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Replying To Cavan_Shambles: "The shills for the status quo have always been here on this forum, deflecting from warranted criticism, defending the indefensible, attacks on posters when they're faced with facts they can't answer. Best to ignore them. It cost Cavan fans a lot of money in this day and age to drive to Ballybofey last weekend, between tickets, fuel in the car, bite to ate etc. To watch that rubbish served up. Not good enough. If supporting my county was free I wouldn't be as incensed as I was last Sunday. At this stage, cavan supporters should be asking serious questions of the county board." What specifically is your issue with the county board? There's plenty worse than them, just look at the limerick manager's comments yesterday for an example. The reality is Cavan don't have sufficient elite talent to expect to mix it with the big boys. Mackey is our best player since McCabe by a distance, realistically the only Cavan player of the last 15 years who would be at home in almost any team in any era. Replacing him will be nigh on impossible. Also, of all the optouts, how many would actually make a notable difference? Rory Dunne, Niall McDermott etc gave good service to Cavan but injuries curtailed them and no one could deny that their best days are behind them. Others simply haven't delivered on underage potential. Givney is the only one whose departure is really worth lamenting. Having said all that, it would be intriguing to see if a tactically astute manager could bring Cavan on. Atleast the current incumbent can't leave us any worse of than division 2 when his term ends next year. GallantJohnJoe (Cavan) - Posts: 329 - 20/05/2018 13:03:50 2102268 Link
Replying To GallantJohnJoe: "What specifically is your issue with the county board? There's plenty worse than them, just look at the limerick manager's comments yesterday for an example. The reality is Cavan don't have sufficient elite talent to expect to mix it with the big boys. Mackey is our best player since McCabe by a distance, realistically the only Cavan player of the last 15 years who would be at home in almost any team in any era. Replacing him will be nigh on impossible. Also, of all the optouts, how many would actually make a notable difference? Rory Dunne, Niall McDermott etc gave good service to Cavan but injuries curtailed them and no one could deny that their best days are behind them. Others simply haven't delivered on underage potential. Givney is the only one whose departure is really worth lamenting. Having said all that, it would be intriguing to see if a tactically astute manager could bring Cavan on. Atleast the current incumbent can't leave us any worse of than division 2 when his term ends next year." I don't understand some of the comments on here. Surely the belief in playing the game of football comes from wanting to play the club game, training hard, getting that jersey no. handed to you before that game. Take some pride in that jersey. If you don't have that self belief that you are a better player than your opponent. Be true to yourself. Hand that jersey back in. Your of no value to your club team on the day. To improve on your own game, we all have to work hard, you play hard. If you personally want to achieve, you have to work on your own fitness levels, skill levels, discipline, preparation and how you to look after yourself. You bring all of this with you if your involved with your County. A good Management set up should help you improve to another level. That experience should filter back into our own club game. The above is the past, present and future of anyone wanting to play sport. We keep living in the past. No foresight to move forward. We can only talk about our great men that put on the county jersey,Ulster Titles, All Ireland Winners.. Can someone on here show me the 3 year county football team development plan? Our young players of today will learn nothing from our current County Management Team. Protect these guys or it will be another generation passed.... Bring back Peter Donnelly..... upandcomingblue (Cavan) - Posts: 37 - 20/05/2018 16:38:19 2102315 Link
Replying To GallantJohnJoe: "What specifically is your issue with the county board? There's plenty worse than them, just look at the limerick manager's comments yesterday for an example. The reality is Cavan don't have sufficient elite talent to expect to mix it with the big boys. Mackey is our best player since McCabe by a distance, realistically the only Cavan player of the last 15 years who would be at home in almost any team in any era. Replacing him will be nigh on impossible. Also, of all the optouts, how many would actually make a notable difference? Rory Dunne, Niall McDermott etc gave good service to Cavan but injuries curtailed them and no one could deny that their best days are behind them. Others simply haven't delivered on underage potential. Givney is the only one whose departure is really worth lamenting. Having said all that, it would be intriguing to see if a tactically astute manager could bring Cavan on. Atleast the current incumbent can't leave us any worse of than division 2 when his term ends next year." Yes this team will be in division three after 2020. They are not good enough. mowbar (Cavan) - Posts: 452 - 20/05/2018 22:20:14 2102445 Link
Replying To doratheexplorer: "We had a development plan in place. Club championship has being restructured the last two years. This year is the first with it in place. We've had underage success. Our schools and in particular St. Pats are flying. So in my opinion there is no talent issue. What we need to address is player retention. Also we need a tactically astute manager. There is no obvious answer to player retention as lads do have other commitments but the numbers in Cavan is way above average." Player retention depends on results though and player performance. I see a lot of comparisons with Monaghan and ourselves from 2013 and how many players they could keep. Since that game Monaghan have won 2 Ulster titles and are a main stay in Division 1. Their players have delivered. They have justified their manager's faith in them and have been rewarded with his vote of confidence and a nailed down jersey. It's harder for lads coming through to get the break through in a team like that because the bar has been set higher by the starting players. It's also harder for first teamers to walk away from that success and a chance to set the bar even higher. While we have got to an AI quarter since and won promotion to Division 1 twice we have been very average and inconsistent especially where championship is concerned. When lads don't perform they can't expect to be handed the jersey indefinitely. Others on the panel will be thinking "I can do better, where's my shot?". Player disillusion can eventually set in. Dropped players may lose confidence and react badly. Players not getting a run may get frustrated as they feel they could do better and react badly. Even the better players may get frustrated and think "what's the point" if they cannot see a realistic path to the Holy Grail. This team needs a shot in the arm at the moment. But the onus is as much on the players as it is on the manager. Having said that he doesn't fill me with confidence. Hardtimes (Cavan) - Posts: 1056 - 21/05/2018 01:05:17 2102494 Link
Monaghan produced a huge performance yesterday. Great to see a county with a relatively small football population getting the rewards for their efforts. kildare blue (Cavan) - Posts: 578 - 21/05/2018 06:29:32 2102498 Link
Replying To kildare blue: "Monaghan produced a huge performance yesterday. Great to see a county with a relatively small football population getting the rewards for their efforts." Yes, they are a great example to smaller counties about what can be done with proper organisation, administration, promotion of gaelic football and astute management. There is literally no reason other counties cannot adopt the same approach as Monaghan and mix it with the big teams. Cavan in particular. Many other smaller counties like Louth, Sligo, Longford have soccer scenes to contend with, further south there is hurling, for us we don't even have them excuses. Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 21/05/2018 10:04:22 2102546 Link
Malachy O Rourke won 2 Ulster titles also beaten finalist in the 5 years he's been there. The first title he won in his first year 2013. He also brought Fermanagh to a final and they were beaten after a replay I think. He had success with the Gaels too . Shows you the importance of having a Senior Manager longterm that knows what he is doing. That's the key . Compare his 5 years with Terry Hyland 5 years and there no comparison result wise despite the amount of players Hyland had at his disposal. Goes back to knowing what you are doing! Inaroundehouse (Cavan) - Posts: 975 - 21/05/2018 10:27:39 2102555 Link
Replying To Inaroundehouse: "Malachy O Rourke won 2 Ulster titles also beaten finalist in the 5 years he's been there. The first title he won in his first year 2013. He also brought Fermanagh to a final and they were beaten after a replay I think. He had success with the Gaels too . Shows you the importance of having a Senior Manager longterm that knows what he is doing. That's the key . Compare his 5 years with Terry Hyland 5 years and there no comparison result wise despite the amount of players Hyland had at his disposal. Goes back to knowing what you are doing!" Erm.. So whats your point.. Whats Terry got to do with the current setup?? Are you saying the current management don't know what they are doing??? btw, all credit to Monaghan yesterday, made tyrone look ordinary enough. ponger (Cavan) - Posts: 544 - 21/05/2018 13:32:55 2102640 Link
Replying To ponger: "Erm.. So whats your point.. Whats Terry got to do with the current setup?? Are you saying the current management don't know what they are doing??? btw, all credit to Monaghan yesterday, made tyrone look ordinary enough." My point is we need a manager in place for 4/5 years who knows what he's doing. Something we haven't had since McHugh. He won an Ulster championship on the back of an u21 winning side. That's my point. Having managers capable of winning 2 Ulster championship games in 5 years or none in 2 years I'd a pretty poor return for the amount of players that have been used. Inaroundehouse (Cavan) - Posts: 975 - 21/05/2018 14:30:38 2102662 Link
Replying To kildare blue: "Monaghan produced a huge performance yesterday. Great to see a county with a relatively small football population getting the rewards for their efforts." It is? Embarrassing is what it is that their players will play for them and our shower (the ones that dont commit) are sitting at home blaming someone else other than themselves. fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1485 - 21/05/2018 14:37:46 2102666 Link
Replying To Inaroundehouse: "My point is we need a manager in place for 4/5 years who knows what he's doing. Something we haven't had since McHugh. He won an Ulster championship on the back of an u21 winning side. That's my point. Having managers capable of winning 2 Ulster championship games in 5 years or none in 2 years I'd a pretty poor return for the amount of players that have been used." Why does everyone rabble on about the amount of players used. Sure if Cavan used 200 players it would still come down to 2 things. 1. Are they good enough 2. Are they committed Of the 80 odd players mentioned there maybe 10 not playing Intercounty that would improve the current squad. Off the 10 that would improve it, none are committing for various reasons. Just because we won U21 Ulsters doesn't mean we have a God given right to compete at senior level. For the majority of cases it is a half dozen players from U21 ALL IRELAND winning teams that make the grade. The rest are good players that won't really improve whats gone before. The closest thing we had to a Conor McManus in Cavan was Seanie Johnston in his pomp. Name a team that has won a provincial without at least 1 marque forward. ballygowanwater (Cavan) - Posts: 207 - 21/05/2018 15:41:03 2102699 Link
Replying To fredflint: "It is? Embarrassing is what it is that their players will play for them and our shower (the ones that dont commit) are sitting at home blaming someone else other than themselves." Who are all these glorious footballers who are sitting at home unwilling/unable to commit that would transform us into a serious team? Bar Givney, I'm struggling to think of one. GallantJohnJoe (Cavan) - Posts: 329 - 21/05/2018 15:57:15 2102707 Link
Replying To GallantJohnJoe: "Who are all these glorious footballers who are sitting at home unwilling/unable to commit that would transform us into a serious team? Bar Givney, I'm struggling to think of one." Well, for example, Cavan Gaels are the best team in the county at the moment. There are a good few lads on that team that are not committing despite being asked in. One Gaels player started against Donegal. Meanwhile we have a panel full of lads in their 1st county season with no experience of even playing underage at an elite level and so are miles behind in conditioning. If you dont see that then you have your eyes closed. fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1485 - 21/05/2018 16:28:49 2102723 Link
Even when most of these players were in the set-up, the same people were complaining about others that weren't. Some people are impossible to please. If we somehow had the definitive 30 best players available in the squad, we'd still be having the same discussion on here. Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12199 - 21/05/2018 16:29:28 2102724 Link
Replying To ballygowanwater: "Why does everyone rabble on about the amount of players used. Sure if Cavan used 200 players it would still come down to 2 things. 1. Are they good enough 2. Are they committed Of the 80 odd players mentioned there maybe 10 not playing Intercounty that would improve the current squad. Off the 10 that would improve it, none are committing for various reasons. Just because we won U21 Ulsters doesn't mean we have a God given right to compete at senior level. For the majority of cases it is a half dozen players from U21 ALL IRELAND winning teams that make the grade. The rest are good players that won't really improve whats gone before. The closest thing we had to a Conor McManus in Cavan was Seanie Johnston in his pomp. Name a team that has won a provincial without at least 1 marque forward." Well I think after winning 4 u21s in the last 7 years we should be at least able to compete at Senior level. Give me one reason why we shouldn't be able to compete? Inaroundehouse (Cavan) - Posts: 975 - 21/05/2018 16:30:27 2102726 Link
So what you ranting about, competing or winning Ulster.? They lost to Monaghan in 2013 and 15 by 1pt. That was competing. Monaghan went onto win Ulster titles both years. McManus the difference like he was last year. Winning 4 Ulster's means dam all ,fthere is no marquee forward being produced from the teams. FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2824 - 21/05/2018 19:06:08 2102773 Link
Replying To FoolsGold: "So what you ranting about, competing or winning Ulster.? They lost to Monaghan in 2013 and 15 by 1pt. That was competing. Monaghan went onto win Ulster titles both years. McManus the difference like he was last year. Winning 4 Ulster's means dam all ,fthere is no marquee forward being produced from the teams." So how do you produce these marquee forwards?maybe you waiting to grow a few? Eh? The bottom line is there been 7 years wasted by management teams that didn't or dont have a clue what they are at. That's reflected in the amount of players that have walked away this past 7 years. Inaroundehouse (Cavan) - Posts: 975 - 21/05/2018 20:43:44 2102803 Link
Yeah bring back the Tommy Carr days. He was well tuned in, like yourself. FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2824 - 21/05/2018 20:54:02 2102807 Link
Replying To fredflint: "Well, for example, Cavan Gaels are the best team in the county at the moment. There are a good few lads on that team that are not committing despite being asked in. One Gaels player started against Donegal. Meanwhile we have a panel full of lads in their 1st county season with no experience of even playing underage at an elite level and so are miles behind in conditioning. If you dont see that then you have your eyes closed." Let's not pretend that the Gaels are anything overly special either. They wouldn't have got near the Ulster club final if they'd met Kilcoo, Scotstown, Kilcar, Slaughtneil or Omagh in the early rounds. They're the best by far in Cavan but that says more about Cavan than it does about their quality. Which brings us back to the state of cavan club football. As any sensible person knows, we have too many clubs. It should be 30-32, not 40. Impossible to see it being fixed now though. GallantJohnJoe (Cavan) - Posts: 329 - 21/05/2018 21:37:58 2102828 Link
With Mayo and Tyrone already in the back door draw, I think that we need a bit of luck to avoid the likes of them if we have any aspirations of making some sort of move in this years championship. Offaly and Tipp wasn't so bad last year! When it comes to the team selection topic, it seems that we just don't have the commitment there from some of the players mentioned in previous comments so we need to move on. I think that a glaring issue in the last couple of years has been the transition of minor and U21 players with promise into the senior set up. That can be down to the players but apart from Caomhin O'Reilly, we haven't really converted many with major potential. I had high hopes for Galligan but it seems he needs more time. We have a good nucleus of a team but we are lacking a bench with any quality. This is a problem as it is never mind the fact that Mattie starts emptying the bench after 15 minutes. I am very concerned about that and when this is clearly his tactic, it means that we will have at least 5 fringe players on the pitch for the end of a game. I would be more inclined to work it the other way around if he is insisting on this tactic. Reformation (Cavan) - Posts: 356 - 23/05/2018 12:19:35 2103241 Link