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The rugby refs don't seem to get too many forward passes wrong. The lines men in soccer get a lot more off sides right than the pundits or camera first angles. In my opinion the referees job in deciding what is ia black, yellow or red card is much harder and put them much more under scrutiny. I think deciding if a pass went forward or backwards is fairly simple. Look it is nearly impossible to win the ball back from a team who decides they don't need to score anymore. Put 14 behind the ball in their own end of the pitch hand passing it around. If you send 14 after them you are in the wrong end of the pitch. If at least the pass had to go forward there would be some chance to turn them over or at least get them to PLAY. The losing teams tactics are no better. Again it is not about Dublin and Kerry but about the game. Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2655 - 19/09/2019 17:04:34 2237618 Link 0 |
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Did you like the play from Kerry in the first half where the kicked it in 4 or 5 times and didn't win a possession? Those weren't even bad quality balls, they were very accurate at a good trajectory rather than looped in and none of them stuck. I honestly don't see the appeal in that personally." Why do you think? Because they are not trained to win that type of ball. Kerry are no different than anyone else. Trained to run around half the time throwing the ball. Keep the ball. if that means going back to the goalie do it. Take no risk because as long as you have possession you won't be beat. If that is your idea the way the game should be played fine. If that is the best way to entertain going forward we will see. Not mine because I have seen different by players who did not half the resources or training. If those resources were combined with the FOOTballers of yesterday we would have the best game in the world. Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2655 - 19/09/2019 17:19:12 2237625 Link 0 |
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I blame YouTube for showing clips of sexy football and getting some peopleto believe that sport should be entertaining. Sport is about winning and keep ball is another means of grinding out a result. GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7337 - 19/09/2019 17:20:55 2237627 Link 10 |
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Spot on. like I said earlier.. people can complain all they want and always will but at the end of the day it is about winning. If I was in this position I certainly would not care less what anyone who did not win has to say.
boman11 (Antrim) - Posts: 237 - 19/09/2019 17:34:43 2237632 Link 0 |
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As Ulsterman once said following a barrage of criticism over the quality of Ulster football and the blanket system. "If you want entertainment then go to the circus".
Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 19/09/2019 17:50:49 2237637 Link 11 |
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Dublin didn't have 14 players in their own half kerry did that's why Dublin played keep ball
tom84 (Cavan) - Posts: 334 - 19/09/2019 18:39:34 2237648 Link 2 |
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O my God ! I never said Dublin had 14 players behind the ball. I was generalizing as to how the game is played now. Yes I have seen it this year. Dublin are more inclined to go and win the game than most but do also resort to keep ball once ahead and the finishing line is in view.
Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2655 - 19/09/2019 19:32:00 2237657 Link 0 |
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I don't buy that as being a lack of training. Dublin had 4 on 2 in those situations. A ball played from decently outside the 50 on the sideline does take some time to get to the target and lets backs get back to cover. It was clearly a considered tactic of Kerry's to play direct. They prepared for it and still couldn't execute. It's harder for a forward, they have to win and hold possession. The defense just has to spoil. There was a great take by Geaney in the second half and nothing came of it because the defense could crowd him out. I just don't feel it's a question of skills it's just not a good strategy. This idea that players now are not the footballers of yesteryear is rubbish by the way. The game is wholly more complex than it used to be and these guys are executing scores under huge intensity, within gaps in cramped defenses. The standard of player is head and shoulders of that even 15 years ago. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4210 - 19/09/2019 19:45:54 2237663 Link 10 |
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So I am confused. Everyone who goes to a game just to see their team win and don't care about entertainment value. What about the over 1 million people watching. Most who have no skin in the game ? Maybe their only interest is to see someone lose do you think? The person who made this statement belongs in the circus. Don't know doing what because he will make no one laugh.
Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2655 - 19/09/2019 19:47:31 2237665 Link 0 |
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What about them? Players are there to win games not part of a TV entertainment package. The GAA is not a deal in competition with the new series of whatchamacallit on Netflix, Amazon Prime, Disney etc, even if TV companies might think so. There was never such a debate when there were only 3 TV football games broadcast per year. Never discussion like this before someone comments on Twitter, Facebook etc 'What a boring game'. Usually posted by someone who knows very little about sport and us responded to by thousands who know even less about sport. For me a lot of this sport is not entertaining agenda is drummed up by marketeers to hit you up on the internet. I've seen us lose entertaining games and win boring games. Both were sport but I preferred the games we won. I haven't seen many bad circuses. But I have yet to see a clown skin an acrobat for pace and kick a point from 40 yards. GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7337 - 19/09/2019 20:36:55 2237671 Link 11 |
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Ulsterman often makes people laugh but it''s unintentional. Look everyone wants to see quality football but let's not pretend that every county doesn't have a win at all costs mentality. I wasn't a big fan of Pat Gilroy's brand of football but it was a means to an end. Dublin had the floor wiped with them in 2009 and 10. Gilroy set the team up defensively to stop leaking scores and this was at a time when McGuinness was building walls with his players so it was becoming the fashion. Dublin were successful with it but I wasn't a big fan of the style. Gavin blitzed teams in 13 but the kamikaze free flowing football saw him caught in 14 by Donegal. It was fantastic football to watch but just too high risk. So he installed a sweeper, went with a fluid transition defense-first strategy and won 5 in a row. Getting the balance right is important.
Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 19/09/2019 21:18:18 2237684 Link 9 |
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Don't know where you are going with all the internet stuff. I assume most of the people expressing opinions on here are or were involved in the game, or have a long history of supporting it. The two fundamentals of the game are the players and supporters. Take away either and I doubt if the other will be involved for too long. It is obvious that many on here feels the game does not need to entertain.That is certainly their prerogative. Find that strange though. I assume the old adage of "It is not whether you won or lost but how you played the game" has no thinking in the win only matters believers. I have never called the game puke football or would not but it is my prerogative to believe that the style of football has taken the game backwards. Sadly I also believe hurling is going down the same road with increased hand passing making up for the lack of skills with the stick. I will have to take from our discussions the only thing matters to the players is winning and they don't give a damn about the supporters. The supporters only care that their team wins no matter how they play the game. It looks like the GAA only care about the money. Thanks for the lesson. Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2655 - 19/09/2019 21:34:53 2237687 Link 0 |
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I agree with your comments Canuck, on the modern approach to football, and the increased uses hand passing in hurling. Skills are the core of any game, ahead of S+C. thelongridge (Offaly) - Posts: 1735 - 19/09/2019 22:08:55 2237702 Link 0 |
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I agree with your comments Canuck, on the modern approach to football, and the increased uses hand passing in hurling. Skills are the core of any game, ahead of S+C. thelongridge (Offaly) - Posts: 1735 - 19/09/2019 22:10:19 2237703 Link 0 |
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Pre-Internet Gaelic Football was a sport. The supporters, and small football audience because of few televised games, talked about games in terms like big hits, high fielding, good scores, winning, losing , good/bad refereeing etc. Entertainment was rarely a term used describing football. Post-internet, many are describing Gaelic Football using the entertaining or boring terms. Unfortunately not just Gaelic football, someone is selling the line that many sports have to be entertaining. I think it's bullshit to draw in casual TV viewers or internet user to part with their cash. Everyone has their own definition of entertaining. Mr Internet will use the horrific 'Barcelona-like' term as if sport which is not all-out attack is somehow inferior. It isn't. I think in soccer the art of defending is a dying one. I'd prefer to watch Mayo playing lovely free flowing football and win but play a blanket defence and win rather than open attacking stuff and lose. Anyways, I'm a bad example. It's not free flowing football our good defending that's entertaining for me in a championship game. It's the physical encounters. Players battering the shite out if each other to win the ball, then the roar from the crowd when one team wins the ball them losing from their seats. Television can never adequately capture that and it never will. GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7337 - 19/09/2019 22:58:59 2237717 Link 9 |
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can you actually name me one team in Ireland, club or county that plays the game without caution and plays for the entertainment of the crowd as a priority, that are actually successful? and before anyone mentions Dublin, remember what this thread began with. that is in no way a criticism of Dublin. for me they did what any team with intelligence would and have done to get over the line. Kerry call themselves the 'purists' etc of the game. poke fun at other counties for not playing football 'the right way'. look at the reaction of their supporters in 2014 on here, in the RTE studio and beyond. they did what they had to against a well drilled Donegal side. their supporters were still crowing about 'wintering well' and 'the cream always rises to the top' none of them held their nose at the performance the same way they did two years previous against the same team and many others of that era. Kerry are only one example but they are by no means alone with this nonsense but in my experience its nothing more than a bitter excuse used by those who cant take a loss on the chin and get over themselves or those who dont really understand the game or played it in any more than a low level kickabout. SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2385 - 19/09/2019 23:19:40 2237718 Link 1 |
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Kick passes over the bar? Fair play to him!
baire (Galway) - Posts: 1785 - 19/09/2019 23:36:26 2237723 Link 0 |
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Nothing "crazy" about limiting hand-pass to backwards only (not forward at any rate).. Easy to referee - lot easier than counting passes, or now that I think about it - counting steps taken. In case you haven't noticed the game as a spectacle has become a bit of a joke. Its obviously no game compared to hurling. I'm quickly losing interest outside of cheering for my own club/county. And, I'm not on my own. As i said in earlier posts in various conversations I've had at work, in a pub, wherever - its the same thing. Outside of die-hards the game is unwatchable - just watching fellas throwing the ball around the place. Handpass, my a$$, may as well be throwing it. Frankly the game is an embarrassment at the moment. The crux of the problem is this - the PRIMARY means of moving the ball forward is the handpass. Until the primary means is kicking then we are doomed to be watching this handball/basketball variant instead of football. It would be interesting to count the number of handpasses in any profile match to number of kicks! The handpass was introduced to reward a winner of high-ball to release the ball quickly, in the "old days" he was surrounded and conceded a free for holding onto the ball. The handpass was introduced to remedy this - but its got out out of hand (no pun intended). The handpass can still be used to move forward in the sense you can pass back to a man "off the shoulder" as is the case today, but should be (a) "secondary" means to progress or (b) get of trouble to a man better placed.. Hurling is far better to watch as there is more contested ball. Football would be the same if there more long kicking. Tactics would involve, big men in the forward line for high-balls, smaller faster men for diagonal low balls in. The benefits: 1. More contested possession (this gets crowds going) - a better spectacle 2. More variety in tactics would develop 3. Less impetus to have mass defense as its harder to get out of a defensive position Something has got to be done though - this was the best suggestion I heard - haven't heard a better one yet. Solo_Run (Leitrim) - Posts: 209 - 20/09/2019 09:01:19 2237751 Link 0 |
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All this rubbish about entertainment and puke football or keep-ball etc etc is purely and entirely a front for begrudgery. People never see it in their own teams or teams they like and they never will. If they don't like a team they will watch that team with the intent of finding "negatives" and delight in having their bias confirmed. Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12116 - 20/09/2019 10:13:59 2237771 Link 8 |
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Yes genius, if a lad kicks 4 points from play on All Ireland final day your general point about him is nonsensical. If he spent the day floating around as a link man not having an influence then maybe you could question his role.
TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 7885 - 20/09/2019 10:24:51 2237773 Link 9 |