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Joe Or TJ?

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Messi or Ronaldo? Federer or Nadal? But the big one is who is better and more influential, Joe or Tj?

tribesman125 (Galway) - Posts: 139 - 14/06/2019 13:12:14    2194820

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TJ

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13503 - 14/06/2019 13:45:06    2194833

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TJ

KickItInLad (Galway) - Posts: 7 - 14/06/2019 13:47:43    2194835

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Replying To tribesman125:  "Messi or Ronaldo? Federer or Nadal? But the big one is who is better and more influential, Joe or Tj?"
It doesnt matter if you are black or white

woops (Kerry) - Posts: 2066 - 14/06/2019 13:50:48    2194837

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It's TJ now but Joe's not as dominant as he was due to maturing young and so much mileage. Joe circa 2010 and TJ now is a fair argument. Id be 50/50 on that one

PressureKick (UK) - Posts: 89 - 14/06/2019 14:07:39    2194854

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TJ over the last 3-4 years.... earlier in careers joe was better than TJ.

overthehill72 (Meath) - Posts: 326 - 14/06/2019 14:27:02    2194860

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Schools must be finishing up for summer!

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 1789 - 14/06/2019 14:43:39    2194873

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A few years ago I'd have said Joe as I felt TJ had had it too easy coming up but I think it's almost a reversal now.

Both supremely talented and so brilliant to watch. I can't split them.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 12747 - 14/06/2019 14:44:13    2194874

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At his best Joe.He's past his best now.

endgame (Roscommon) - Posts: 1157 - 14/06/2019 15:03:56    2194882

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Replying To SaffronDon:  "Schools must be finishing up for summer!"
Them days are long gone for me I'm afraid my friend. The reason I bring it up is because cheddar plunket on the gaa hour hailed Tj as better than both Shefflin and DJ. So I was curious as to who people thought was better from he's two greats that are still playing.

tribesman125 (Galway) - Posts: 139 - 14/06/2019 15:04:21    2194883

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Right now Tj. Overall Joe Canning. Canning has not only won at every level he participated in but also was THE MAN on every team. Tj had Shefflin and others to grow under when he first got on the Senior team whereas Joe was the man right away. Joe also plays on a non "Big 3" team which makes a lot of his accomplishments all the more incredible. Either guy is a legend in my books and any team would be honored and lucky to have them.

Tj should be in the running this year for Hurler of the Year.

Trump2020 (Galway) - Posts: 498 - 14/06/2019 15:04:49    2194884

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TJ for now based on what we have seen so far. Seems to have it all.

WildPundit (Tipperary) - Posts: 1635 - 14/06/2019 15:33:22    2194895

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Replying To tribesman125:  "Them days are long gone for me I'm afraid my friend. The reason I bring it up is because cheddar plunket on the gaa hour hailed Tj as better than both Shefflin and DJ. So I was curious as to who people thought was better from he's two greats that are still playing."
Fair enough. For the record it was the Messi v Ronaldo bit.

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 1789 - 14/06/2019 15:49:37    2194903

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TJ.

gaelicgab (USA) - Posts: 835 - 14/06/2019 15:55:20    2194906

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Over their careers Joe. TJ worked and worked on his game.

In 2010, age 22, TJ was peripheral in the AI loss to Tipp. Joe arrived as the complete package, giving the Rock hell of it and posting a huge tally v Cork in 2010 age 19. TJ just keeps getting better with age, his physique even from year to year, handy to have your own gym!

2 greats. There are a few others current players performing consistently at a high level i'd throw into the mix. Patrick Horgan, Seamie Callinan.

Defenders like Daithi Burke, 4 all stars in a row, Paudie Maher are worthy of mention.

BliainanÁir (Laois) - Posts: 598 - 14/06/2019 16:13:30    2194911

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Two great players.Nothing between them in my opinion.

Barnowl94 (Galway) - Posts: 3150 - 14/06/2019 16:20:27    2194914

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Replying To PressureKick:  "It's TJ now but Joe's not as dominant as he was due to maturing young and so much mileage. Joe circa 2010 and TJ now is a fair argument. Id be 50/50 on that one"
Joe 'circa 2012' was a lot fitter for the fray than Joe anytime prior to 2012, imo. He looked a different animal in 2012, in AC's first year at the helm. Arguably wasn't fit enough, until the penny dropped for him before that 2012 season. He's been top notch since, or at least has himself primed physically to be top notch. Interesting that you'd say he peaked in 2010, and I'd say he wasn't even fit in 2010, at least relative to his post 2011 fitness/physique, or even relative to his current fitness level at age 30/31.

Pope_Benedict (Galway) - Posts: 2299 - 14/06/2019 17:18:13    2194937

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There's an old thread on this and below is my take on it which I stand by. Noel Mcgrath even incl his move to midfield and his health issues a fews years ago averages more from play than either. Their free taking is huge but they don't always contribute the same from play as what they did when they were younger players



http://www.hoganstand.com/Forum/Details/105548?County=National&PageNumber=1&TopicID=105548

Better medal collection TJ. Higher scoring rate Canning. Better player - who knows! Very difficult to say who has more of an influence these days.
Dont have the luxury of seeing possessions, assists or key passes unfortunately.

Frees and line balls are huge and there arent many around better at either than JC or TJ but I had a look at their scores from play.

TJ
2018 - 5 point from 5 games
2017 - 1-3 from 3 games
2016 - 5 from 5

JC
2018
8 from 4
2017 - 10 from 5
2016 - 1-5 from 5

Average from play over last 3 years
TJ - 1.23 (16 points in 13 games or 1-13 in 13 games)
JC - 1.85 (26 points in 14 games, 1-23 in 14 games)

For what its worth I also totted up the scores from play for Noel McGrath who plays a similar type play making role for Tipp
NMc
2018 1-8 from 4
2017 - 11 from 5
2016 - 10 from 5
32 in 14 games or 2.28 per game. Noel wouldnt be considered a huge scorer for Tipp but has been an unsung hero since his last all star. I'm not saying he's better than either by any stretch but it's interesting all the same.

As hugely important as frees are in hurling I do think the massive scores these lads are racking up from frees clouds peoples judgements. From an inside forward persepective I'd imagine there's no one within 20 points of John McGrath with scores from play the last few years for example.
B

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 2749 - 14/06/2019 18:21:00    2194968

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People saying Joe overall but TJ last 3 years is baffling to say the least! I'm guessing these people have only seen KK once or twice in the last 3 years?
TJ was back to his best the last day but 16-18 he wasnt at his best by any means.

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 2749 - 14/06/2019 18:25:18    2194971

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TJ Reid is more of an out and out scorer for Kilkenny. Joe Canning has turned into more of a playmaker out the field. They are different types of player. Both brilliant though and good examples to young hurlers in every county. Though I think the talent and vision they have couldnt be coached.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 799 - 14/06/2019 19:46:46    2195017

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