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Kildare Maintain Underage Superiority In Leinster

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Replying To jimbodub: "Congrats to Kildare Hats off. Very disappointing result but you can only say well done. Kildare are now the Current minor & U20 Leinster Champions & All Ireland Champions Hugely impressive and the work being done in Kildare must be top drawer! Imagine if Meath could only do so well. Quick.. FFS Split Dublin! Thank feck we have an outstanding senior side! Despite all the "advantages" despite the funding going into underage in schools which these kids would have benefited from... ( which is supposedly responsible for the sky falling down over certain hysterical posters counties) We can't seem to buy ourselves an underage title... and Kildare are the superior county in Leinster But.. but.. all the funding... I'm so confused! Nah.. only confirms what I've been saying all along. Many congrats again to Kildare it's a pity that your senior setup hasn't been as well run. It's tine now to really start looking at yourselves and asking why you can't seem to bring all this promising talent through.. Do you have the right people pulling the strings? Despite those questions hats off to Kildare GAA and the outstanding work bring done. I can only stand back and admire it." Meath won the Leinster Minor last year and the U-17 championship the year before that beating both Dublin and Kildare along the way, our U20 whilst ultimately suffering a disappointing exit in 2018 were the only team to beat Kildare last year, Meath also won the Gerry Reilly Tournament last year, essentially now a Leinster U16 Championship and have begun this years campaigns with two wins in that competition and our U20 are in a Leinster semi final v Laois next Tuesday night, so I don't think we are doing so bad. Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3734 - 08/07/2019 01:20:51 2207539 Link
Imagine arguing that your county doesn't have a financial advantage but then using an U17 game as proof. This defeats your own argument. PK57 (Louth) - Posts: 1653 - 08/07/2019 07:02:29 2207553 Link
Replying To PK57: "Imagine arguing that your county doesn't have a financial advantage but then using an U17 game as proof. This defeats your own argument." You're right. He probably should have used the senior hurlers as an example or the camogie team who were hammered by Cork at the weekend. Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 08/07/2019 08:30:53 2207562 Link
Replying To Richieq: "Meath won the Leinster Minor last year and the U-17 championship the year before that beating both Dublin and Kildare along the way, our U20 whilst ultimately suffering a disappointing exit in 2018 were the only team to beat Kildare last year, Meath also won the Gerry Reilly Tournament last year, essentially now a Leinster U16 Championship and have begun this years campaigns with two wins in that competition and our U20 are in a Leinster semi final v Laois next Tuesday night, so I don't think we are doing so bad." No, not bad at all, coming very close many times more than those victories you've mentioned, however, Leinster this decade has been dominated by Dublin at underage, with Kildare picking up titles also. At minor, Kildare have 4 to Dublin's 4, at u20/21, Dublin have 6 to our 2. Saying Kildare are the kingpins if underage football in Leinster is simply not true, however, those involved with the underage setups deserve plaudits as they've developed teams that have been winning against Dublin. What Leinster really needs is for them minor successes to be translated to senior- an obvious statement with no obvious means of achieving. Sweetspot (Kildare) - Posts: 323 - 08/07/2019 09:39:49 2207609 Link
Replying To browncows: "It was on youtube live (tg4)- you should be able to look at all the match if you check TG4 youtube on your pc" Thanks browbcows. lilywhite1 (Kildare) - Posts: 2990 - 08/07/2019 09:48:18 2207616 Link
Congratulations Kildare! I know a few of the young lads involved & I saw them play earlier in the championship- some incredibly talented players so delighted for them. greysoil (Monaghan) - Posts: 965 - 08/07/2019 09:51:20 2207619 Link
Replying To jimbodub: "Very telling to see such a negative reaction to my post, a congratulatory thread to Champion the efforts in Kildare but also not sugar coat their lack of success at senior level A good news story in Leinster football is twisted into petty insults against the poster The Crocodile tears cried for Leinster football turns into something else when Kildare's outstanding success flys in the face of the narrative they are trying to drive down people's throats The same posters would have preferred Dublin to win so they could come on here and bemoan Leinster's troubles To that I've zero doubt. Keep at it Kildare and best of luck with the games ahead, I'll be supporting your efforts What you've achieved in the last few years at underage deserved to be highlighted Now it's time to figure out why it's not being translated into more senior players, I know you lost very promising talent to AFL, but you've had outstanding success and hopefully you can build on it, you don't need crocodile tears and fake self serving concern. Dublin's underage success was mostly won by one man. Jim Gavin, and then back boned with Dessie Farrell but have no doubt Gavin's imprint was very much on his teams too. We were very fortunate to have Jim Gavin and it's that sort of personnel that I feel is Kikdares greatest weakness at present, the ability to have one guiding influence to bring these players on Tyrone very similarly had Mickey Harte and Dublin had our own version in Jim Gavin. I wish Kildare all the best, the substantial success you've brought to Leinster deserves to be rewarded" You think Kildare not having a Jim Gavin or Mickey Harte as manager is their "greatest weakness." Jim you are deluded if you think that. A couple of decent minor/u20 teams does not automatically mind you will be contesting All Ireland in a few years. Plenty of examples where teams have won numerous underage titles and done nothing at senior. If Jim or Mickey went to Kildare this year how do you they would do? win an all Ireland? Catch yourself on. The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts: 2088 - 08/07/2019 10:22:04 2207641 Link
Genuine question, would Kildare prefer an extra 1 million over the next 10 years to be pumped into GDO's throughout the county or have Jim Gavin as manager for say 5 years? keithlemon (Australia) - Posts: 920 - 08/07/2019 13:52:25 2207834 Link
Take it from someone who knows, underage success counts for nothing. In Cavan, we won 4 U21 provincial titles in a row, and the senior team improvement wasn't at all significant. Maybe 25-30%, from a very low base. Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 08/07/2019 14:24:11 2207876 Link
Replying To Cavan_Shambles: "Take it from someone who knows, underage success counts for nothing. In Cavan, we won 4 U21 provincial titles in a row, and the senior team improvement wasn't at all significant. Maybe 25-30%, from a very low base." I wouldn't agree that underage success counts for nothing. If the right people and the right system for want of a better word are in place then young talented players can be brought through to senior level and succeed. There will always be a rate of attrition where young players drop out. But with the right people involved the rate can be minimised. lilywhite1 (Kildare) - Posts: 2990 - 08/07/2019 14:49:22 2207893 Link
Replying To Cavan_Shambles: "Take it from someone who knows, underage success counts for nothing. In Cavan, we won 4 U21 provincial titles in a row, and the senior team improvement wasn't at all significant. Maybe 25-30%, from a very low base." Do you think that might have been different if Cavan had someone like Jim Gavin at the helm? keithlemon (Australia) - Posts: 920 - 08/07/2019 15:15:31 2207916 Link
Very little between Kildare, Meath and Dublin at u17/18 over the last few years but Dublin doing better from there. The growth in population has certainly helped Kildare and I'd imagine Meath also. I remember seeing a couple of years ago that 2/3 of a minor sq were 1st generation Kildare. Anyway long may it last lillyboy (Kildare) - Posts: 429 - 08/07/2019 15:16:44 2207918 Link
Replying To Cavan_Shambles: "Take it from someone who knows, underage success counts for nothing. In Cavan, we won 4 U21 provincial titles in a row, and the senior team improvement wasn't at all significant. Maybe 25-30%, from a very low base." Missed opportunity to push on. If those players were available then they should have made the jump up to senior. Pure mismanagement issue combined with setup around it Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 08/07/2019 15:31:43 2207923 Link
Replying To Donegalman: "Missed opportunity to push on. If those players were available then they should have made the jump up to senior. Pure mismanagement issue combined with setup around it" They did make the jump to senior. They're the backbone of the current senior team at the moment. We won those titles from 2011-2014. As I said, it hadn't the impact we envisaged. Cavan_Shambles (Cavan) - Posts: 575 - 08/07/2019 15:56:33 2207940 Link
Replying To Donegalman: "Missed opportunity to push on. If those players were available then they should have made the jump up to senior. Pure mismanagement issue combined with setup around it" I think in order for underage talent to blossom into success, the teams that have achieved this over the last couple of decades have had one management team in place to bring them along. Mickey Harte Jim McGuinness Jim Gavin Those men had bunches of young lads, the raw material, talented players, molded their progress, gave them an identity and style of play that complimented their natural attributes and guided them all the way bringing them success and then made the step up with them. Their players wanted to play for them and the players trusted them. It's what Kerry are hoping to replicate at the moment with Keane. Kildare are missing this sort of continuity and they've had no manager near the caliber of the above to fully capitalize on their underage success. I've no doubt that with the raw material Kildare have produced the likes of the men mentioned above would have utilized that talent in a far more productive way. jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 08/07/2019 16:14:42 2207960 Link
Replying To lilywhite1: "I wouldn't agree that underage success counts for nothing. If the right people and the right system for want of a better word are in place then young talented players can be brought through to senior level and succeed. There will always be a rate of attrition where young players drop out. But with the right people involved the rate can be minimised." I think you're absolutely right. jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 08/07/2019 16:45:32 2207982 Link
Replying To The_Fridge: "You think Kildare not having a Jim Gavin or Mickey Harte as manager is their "greatest weakness." Jim you are deluded if you think that. A couple of decent minor/u20 teams does not automatically mind you will be contesting All Ireland in a few years. Plenty of examples where teams have won numerous underage titles and done nothing at senior. If Jim or Mickey went to Kildare this year how do you they would do? win an all Ireland? Catch yourself on." Very much agree with this. A big difference is the likes of Tyrone and Dublin already had strong senior teams for the young lads to be blended into. Kildare or Cavan senior teams were at a lower base. Obviously having a Jim Gavin or Mickey Harte wouldn't do any harm but it's not the crucial difference. HighKings (Meath) - Posts: 271 - 08/07/2019 16:47:49 2207987 Link
Replying To HighKings: "Very much agree with this. A big difference is the likes of Tyrone and Dublin already had strong senior teams for the young lads to be blended into. Kildare or Cavan senior teams were at a lower base. Obviously having a Jim Gavin or Mickey Harte wouldn't do any harm but it's not the crucial difference." Dont know if i necessarily agree with this, i think managers are critical to realising the potential of young players. I often think if anyone else was managing Dublin, then many of the young players we have seen "came from no where" maybe would still be trying to break through, another Dublin manager or really any manager would have stuck with the tried and trusted and we could still be seeing "legends" like Bernard Brogan, MDM, Macker all starting. We lost a whole generation of young players in the 90's by sticking with the tried and trusted approach of the 95 team. There are about 20+ of the current Dublin panel brought through as young players by Jim Gavin. The philosophy of the manager and even their coaching ability is absolutey key in my opinion. You can see a difference in Mayo this year with it, Horans approach VS previous managers. TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4445 - 08/07/2019 17:29:07 2208014 Link
Replying To TheUsername: "Dont know if i necessarily agree with this, i think managers are critical to realising the potential of young players. I often think if anyone else was managing Dublin, then many of the young players we have seen "came from no where" maybe would still be trying to break through, another Dublin manager or really any manager would have stuck with the tried and trusted and we could still be seeing "legends" like Bernard Brogan, MDM, Macker all starting. We lost a whole generation of young players in the 90's by sticking with the tried and trusted approach of the 95 team. There are about 20+ of the current Dublin panel brought through as young players by Jim Gavin. The philosophy of the manager and even their coaching ability is absolutey key in my opinion. You can see a difference in Mayo this year with it, Horans approach VS previous managers." The harvest from Kildare's recent underage success can only be judged in the next 3-5 years. That will depend on the transition and who is responsible for it, in whatever form it takes. The next senior management team will need to be visionary enough and patient enough to put short term gains aside in favour of mid to to long term development eg if that means spending time in Div 2 so be it. lilywhite1 (Kildare) - Posts: 2990 - 08/07/2019 21:55:47 2208199 Link
Daith says "Dublin don't necessarily have footballers with talent that is light years ahead of other counties. They have a management team who are pure genius. Gavin and Sherlock have reinvented gaelic football and could win all Irelands with most of the top 8 counties. That's Dublin's biggest advantage not the money." You have it sussed but please try and keep it to yourself! "The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he didn't exist" jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 08/07/2019 22:33:34 2208235 Link