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Not So Super 8S..

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Second year in and last round of games two dead rubbers in one group already, no excitement this year at all, predictable outcomes.. Belclare (Galway) - Posts: 904 - 20/07/2019 20:54:30 2213682 Link
The Dublin/Tyrone game is far from a dead rubber. They will both want to win to avoid the nightmare of a semi final against Donegal!!! MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 20/07/2019 21:08:14 2213692 Link
It's inevitable in any group format that there will be dead rubbers. There isn't 8 teams in the country at an equal level to make all the games competitive. I don't like the format either and I think Croke Park is a total disaster as a venue in this round. The games should be moved to neutral venues agreeable to both teams if the Super 8's are to be retained going forward. GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 20/07/2019 21:11:33 2213694 Link
Replying To Belclare: "Second year in and last round of games two dead rubbers in one group already, no excitement this year at all, predictable outcomes.." Just thinking the same thing, 35,000 at the double header this evening. gallarus14 (Kerry) - Posts: 127 - 20/07/2019 21:18:47 2213701 Link
Replying To GeniusGerry: "It's inevitable in any group format that there will be dead rubbers. There isn't 8 teams in the country at an equal level to make all the games competitive. I don't like the format either and I think Croke Park is a total disaster as a venue in this round. The games should be moved to neutral venues agreeable to both teams if the Super 8's are to be retained going forward." And that will correct what? Armchair fans desire for "atmosphere"? Give me a break, players love playing there, deal with the structure of the competitions first. I assume you believe the beating Roscommon got would be any different in Hyde Park? Nonsense arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4898 - 20/07/2019 21:47:45 2213720 Link
Replying To arock: "And that will correct what? Armchair fans desire for "atmosphere"? Give me a break, players love playing there, deal with the structure of the competitions first. I assume you believe the beating Roscommon got would be any different in Hyde Park? Nonsense" No definitely not but you must accept that Dublin getting two games in Dublin is wrong. Croke Park is in Dublin, that is not Dublin's fault and it is the only place you could have the national stadium. However when you put a structure in place that specifies one home, one away and one neutral, then the game should be neutral when it's Dublin's turn. I feel that the reason this is not the case is that the GAA are afraid that a precedent could be set for other rounds such as semi finals and even finals. I don't think they should worry about that. Croke Park is the place for semi finals and finals, but not round robin games. BaldyBadger (Cork) - Posts: 311 - 20/07/2019 21:57:18 2213728 Link
Replying To BaldyBadger: "No definitely not but you must accept that Dublin getting two games in Dublin is wrong. Croke Park is in Dublin, that is not Dublin's fault and it is the only place you could have the national stadium. However when you put a structure in place that specifies one home, one away and one neutral, then the game should be neutral when it's Dublin's turn. I feel that the reason this is not the case is that the GAA are afraid that a precedent could be set for other rounds such as semi finals and even finals. I don't think they should worry about that. Croke Park is the place for semi finals and finals, but not round robin games." But the rules of the S8s say nothing about a neutral stadium. Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 20/07/2019 22:14:16 2213737 Link
Replying To BaldyBadger: "No definitely not but you must accept that Dublin getting two games in Dublin is wrong. Croke Park is in Dublin, that is not Dublin's fault and it is the only place you could have the national stadium. However when you put a structure in place that specifies one home, one away and one neutral, then the game should be neutral when it's Dublin's turn. I feel that the reason this is not the case is that the GAA are afraid that a precedent could be set for other rounds such as semi finals and even finals. I don't think they should worry about that. Croke Park is the place for semi finals and finals, but not round robin games." I don't think it's meant to be neutral though, it' to be played in croke park not neutral venue is it not? achara (Monaghan) - Posts: 563 - 20/07/2019 22:27:21 2213744 Link
Replying To BaldyBadger: "No definitely not but you must accept that Dublin getting two games in Dublin is wrong. Croke Park is in Dublin, that is not Dublin's fault and it is the only place you could have the national stadium. However when you put a structure in place that specifies one home, one away and one neutral, then the game should be neutral when it's Dublin's turn. I feel that the reason this is not the case is that the GAA are afraid that a precedent could be set for other rounds such as semi finals and even finals. I don't think they should worry about that. Croke Park is the place for semi finals and finals, but not round robin games." It LITERALLY went to Congress and it was voted in favour of Dublin having two games there. Turkeys voring for xmas. Not our fault. waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13650 - 20/07/2019 22:37:58 2213751 Link
There's always going to be the possibility of dead rubbers in a group stage format. Had Cork beaten Tyrone tonight, that wouldn't have been the case. ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 20/07/2019 22:38:00 2213752 Link
Replying To BaldyBadger: "No definitely not but you must accept that Dublin getting two games in Dublin is wrong. Croke Park is in Dublin, that is not Dublin's fault and it is the only place you could have the national stadium. However when you put a structure in place that specifies one home, one away and one neutral, then the game should be neutral when it's Dublin's turn. I feel that the reason this is not the case is that the GAA are afraid that a precedent could be set for other rounds such as semi finals and even finals. I don't think they should worry about that. Croke Park is the place for semi finals and finals, but not round robin games." Why couldnt cork host a semi final ? brisbane (Galway) - Posts: 674 - 20/07/2019 22:48:04 2213758 Link
Replying To arock: "And that will correct what? Armchair fans desire for "atmosphere"? Give me a break, players love playing there, deal with the structure of the competitions first. I assume you believe the beating Roscommon got would be any different in Hyde Park? Nonsense" What on earth are you on about? I said in my first paragraph that there isn't 8 suitable teams for the competition and also that I'm not a fan of the format. And yes, Croke Park is too big for these non knockout games IMO. GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 20/07/2019 22:51:52 2213760 Link
Replying To Belclare: "Second year in and last round of games two dead rubbers in one group already, no excitement this year at all, predictable outcomes.." Super 8s is a pet name. All Ireland quarter final group stage is its correct name. Dead rubbers always likely for group stages and knock out football will always bring more excitement. Its time to bring back the old format that was in place 2001 to 2017. ispeakwisdom (Roscommon) - Posts: 2487 - 20/07/2019 22:54:55 2213762 Link
Replying To MuckrossHead: "The Dublin/Tyrone game is far from a dead rubber. They will both want to win to avoid the nightmare of a semi final against Donegal!!!" That's a good one Muck, the nightmare for us could be playing Dublin in the semi final if we get that far, good game in prospect against Kerry and against Mayo in Castlebar assuming they beat Meath. Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 2757 - 20/07/2019 23:05:25 2213769 Link
Replying To ispeakwisdom: "Super 8s is a pet name. All Ireland quarter final group stage is its correct name. Dead rubbers always likely for group stages and knock out football will always bring more excitement. Its time to bring back the old format that was in place 2001 to 2017." The only thing that needed to be remedied was the beaten provincial finalists should have got home advantage in their games against the 4 remaining qualifiers, that would have helped the thing a bit. No need to rush through the All Ireland semi finals and final either, back to the old way with the final on the 3rd Sunday in Sept. Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 2757 - 20/07/2019 23:09:14 2213773 Link
But the GAA have done it arseways with the super 8s. Most tournaments in world sport do their round robin at the START of the competition (Champions League, Heineken Cup, World Cups, all the Yank sports, even the hurling championship), then get into the knock out rounds which is where the real excitement usually happens. Everyone knows the group stages may have the odd exciting game, but their main purpose is to separate the strong teams from the weak teams before the knock out rounds. The mistake the GAA have made with this super 8s malarkey is that they've hyped it up as this major accomplishment for teams to aspire to, (even the name, "super" 8s), so when the group stages often peter out to their inevitable conclusion, fans are left with an acute sense of anti-climax. So while most sports (practically all, actually) design competitions to ESCAPE the group stages, the GAA have contrived to design a competition whereby the big "prize" is to QUALIFY for the group stages! Like I said earlier, completely arseways! I would say you couldn't make it up but the GAA obviously have! ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 20/07/2019 23:15:33 2213779 Link
Tyrone should put out an U21 team. They have to beat one of Kerry/Donegal in the semi and Dublin in the final. If they win or get near Dublin in the group match it won't help them in the second game. skirge7 (UK) - Posts: 251 - 20/07/2019 23:24:44 2213784 Link
Replying To ballydalane: "But the GAA have done it arseways with the super 8s. Most tournaments in world sport do their round robin at the START of the competition (Champions League, Heineken Cup, World Cups, all the Yank sports, even the hurling championship), then get into the knock out rounds which is where the real excitement usually happens. Everyone knows the group stages may have the odd exciting game, but their main purpose is to separate the strong teams from the weak teams before the knock out rounds. The mistake the GAA have made with this super 8s malarkey is that they've hyped it up as this major accomplishment for teams to aspire to, (even the name, "super" 8s), so when the group stages often peter out to their inevitable conclusion, fans are left with an acute sense of anti-climax. So while most sports (practically all, actually) design competitions to ESCAPE the group stages, the GAA have contrived to design a competition whereby the big "prize" is to QUALIFY for the group stages! Like I said earlier, completely arseways! I would say you couldn't make it up but the GAA obviously have!" Excellent post. Also some counties are not sure if they even want to qualify. Frankie Griffin of Clare did a great interview a few weeks ago 'super 8s my arse' or something like that he said. The super 8s offer the likes of Clare the possibility of three drubbings and sets them back and all but eliminates the chance of a Tipperary, Fermanagh qualifying for an All Ireland semi final. But sure the Dubs like it do we'll keep it. bennybunny (Cork) - Posts: 3917 - 21/07/2019 10:29:15 2213863 Link
Croke Park as a venue is failing the Super 8s. Killarney, Dr. Hyde Park and Ballybofey brought a great atmosphere to our games last week. Rural Ireland abú! legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7873 - 21/07/2019 11:15:51 2213890 Link
Replying To bennybunny: "Excellent post. Also some counties are not sure if they even want to qualify. Frankie Griffin of Clare did a great interview a few weeks ago 'super 8s my arse' or something like that he said. The super 8s offer the likes of Clare the possibility of three drubbings and sets them back and all but eliminates the chance of a Tipperary, Fermanagh qualifying for an All Ireland semi final. But sure the Dubs like it do we'll keep it." The dubs like the 8s because they have 2 home games and it gives them a chance to clear the cobwebs. KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 21/07/2019 11:21:32 2213895 Link