Cavan Forum

National Football League 2020

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Replying To fredflint:  "I think we need to stop making apologies for these lads. The fact is Monaghan, Donegal, Tyrone dont lose players like we do so I say that maybe there is a problem mentally with our players. The jersey doesnt mean enough to them, they are not willing to do what needs to be done to win. That is the problem, time to stop making excuses for them."
Agreed 100%, we cant keep going around in circles blaming every manager. We have a good manager in place at the minute and players still dont fancy it

Pullhard1985 (USA) - Posts: 68 - 27/11/2019 12:15:40    2251771

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Replying To Pullhard1985:  "Why is it Cavan seems to be affected far worse than other counties when it comes to key players walking away.
Its extremely frustrating and makes it impossible for us to achieve any real progress.

I am reluctant to criticise players as i realise the commitment is huge and there will likely be no AI medal at the end of the year but even so the only thing that matters is the jersey, you rarely hear of fermanagh players or monaghan players opting out for example. All their best available players will be committed to the cause.

You would wonder if we are suffering badly from a leadership deficit in the squad, the 3 key players mentioned as opting out all tried to get sent off last year against Tyrone when the going got tough. Leaders stand up when the chips are down"
Plus 2 of them were previous captains, if you are talking about leadership.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1484 - 27/11/2019 12:22:18    2251772

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Replying To fredflint:  "I think we need to stop making apologies for these lads. The fact is Monaghan, Donegal, Tyrone dont lose players like we do so I say that maybe there is a problem mentally with our players. The jersey doesnt mean enough to them, they are not willing to do what needs to be done to win. That is the problem, time to stop making excuses for them."
Agreed 100%, we cant keep going around in circles blaming every manager. We have a good manager in place at the minute and players still dont fancy it

Pullhard1985 (USA) - Posts: 68 - 27/11/2019 12:25:34    2251774

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Is it more that age group of player? Clarke, McVeety and Moynagh won Minor and 3 U21 titles. They were coming from success under age, to highs and lows and Senior

Because Galligan, Mackey and Martin Reilly are same age, 32,and they always stick at it.

FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2763 - 27/11/2019 12:27:44    2251775

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Replying To fredflint:  "I think we need to stop making apologies for these lads. The fact is Monaghan, Donegal, Tyrone dont lose players like we do so I say that maybe there is a problem mentally with our players. The jersey doesnt mean enough to them, they are not willing to do what needs to be done to win. That is the problem, time to stop making excuses for them."
Tyrone had a mass exodus of players early last year.
Donegal have had plenty opt out, and only Odhran McNeilas had a non-football excuse. Paul Durcan even flew home from Qatar to play with Ballyboden but wouldn't do the same for Donegal!

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5030 - 27/11/2019 14:58:32    2251803

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Has the squad for 2020 been picked yet? How can you opt out when there is no squad?! They are just not making themselves available for selection for the 2020 squad.

wishfulthinkin (Cavan) - Posts: 1689 - 27/11/2019 15:05:41    2251806

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Replying To wishfulthinkin:  "Has the squad for 2020 been picked yet? How can you opt out when there is no squad?! They are just not making themselves available for selection for the 2020 squad."
Squad is training already.
Tyrone had a few fringe players leave.
Cavan seem to have a couple of key players every year threatening to leave and in addition the lads that come in for 1 year, go again, come back again is just wasting everyones time. If you want to be fit and conditioned for top level county football you need to be putting it in consistently year on year.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1484 - 27/11/2019 15:51:23    2251813

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Replying To FoolsGold:  "Is it more that age group of player? Clarke, McVeety and Moynagh won Minor and 3 U21 titles. They were coming from success under age, to highs and lows and Senior

Because Galligan, Mackey and Martin Reilly are same age, 32,and they always stick at it."
Out of Clarke, Moynagh and McVitty only McVitty is a serious loss, the other 2 huffed and puffed but never really done much for us. Clarke was excellent during our run to the quater final of the All Ireland in 13 but hasn't pushed on since. McVitty will be a loss though, he's probably our best player and biggest scoring threat. Anybody know what new players have been added to the panel?

IamADragon (Cavan) - Posts: 305 - 27/11/2019 15:56:50    2251815

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They play Monaghan in a charity game on Sunday in Clones. It would give an idea of what sort of panel there is.

Gearoid McKiernan is suppose to be out of first few League games, had an operation. Armagh away a tough start.

FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2763 - 27/11/2019 16:20:06    2251821

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Replying To IamADragon:  "Out of Clarke, Moynagh and McVitty only McVitty is a serious loss, the other 2 huffed and puffed but never really done much for us. Clarke was excellent during our run to the quater final of the All Ireland in 13 but hasn't pushed on since. McVitty will be a loss though, he's probably our best player and biggest scoring threat. Anybody know what new players have been added to the panel?"
Yes the all star nominee Moynagh huffed and puffed and never really did anything for us . Good one.

StayDownKing (Cavan) - Posts: 24 - 27/11/2019 16:20:54    2251822

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Replying To IamADragon:  "Out of Clarke, Moynagh and McVitty only McVitty is a serious loss, the other 2 huffed and puffed but never really done much for us. Clarke was excellent during our run to the quater final of the All Ireland in 13 but hasn't pushed on since. McVitty will be a loss though, he's probably our best player and biggest scoring threat. Anybody know what new players have been added to the panel?"
You're in denial.

Moynagh was nominated for an all star.

We have no stand out talent coming through the ranks either, it's looking like this very bleak period for Cavan is set to continue. The players know it too, hence the drop outs.

Ned_Stormcrow (Cavan) - Posts: 1071 - 27/11/2019 16:21:32    2251823

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Replying To IamADragon:  "Out of Clarke, Moynagh and McVitty only McVitty is a serious loss, the other 2 huffed and puffed but never really done much for us. Clarke was excellent during our run to the quater final of the All Ireland in 13 but hasn't pushed on since. McVitty will be a loss though, he's probably our best player and biggest scoring threat. Anybody know what new players have been added to the panel?"
Yeah and who are we gonna replace these lads with?
We don't have the strength in depth to replace them with players of similar caliber, so I suggest all three are significant losses. Add to that a couple of other fringe players who you'd be hoping would make an impression this year have also left.
And for the record, I thought Killian and Conor were both excellent in our run up to the Ulster Final. (v Monaghan, and Armagh)

theDagger1986 (Cavan) - Posts: 181 - 27/11/2019 16:38:31    2251824

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Replying To IamADragon:  "Out of Clarke, Moynagh and McVitty only McVitty is a serious loss, the other 2 huffed and puffed but never really done much for us. Clarke was excellent during our run to the quater final of the All Ireland in 13 but hasn't pushed on since. McVitty will be a loss though, he's probably our best player and biggest scoring threat. Anybody know what new players have been added to the panel?"
I think Cormac Reilly from mullahoran, Evan doughty, Brian McGee, Conor smith Benjamin jelly, that is all I heard so far I think 2 laraghs.

blueman1903 (Cavan) - Posts: 885 - 27/11/2019 16:53:51    2251827

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It's going to be a long 2020 I fear, the drop outs are disappointing but understandable. Donegal and Tyrone showed how far away this current bunch are from making a real breakthrough. I wish Mickey the best of luck in 2020, just as i did Matty in 2018, if he can achieve what Matty did in his final year I will be presently surprised.

kildare blue (Cavan) - Posts: 578 - 27/11/2019 17:54:25    2251844

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Replying To FoolsGold:  "I read recently Vinny Corey and Dessie Mone are intending to play on with Monaghan next year. Corey is 36 and Mone 35..

The Cavan players probaly annoyed that the under age success hasn't followed up by Senior success.."
You need to read more reliable articles....

wishfulthinkin (Cavan) - Posts: 1689 - 27/11/2019 19:03:18    2251856

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Replying To fredflint:  "I think we need to stop making apologies for these lads. The fact is Monaghan, Donegal, Tyrone dont lose players like we do so I say that maybe there is a problem mentally with our players. The jersey doesnt mean enough to them, they are not willing to do what needs to be done to win. That is the problem, time to stop making excuses for them."
these lads have been playing and training with Cavan for about 10 years. give them a break

s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5518 - 27/11/2019 23:45:05    2251886

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Replying To s goldrick:  "these lads have been playing and training with Cavan for about 10 years. give them a break"
As have most players with most counties. Any comments why this issue is so prevalent in Cavan versus our neighbours in Monaghan or say Fermanagh? Are Cavans players training harder?

How do you think Mickey Graham is taking this. He had a pretty good year 1, hes putting things in place for year 2 and boom all up in smoke, The morale of lads left behind must be very low.

I understand the sentiment that we should be thankful for the efforts players put in, I get that and I am grateful to them. But representing your county and your people should not be seen as some horrible task you have been enslaved to do. There are plenty of positives for the players involved too - the opportunities it gets them, the status it affords them, the doors it opens, the legacy as a person you leave behind.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1484 - 28/11/2019 11:36:07    2251926

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Replying To fredflint:  "As have most players with most counties. Any comments why this issue is so prevalent in Cavan versus our neighbours in Monaghan or say Fermanagh? Are Cavans players training harder?

How do you think Mickey Graham is taking this. He had a pretty good year 1, hes putting things in place for year 2 and boom all up in smoke, The morale of lads left behind must be very low.

I understand the sentiment that we should be thankful for the efforts players put in, I get that and I am grateful to them. But representing your county and your people should not be seen as some horrible task you have been enslaved to do. There are plenty of positives for the players involved too - the opportunities it gets them, the status it affords them, the doors it opens, the legacy as a person you leave behind."
Fermanagh have had a high turnover of player. Many counties have.

Monaghan haven't, you're right there, but that's because they've just gone thru their most successful period ever. I know they only won a couple of ulster titles and no all irelands, but that constitutes success in Monaghan.

The players we have lost, most have given their lives to Cavan football from the age of 17 (and younger in some cases).

I do think Mickey could've pushed on from last year had he kept the main guys together. But McVitty had planned to travel last year and was convinced to stick around. He did and you can't blame him for wanting to go now. He's basically put his plans on hold for 12 months.

I don't know when Clarke made his decision. He's only home from a trip to Thailand so maybe he saw a bit of the world and wants to travel while still young.


I think the best answer I can come up with is the same as some of the above posters - we need to reduce the number of clubs and restructure our club game, become more competitive at club level and let that feed into the county setup.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5030 - 28/11/2019 12:23:59    2251936

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Replying To FoolsGold:  "I read recently Vinny Corey and Dessie Mone are intending to play on with Monaghan next year. Corey is 36 and Mone 35..

The Cavan players probaly annoyed that the under age success hasn't followed up by Senior success.."
Both Vinny Corry and Dessie Mone have Retired

Breffnisbest (Cavan) - Posts: 471 - 28/11/2019 12:32:52    2251938

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Replying To fredflint:  "As have most players with most counties. Any comments why this issue is so prevalent in Cavan versus our neighbours in Monaghan or say Fermanagh? Are Cavans players training harder?

How do you think Mickey Graham is taking this. He had a pretty good year 1, hes putting things in place for year 2 and boom all up in smoke, The morale of lads left behind must be very low.

I understand the sentiment that we should be thankful for the efforts players put in, I get that and I am grateful to them. But representing your county and your people should not be seen as some horrible task you have been enslaved to do. There are plenty of positives for the players involved too - the opportunities it gets them, the status it affords them, the doors it opens, the legacy as a person you leave behind."
Interesting you should pick Monaghan & Fermanagh, both with relatively low numbers to pick from, Fermanagh not very successful these last few years would have a high turnover of players wheras on the other hand Monaghan who have won 2 Ulster Titles (2013 &15),played in an AI semi final (2018) and playing in Division 1 since 2015 would have had a low turnover of players.

In general the successful counties generally can hang on to their squad of players but are not immune to lads leaving their panels, if we take Dublin ,Rory O'Carroll,Diarmuid Connolly,Jack McCaffery &Paul Mannion have left the panel at one stage or another during their 5 in a row run.

There was a study done by the Irish News in 2018 on player turnover in the championship from 2008-2017 , it showed Cavan with the 5th highest turnover with 88 players used , below Leitrim(99) Derry (98) Carlow (91) Westmeath (89) and just ahead of Meath & Louth (87) & Down & Antrim (86) Clare,Tipperary & Roscommon (85).

In fairness to Cavan a lot of this turnover was the result of the intergration of a lot of our successful U21's onto the various senior panels.Would we have had as high a turnover if it wasn't for the U21's ? maybe maybe not.

aceofspades (Cavan) - Posts: 256 - 28/11/2019 13:47:05    2251952

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