things in place for year 2 and boom all up in smoke, The morale of lads left behind must be very low.

I understand the sentiment that we should be thankful for the efforts players put in, I get that and I am grateful to them. But representing your county and your people should not be seen as some horrible task you have been enslaved to do. There are plenty of positives for the players involved too - the opportunities it gets them, the status it affords them, the doors it opens, the legacy as a person you leave behind."
I don't think last year can be considered a good year. Relegated with just two points from division one. Yes we reached the Ulster final, but got comprehensively hammered. Followed by an even worse hammering against Tyrone. Those two games were pivotal and I strongly suspect the player exodus is in response to those two games. They showed that Cavan are just not contenders at the moment, and with no real talent on the horizon, that's not going to change. The players know it too.

Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 28/11/2019 15:26:23    2251973

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Replying To Cavan_Shambles:  "I don't think last year can be considered a good year. Relegated with just two points from division one. Yes we reached the Ulster final, but got comprehensively hammered. Followed by an even worse hammering against Tyrone. Those two games were pivotal and I strongly suspect the player exodus is in response to those two games. They showed that Cavan are just not contenders at the moment, and with no real talent on the horizon, that's not going to change. The players know it too."
Well we will definitely not ever be contenders if the reaction to a hammering is to run away.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1484 - 28/11/2019 18:55:49    2252015

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No county team should be having a bad week in November but Cavan have somehow apparently managed it. Confirmed departures will only lead to more rumour and negativity, a joy for many here.

Word coming from near the panel is MG was putting plans in for a huge push early in the league but one or two senior players wanted an extended break and to be back for summer. No leeway, no special treatment was the managers line so a few walked. Better to happen now than in the new year I suppose.

It makes you wonder though, was it part of a plan by management to really test the mettle of some so called stars? The attitude of some players has been suspect for a while now- trying to get sent off when losing badly for example- so this may have been a way of purging the panel of dead weight. It turns the blame on the departing players themselves and gives MG a clean slate. Genius or ineptitude time will tell.
It could turn out to be a good week for Cavan football after all.

MadgeKing (Cavan) - Posts: 493 - 28/11/2019 21:15:05    2252031

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Replying To MadgeKing:  "No county team should be having a bad week in November but Cavan have somehow apparently managed it. Confirmed departures will only lead to more rumour and negativity, a joy for many here.

Word coming from near the panel is MG was putting plans in for a huge push early in the league but one or two senior players wanted an extended break and to be back for summer. No leeway, no special treatment was the managers line so a few walked. Better to happen now than in the new year I suppose.

It makes you wonder though, was it part of a plan by management to really test the mettle of some so called stars? The attitude of some players has been suspect for a while now- trying to get sent off when losing badly for example- so this may have been a way of purging the panel of dead weight. It turns the blame on the departing players themselves and gives MG a clean slate. Genius or ineptitude time will tell.
It could turn out to be a good week for Cavan football after all."
If that is true, and I heard something similar myself, its a very poor reflection on some players. Anyway, I'll be pulling in 100% behind the lads that are there doing the work.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1484 - 28/11/2019 22:19:21    2252037

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Replying To fredflint:  "As have most players with most counties. Any comments why this issue is so prevalent in Cavan versus our neighbours in Monaghan or say Fermanagh? Are Cavans players training harder?

How do you think Mickey Graham is taking this. He had a pretty good year 1, hes putting things in place for year 2 and boom all up in smoke, The morale of lads left behind must be very low.

I understand the sentiment that we should be thankful for the efforts players put in, I get that and I am grateful to them. But representing your county and your people should not be seen as some horrible task you have been enslaved to do. There are plenty of positives for the players involved too - the opportunities it gets them, the status it affords them, the doors it opens, the legacy as a person you leave behind."
I don't know where you get the idea that Fermanagh dont lose players. I can think of numerous players that have dropped out or taken a year or two out in the last decade. Most Counties have players who do that even Dublin,Mayo,Kerry,Tyrone,Donegal. These lads are still young(McVitty,Moynagh,Clarke). The break will probably do them good. I feel very positive about the year ahead. I think we can win every game in the league.

s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5518 - 28/11/2019 23:31:53    2252042

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Replying To s goldrick:  "I don't know where you get the idea that Fermanagh dont lose players. I can think of numerous players that have dropped out or taken a year or two out in the last decade. Most Counties have players who do that even Dublin,Mayo,Kerry,Tyrone,Donegal. These lads are still young(McVitty,Moynagh,Clarke). The break will probably do them good. I feel very positive about the year ahead. I think we can win every game in the league."
Fergal Flanagan took a break for a year and never came back, once a lad leaves it's hard to get motivated to come back.

BreffniPark (Cavan) - Posts: 35 - 29/11/2019 09:52:52    2252057

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Replying To MadgeKing:  "No county team should be having a bad week in November but Cavan have somehow apparently managed it. Confirmed departures will only lead to more rumour and negativity, a joy for many here.

Word coming from near the panel is MG was putting plans in for a huge push early in the league but one or two senior players wanted an extended break and to be back for summer. No leeway, no special treatment was the managers line so a few walked. Better to happen now than in the new year I suppose.

It makes you wonder though, was it part of a plan by management to really test the mettle of some so called stars? The attitude of some players has been suspect for a while now- trying to get sent off when losing badly for example- so this may have been a way of purging the panel of dead weight. It turns the blame on the departing players themselves and gives MG a clean slate. Genius or ineptitude time will tell.
It could turn out to be a good week for Cavan football after all."
That's real tinfoil hat stuff there Madge.

No matter what way you spin it, losing our best players is not a positive. Whilst I agree that attitudes are questionable, we'd be better asking why these lads aren't interested instead of forming the view that we're better off without them.

As for your point about this story feeding negativity, I'd suggest that a single provincial title in half a century is the reason for the negativity.

Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 29/11/2019 11:03:46    2252068

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Replying To MadgeKing:  "No county team should be having a bad week in November but Cavan have somehow apparently managed it. Confirmed departures will only lead to more rumour and negativity, a joy for many here.

Word coming from near the panel is MG was putting plans in for a huge push early in the league but one or two senior players wanted an extended break and to be back for summer. No leeway, no special treatment was the managers line so a few walked. Better to happen now than in the new year I suppose.

It makes you wonder though, was it part of a plan by management to really test the mettle of some so called stars? The attitude of some players has been suspect for a while now- trying to get sent off when losing badly for example- so this may have been a way of purging the panel of dead weight. It turns the blame on the departing players themselves and gives MG a clean slate. Genius or ineptitude time will tell.
It could turn out to be a good week for Cavan football after all."
Dead Weight? wonder if Jim Gavin ever considered Diarmuid Connolly as dead weight?

aceofspades (Cavan) - Posts: 256 - 29/11/2019 11:10:06    2252069

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Replying To Breffnisbest:  "Conor Bradley is going to Dunboyne"
As I said before, I have no issue with players moving outside the county but that is a strange move.

Virginia is only another 30 mins down the road on the M3, and they would probably be favorites for the c'ship next year with Bradley involved.

PatTheDandy (Cavan) - Posts: 356 - 29/11/2019 13:41:07    2252098

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They might or might not return to County football in the future. McVeety I think will. Clarke said he might go back in a year or 2 in the interview. . A year or 2 away, and a player could lose the drive or get the hunger back.
Eugene Keating should still be County football, only 30. But he isn't even playing club football now..

FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2763 - 29/11/2019 14:39:32    2252110

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Replying To FoolsGold:  "They might or might not return to County football in the future. McVeety I think will. Clarke said he might go back in a year or 2 in the interview. . A year or 2 away, and a player could lose the drive or get the hunger back.
Eugene Keating should still be County football, only 30. But he isn't even playing club football now.."
True, Keating was a player I had high hopes for. As was Givney.

Ned_Stormcrow (Cavan) - Posts: 1071 - 29/11/2019 14:52:20    2252114

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That's a bit strong Shambles! Is it that far-fetched to say that a manager would turn up the heat to see where the fault lines in the panel are? It happens all the time. I am not spinning anything or making out that the manager is some sort of genius, but you have to say that there were question marks last year about the attitude some of the lads involved in this team. Fond of winning the race to the microphone but not to the dirty ball, if you know what I mean. The wins against Armagh and Monaghan papered over this a fair bit but I'd say Graham was not that happy about it. He has cranked it up now and got his answer.

I have read a few times here that 1 title in 50 years is the reason why lads leave, as in why would you be bothered? It should be precisely the opposite- the very reason why lads should want to play for Cavan is to end this shameful situation. Do they think that all those titles won by their great-great grandfathers were just handed out?

Cavan's best players have attitude plus talent and not just one or the other. Martin Reilly, Mackey, Faulkner, with maybe Rehill and Kiernan coming through. There are huge questions hanging over most of who are lauded as 'great' players here, Keating and Givney included. We need the type of lads Mickey Harte or Peter Keane would want to poach from the panel.

As for the allusion to Diarmuid Connolly, don't make me laugh...

MadgeKing (Cavan) - Posts: 493 - 29/11/2019 15:31:36    2252119

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Replying To MadgeKing:  "That's a bit strong Shambles! Is it that far-fetched to say that a manager would turn up the heat to see where the fault lines in the panel are? It happens all the time. I am not spinning anything or making out that the manager is some sort of genius, but you have to say that there were question marks last year about the attitude some of the lads involved in this team. Fond of winning the race to the microphone but not to the dirty ball, if you know what I mean. The wins against Armagh and Monaghan papered over this a fair bit but I'd say Graham was not that happy about it. He has cranked it up now and got his answer.

I have read a few times here that 1 title in 50 years is the reason why lads leave, as in why would you be bothered? It should be precisely the opposite- the very reason why lads should want to play for Cavan is to end this shameful situation. Do they think that all those titles won by their great-great grandfathers were just handed out?

Cavan's best players have attitude plus talent and not just one or the other. Martin Reilly, Mackey, Faulkner, with maybe Rehill and Kiernan coming through. There are huge questions hanging over most of who are lauded as 'great' players here, Keating and Givney included. We need the type of lads Mickey Harte or Peter Keane would want to poach from the panel.

As for the allusion to Diarmuid Connolly, don't make me laugh..."
That's a fair and reasoned opinion Madge, but is it not a really poor reflection of the manager if he can't get the attitude of his players right? That's precisely his job afterall.

Id suggest that this goes much deeper than the manager anyway, I just think the whole attitude around Gaelic football in Cavan has to change.

Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 29/11/2019 17:24:55    2252136

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Replying To MadgeKing:  "That's a bit strong Shambles! Is it that far-fetched to say that a manager would turn up the heat to see where the fault lines in the panel are? It happens all the time. I am not spinning anything or making out that the manager is some sort of genius, but you have to say that there were question marks last year about the attitude some of the lads involved in this team. Fond of winning the race to the microphone but not to the dirty ball, if you know what I mean. The wins against Armagh and Monaghan papered over this a fair bit but I'd say Graham was not that happy about it. He has cranked it up now and got his answer.

I have read a few times here that 1 title in 50 years is the reason why lads leave, as in why would you be bothered? It should be precisely the opposite- the very reason why lads should want to play for Cavan is to end this shameful situation. Do they think that all those titles won by their great-great grandfathers were just handed out?

Cavan's best players have attitude plus talent and not just one or the other. Martin Reilly, Mackey, Faulkner, with maybe Rehill and Kiernan coming through. There are huge questions hanging over most of who are lauded as 'great' players here, Keating and Givney included. We need the type of lads Mickey Harte or Peter Keane would want to poach from the panel.

As for the allusion to Diarmuid Connolly, don't make me laugh..."
Although the lads may not have the footballing ability of Connolly ,they were just as important to the Cavan team as Connolly was to Dublin,indeed less than six months ago you were lauding these lads as the rock on which Donegal were going to perish on!! Oh how fickle we are.Do you really think if any of these lads made themselves available next Spring that MG wouldn't consider them?? You should have been comedian.

aceofspades (Cavan) - Posts: 256 - 29/11/2019 17:39:43    2252138

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People giving out about the lads having not having commitment because they are taking a year out are having a wobble.
There are lads that are only in their mid twenties that have represented cavan for the past 8-9 years, from minor level to senior pretty successfully I might add. The effort being put in should never be questioned, they are training year round 4-5 nights per week between gym and field sessions.
A lot of these lads are/were working in Dublin travelling up and down to train. They have been putting football before everything. (Example Fergal Reilly from Castlerahan commuting from limerick to train with he under 21s a few years ago)

Lets be honest, can anyone honestly say that we are anywhere near winning an Ulster championship based on the past year?
I don't blame the lads for stepping away and putting themselves first. At the end of the day these lads aren't getting paid to play, they have careers that will continue long after they stop playing football that they have to manage. The boys going travelling may not get the same opportunity to do so again in their lives (J1 visas, time of work, lack of a family, mortgage to pay etc).
To those who say football opens piles of doors for these lads I have to disagree, maybe it used to back in the day but it's a changed world. You don't get jobs these days without having qualifications and experience. These lads aren't getting sponsorship deals like some of the dubs, they aren't winning Ulster and all Ireland titles that make it worth the massive sustained effort required to perform at county level in my opinion.. although some lads definitely do and fair play to them. People are mental saying it should be for the pride of the jersey, I don't think you could say any of the lads aren't proud to represent the county, from what I see, most of them just get ridiculed by people on here and others "supporting the team" after losing a match. Prime example being aroundthehouse giving Fergal Flanagan stick when in fact he was probably one of Cavan's best backs before he went off! (keeping Conor McManus to 2 points from play in an ulster champion match wasn't a bad achievement for someone you're glad that didn't come back...) If these lads weren't proud to play for Cavan I'm sure they would have packed it in much sooner given the quantity of negativity thrown their way after getting a beating.
The truth is we don't have the quality inside the county to win anything at the moment, We don't have any free scoring forwards of note at the county level. don't get me wrong these lads are all good footballers, I wouldn't have fancied coming up against many of them back in the day. The games at a different level compared to when Cavan were winning titles so theres no point in comparing it to past teams that won even just as far back as 97. its a different game as far as strength, fitness and tactics are concerned.

BigEZ (Cavan) - Posts: 28 - 30/11/2019 14:56:03    2252258

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Replying To BigEZ:  "People giving out about the lads having not having commitment because they are taking a year out are having a wobble.
There are lads that are only in their mid twenties that have represented cavan for the past 8-9 years, from minor level to senior pretty successfully I might add. The effort being put in should never be questioned, they are training year round 4-5 nights per week between gym and field sessions.
A lot of these lads are/were working in Dublin travelling up and down to train. They have been putting football before everything. (Example Fergal Reilly from Castlerahan commuting from limerick to train with he under 21s a few years ago)

Lets be honest, can anyone honestly say that we are anywhere near winning an Ulster championship based on the past year?
I don't blame the lads for stepping away and putting themselves first. At the end of the day these lads aren't getting paid to play, they have careers that will continue long after they stop playing football that they have to manage. The boys going travelling may not get the same opportunity to do so again in their lives (J1 visas, time of work, lack of a family, mortgage to pay etc).
To those who say football opens piles of doors for these lads I have to disagree, maybe it used to back in the day but it's a changed world. You don't get jobs these days without having qualifications and experience. These lads aren't getting sponsorship deals like some of the dubs, they aren't winning Ulster and all Ireland titles that make it worth the massive sustained effort required to perform at county level in my opinion.. although some lads definitely do and fair play to them. People are mental saying it should be for the pride of the jersey, I don't think you could say any of the lads aren't proud to represent the county, from what I see, most of them just get ridiculed by people on here and others "supporting the team" after losing a match. Prime example being aroundthehouse giving Fergal Flanagan stick when in fact he was probably one of Cavan's best backs before he went off! (keeping Conor McManus to 2 points from play in an ulster champion match wasn't a bad achievement for someone you're glad that didn't come back...) If these lads weren't proud to play for Cavan I'm sure they would have packed it in much sooner given the quantity of negativity thrown their way after getting a beating.
The truth is we don't have the quality inside the county to win anything at the moment, We don't have any free scoring forwards of note at the county level. don't get me wrong these lads are all good footballers, I wouldn't have fancied coming up against many of them back in the day. The games at a different level compared to when Cavan were winning titles so theres no point in comparing it to past teams that won even just as far back as 97. its a different game as far as strength, fitness and tactics are concerned."
Great so you'd be ok with them all quitting as we are not good enough and who could blame them anyway. Sure feck it let's not bother field a team at all

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1484 - 30/11/2019 15:12:44    2252269

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Replying To fredflint:  "Great so you'd be ok with them all quitting as we are not good enough and who could blame them anyway. Sure feck it let's not bother field a team at all"
Wouldn't be happy about it, I love Cavan football as much as anyone. But I won't sit around criticising lads that are taking a break if they aren't enjoying their football. Especially lads like Mcveety, Moynagh and Clarke that have given serious effort for a number of years now. It's a game at the end of the day and an amature game at that.

BigEZ (Cavan) - Posts: 28 - 30/11/2019 15:43:10    2252282

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I'm heading down to the game in Clones tomorrow and looking forward to seeing who is involved. The problem in Cavan is we concentrate too much on who isn't on the panel.

Fair play to the lads for the past few years and good luck on their travels but there's no reason others can't step up.

2 years ago we were favourites for the drop but were promoted with a manager who turned out to be dreadful.

I believe we have a better manager now and plenty of talent still available - Faulkner, McLoughlin, C. Brady, G Smith, Niall Murray, Martin Reilly wrc.

BreffniGuide (Cavan) - Posts: 474 - 30/11/2019 20:45:42    2252366

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Replying To BreffniGuide:  "I'm heading down to the game in Clones tomorrow and looking forward to seeing who is involved. The problem in Cavan is we concentrate too much on who isn't on the panel.

Fair play to the lads for the past few years and good luck on their travels but there's no reason others can't step up.

2 years ago we were favourites for the drop but were promoted with a manager who turned out to be dreadful.

I believe we have a better manager now and plenty of talent still available - Faulkner, McLoughlin, C. Brady, G Smith, Niall Murray, Martin Reilly wrc."
A few lads stuck their head up for selection today. Connolly, aside from free taking, looked a cut above. Evan Fortune looks an option at midfield. Andrew Graham offers a bit of pace and was busy - he can pick a pass too.
Brian McGhee and Donal Monahan looked good when they came on - a shame we didn't see more of both but I'd imagine they've already done enough to warrant making the panel so were left in reserve.
I thought we saw a bigger, more physical team today than we've seen in the last few years in Cavan jerseys - perhaps Mickey has decided that's what is needed to compliment last year's panel.

BreffniGuide (Cavan) - Posts: 474 - 01/12/2019 21:03:24    2252555

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