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Lower Tiers = No Coverage

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Divisions 3 and 4 of the Football League get little or no media coverage. Divisions 2A and lower in the Hurling League get little or no coverage. The McDonagh Cup and lower levels get little or no coverage. It's the future for any second tier inter-county Gaelic Football Championship. If a second tier does get voted in for any reason, a reduction from 32 to 16 is a bit drastic. I'd suggest: 4 groups of 6 = 24 teams in the Maguire Cup. Second tier then for the rest in whatever agreed format. In the Maguire Cup: - Have the same groups for two years. - Having 3 home games one year will mean 2 home games the following year. - Group winners home against a group runner-up in the quarter-finals. - Bottom team in each group into relegation semi-finals. - Relegated team replaced by second tier winner in the following year. The introduction of a second tier might raise the standard when counties have to earn their place in the Maguire Cup. If the Maguire Cup is competitive with 24 let it alone. If teams are out of their depth, possibly at that stage seek a further reduction. Enjoy ye're respective county's championship and have a nice summer. Is mise le meas, The Legend. legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7871 - 18/05/2019 17:40:39 2185255 Link
I find it a bit odd that none of the hurling championships outside of Liam McCarthy are covered on our own beloved Hoganstand's live tracker. The live tracker is brilliant during the leagues at keeping up to date with the latest scores, including all the lower divisions. I appreciate that it requires quite a bit more work to cover more games but why aren't the Joe McDonagh and other hurling competitions included in the live updates?? Tying to get live updates of the Derry - Donegal Christy Ring game today was virtually impossible. My own county's official Twitter page seems to have forgotten the game was even on. HandballRef (Donegal) - Posts: 520 - 18/05/2019 19:00:06 2185280 Link
Replying To legendzxix: "Divisions 3 and 4 of the Football League get little or no media coverage. Divisions 2A and lower in the Hurling League get little or no coverage. The McDonagh Cup and lower levels get little or no coverage. It's the future for any second tier inter-county Gaelic Football Championship. If a second tier does get voted in for any reason, a reduction from 32 to 16 is a bit drastic. I'd suggest: 4 groups of 6 = 24 teams in the Maguire Cup. Second tier then for the rest in whatever agreed format. In the Maguire Cup: - Have the same groups for two years. - Having 3 home games one year will mean 2 home games the following year. - Group winners home against a group runner-up in the quarter-finals. - Bottom team in each group into relegation semi-finals. - Relegated team replaced by second tier winner in the following year. The introduction of a second tier might raise the standard when counties have to earn their place in the Maguire Cup. If the Maguire Cup is competitive with 24 let it alone. If teams are out of their depth, possibly at that stage seek a further reduction. Enjoy ye're respective county's championship and have a nice summer. Is mise le meas, The Legend." I think if you don't have a roughly even split to the tiers it's easy to think of the lower tier as being a truly losers competition. The split would feel exclusionary. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4239 - 18/05/2019 19:08:54 2185282 Link
The equation is rather simple. By in large the most populous counties are high tier counties in both hurling and football. Naturally, the broadcaster is going to attract as many viewers as possible for ad revenue, viewing figures etc. Not to be patronising but hurling is a minority sport in at least half the counties. Division 3 and 4 football counties tend to be the more sparsely populated ones. You could definitely argue RTE as our public broadcaster should be more inclusive in its coverage. Simple fact is they don't. Why that is, isn't rocket science. RadioactiveTan (UK) - Posts: 28 - 18/05/2019 23:02:56 2185354 Link
Replying To RadioactiveTan: "The equation is rather simple. By in large the most populous counties are high tier counties in both hurling and football. Naturally, the broadcaster is going to attract as many viewers as possible for ad revenue, viewing figures etc. Not to be patronising but hurling is a minority sport in at least half the counties. Division 3 and 4 football counties tend to be the more sparsely populated ones. You could definitely argue RTE as our public broadcaster should be more inclusive in its coverage. Simple fact is they don't. Why that is, isn't rocket science." We pay RTE a licence fee exactly for that. The lesson for division 3 and 4 football counties is dont vote for tier 2 football if you want any Dublin media coverage jobber (Westmeath) - Posts: 1459 - 19/05/2019 07:06:04 2185394 Link
I'm not getting this thing about tv coverage, what sport shows lower tier matches on a par with top tier and who goes out of their way to watch them? Just call it Snr and Intermediate championship, much easier to market than B or micky mouse cup and the later stages would get tv time as the amount of games dwindle. Difference in hurling and football is a team going up could be competitive in the football but that hasn't happened in the hurling. Plenty of formats where everyone can stay in snr if good enough but have a fall back championship if not lillyboy (Kildare) - Posts: 429 - 19/05/2019 08:22:21 2185402 Link
This issue came up in another thread recently. If we want coverage for a tier 2 comp the GAA need to split the broadcasting rights in to lots and sell off tier 1 to the highest bidders, most likely RTE and SKY. They could then in turn sell / give tier 2 to Virgin, TG4 or both ensuring the games are covered. Rte and sky have never shown championship games between lower division sides and they never will, commercially it makes no sense to do so. TG4 have shown a willingness to cover games that others won't because they need to generate original content. I know the Irish commentary is not to everyone's liking but that's the only way you will get tier 2 games on telly imo. GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 19/05/2019 09:45:14 2185415 Link
If counties & the public want to see where lower tier competition will leave them, this is a classic example. The GAA is heading for elitism at all levels & it's all about power, glory, media exposure, money, TV rights & sponsorship. Recent utterings from Croke Park about trying to get more coverage for secondary competitions & that RTE replied by saying it was all about the numbers, was just a white wash by Croke Park. Croke Park can dictate what they want shown but have bent the knee to the large TV rights money & are dictated to by SKY et al, recent utterings have just been a soft soap. If there was any real wish to do more for weaker counties, it could be done, but the REAL desire is not there. Counties such as Offaly are in free fall & what's needed there is massive investment in coaching & clubs. They are suffering financially economically as a county & will struggle to get big financial sponsors, instead 70 miles up the road, a county overflowing with sponsors & big wealthy clubs, the GAA is pouring record sums of investment into them. The fact is Dublin are the money making machine for the GAA & Offaly are not. The contrast couldn't be starker, reality is despite the odd comment thrown as crumbs to appease, they are only interested in the glory part. Club players have seen this for years & despite dropping out & leaving in droves from minor to adult level, all the GAA did was dismiss the CPA as an irritant & introduced more Inter County games. Think about naming a competition "Super 8's", what does that imply & what direction does it tell you, that an Association that would bestow that name, want to go ? Uimhir.a.3. (Galway) - Posts: 409 - 19/05/2019 10:01:03 2185420 Link
Replying To GeniusGerry: "This issue came up in another thread recently. If we want coverage for a tier 2 comp the GAA need to split the broadcasting rights in to lots and sell off tier 1 to the highest bidders, most likely RTE and SKY. They could then in turn sell / give tier 2 to Virgin, TG4 or both ensuring the games are covered. Rte and sky have never shown championship games between lower division sides and they never will, commercially it makes no sense to do so. TG4 have shown a willingness to cover games that others won't because they need to generate original content. I know the Irish commentary is not to everyone's liking but that's the only way you will get tier 2 games on telly imo." I think that solution works for a lot of people. The latter stages of a 2nd tier football competition with promotion to the top tier would be picked up if it was scheduled around the same time as the semifinals and finals of a top tier, when those games thin out. I also think the focus should not be on how much these guys get on tv. The focus should be how do we give all county players a good quality season. The primary competition should not be a knockout competition. It should be played at the best time of the season. Players should be guaranteed more than 2 games. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4239 - 19/05/2019 10:47:52 2185432 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "I think that solution works for a lot of people. The latter stages of a 2nd tier football competition with promotion to the top tier would be picked up if it was scheduled around the same time as the semifinals and finals of a top tier, when those games thin out. I also think the focus should not be on how much these guys get on tv. The focus should be how do we give all county players a good quality season. The primary competition should not be a knockout competition. It should be played at the best time of the season. Players should be guaranteed more than 2 games." Agreed, but people seem to be obsessed about the coverage issue. It's the first thing that comes up when a tiered championship is mentioned anywhere. I'm just saying there is a solution to that problem. @Uimhir3 I couldn't agree with your post more GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 19/05/2019 11:16:26 2185438 Link
Replying To Uimhir.a.3.: "If counties & the public want to see where lower tier competition will leave them, this is a classic example. The GAA is heading for elitism at all levels & it's all about power, glory, media exposure, money, TV rights & sponsorship. Recent utterings from Croke Park about trying to get more coverage for secondary competitions & that RTE replied by saying it was all about the numbers, was just a white wash by Croke Park. Croke Park can dictate what they want shown but have bent the knee to the large TV rights money & are dictated to by SKY et al, recent utterings have just been a soft soap. If there was any real wish to do more for weaker counties, it could be done, but the REAL desire is not there. Counties such as Offaly are in free fall & what's needed there is massive investment in coaching & clubs. They are suffering financially economically as a county & will struggle to get big financial sponsors, instead 70 miles up the road, a county overflowing with sponsors & big wealthy clubs, the GAA is pouring record sums of investment into them. The fact is Dublin are the money making machine for the GAA & Offaly are not. The contrast couldn't be starker, reality is despite the odd comment thrown as crumbs to appease, they are only interested in the glory part. Club players have seen this for years & despite dropping out & leaving in droves from minor to adult level, all the GAA did was dismiss the CPA as an irritant & introduced more Inter County games. Think about naming a competition "Super 8's", what does that imply & what direction does it tell you, that an Association that would bestow that name, want to go ?" I think counties sponsorship money should be taxed above a certain level and redistributed to those not making it up to that level. Say it 1m is the threshold (the average county board sponsorship take) Dublin make 3m Kildare make 800k Carlow make 400k Longford make 600k Wicklow make 200k 5m total, average of 1m per county. 50% of Dublin's excess gets redistributed to Carlow and Kildare. So that's 1m to be redistributed to the others. Kildare are 200k below the threshold Carlow are 600k below the threshold Longford are 400k below the threshold Wicklow are 800k below the threshold In total those below the threshold are 2m below. The 1m surplus from Dublin will be split accordingly to half the distance for each county below the threshold. So Kildare get 100k redistributed Carlow 300k Longford 200k Wicklow 400k. Dublin are now on 2m Kildare 900k Carlow 700k Longford 800k Wicklow 600k Counties are still incentivised to take in as much sponsorship as they can but the impact of each counties individual appeal is mitigated and some competitive balance is created. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4239 - 19/05/2019 11:47:40 2185444 Link
The problem with a divide is almost anybody from Div 2 to 4 can beat each other. Ofally very low in Div 3 should have beaten meath who were promoted to Div 1. Outside of Dublin and Kerry it's very competitive. Then you have Donegal, Galway, Tyrone and Mayo who sometimes reach that level. So do you go with a super 8 as the All Ireland and put every one else into tier 2? If that's the case you might as well make a tier 2 super 8's. Everyone who loses in the All Ireland qualifiers goes into a new qualifier. The 4 who lost in the last qualifier round for the main super 8's go straight in so the rest would be looking to qualify for 4 spots. It will still get feck all coverage bar the final but it's a tier 2 that anybody can win while keeping the current structure. Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 19/05/2019 12:28:05 2185459 Link
Replying To Jack_Goff: "The problem with a divide is almost anybody from Div 2 to 4 can beat each other. Ofally very low in Div 3 should have beaten meath who were promoted to Div 1. Outside of Dublin and Kerry it's very competitive. Then you have Donegal, Galway, Tyrone and Mayo who sometimes reach that level. So do you go with a super 8 as the All Ireland and put every one else into tier 2? If that's the case you might as well make a tier 2 super 8's. Everyone who loses in the All Ireland qualifiers goes into a new qualifier. The 4 who lost in the last qualifier round for the main super 8's go straight in so the rest would be looking to qualify for 4 spots. It will still get feck all coverage bar the final but it's a tier 2 that anybody can win while keeping the current structure." So something that could be done. Every team plays 4 grading rounds to include their Provincial championships. All these championships should be open draw. Round 1 Ulster and Leinster Preliminary round fixtures: 4 matches. 12 other interprovincial open draw matches between 7 Ulster, 5 Leinster, 6 Munster and 6 Connacht teams Round 2 Provincial championship quarterfinals: 12 Matches 4 other interprovincial open draw matches between 1 Ulster team, 3 Leinster teams (losing preliminary round teams) and 2 each from Munster and Connacht (2 bye teams) Round 3 16 teams making Provincial finals play the 16 teams not making the Provincial semifinals 16 matches Round 4 Provincial semifinals 8 matches Open draw interprovincial matches between 16 teams that didn't make their provincial semifinals Every team plays 2 home and 2 away fixtures Round 5 Provincial finals. All Ireland 3 tiers Tier 1 12 teams in 3 groups of 4 Tier 2 12 teams in 3 groups of 4 Tier 3 8 teams in 2 groups of 4 Tiers are seeded based on performance in the grading competitions. Tiers 1 and 2 top 2 from each group into knockout rounds, 2 best ranked group winners get bye to the semifinals. Tier 3 top 2 from each group to semifinals. Tier 2 champions guaranteed a spot in following season's tier 1 Tier 3 champions guaranteed a spot in following season's tier 2 Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4239 - 19/05/2019 13:19:37 2185478 Link
It's the same in every sport PyatPree (Cork) - Posts: 376 - 19/05/2019 15:05:21 2185500 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "I think counties sponsorship money should be taxed above a certain level and redistributed to those not making it up to that level. Say it 1m is the threshold (the average county board sponsorship take) Dublin make 3m Kildare make 800k Carlow make 400k Longford make 600k Wicklow make 200k 5m total, average of 1m per county. 50% of Dublin's excess gets redistributed to Carlow and Kildare. So that's 1m to be redistributed to the others. Kildare are 200k below the threshold Carlow are 600k below the threshold Longford are 400k below the threshold Wicklow are 800k below the threshold In total those below the threshold are 2m below. The 1m surplus from Dublin will be split accordingly to half the distance for each county below the threshold. So Kildare get 100k redistributed Carlow 300k Longford 200k Wicklow 400k. Dublin are now on 2m Kildare 900k Carlow 700k Longford 800k Wicklow 600k Counties are still incentivised to take in as much sponsorship as they can but the impact of each counties individual appeal is mitigated and some competitive balance is created." Taxed by the GAA to redistribute it? Then counties can urderdeclare their sponsorship deal, the lower counties get feck all then. Why should the stronger counties work hard at getting more sponsorship just for it to be taken away. Let the top counties earn the rewards of their hard work on sponsorship. If the GAA are serious about it they should help the so-called weaker counties improve their sponsorships. Possibly get a broadcaster to at least have highlights of Tier 2 games to discuss.Or even a Tier 2 YouTube channel for highlights and a few vids and banter from supporters. It's also up to these counties to get working on it, in social media, local newspapers, radio stations. Wooly Parkinson is always plugging Laois footballers and hurling and in fairness often talks about so-called weaker counties, often chatting with their players and coaches. Of course he has his own sponsor. It's difficult to get kids to do anything these days, so a bit of coverage, be it Sunday Game, highlights on the Player, interview on YouTube with some faces from the county teams might get them involved and some pride in the county jersey. Even if none of that happens can the GAA just do one thing? Publicise the Cúlcamps better. The TV ad looks great but put a bit more in the newspapers, county players in the local papers etc. The camps are great but they can, and I think should, make better use of this great opportunity to get more kids involved and shine a big shiny positive light on the GAA. GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7360 - 19/05/2019 16:02:28 2185506 Link
The reason there is less coverage of the lower divisions is that the standards are lower & the audience is non existant at a national level. As another poster says, it's the same in every sport. MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 19/05/2019 16:02:44 2185507 Link
Instead of taxing sponsorship how about the GAA stopped giving Dublin the LIONS share of funds and redistribute them to counties with lessor sponsorship. The big counties like Dublin, Kerry and Mayo with their huge sponsorships will be even more motivated to get good deals and continue their fundraisers as the GAA gives them less. Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 19/05/2019 16:44:49 2185511 Link
Replying To GreenandRed: "Taxed by the GAA to redistribute it? Then counties can urderdeclare their sponsorship deal, the lower counties get feck all then. Why should the stronger counties work hard at getting more sponsorship just for it to be taken away. Let the top counties earn the rewards of their hard work on sponsorship. If the GAA are serious about it they should help the so-called weaker counties improve their sponsorships. Possibly get a broadcaster to at least have highlights of Tier 2 games to discuss.Or even a Tier 2 YouTube channel for highlights and a few vids and banter from supporters. It's also up to these counties to get working on it, in social media, local newspapers, radio stations. Wooly Parkinson is always plugging Laois footballers and hurling and in fairness often talks about so-called weaker counties, often chatting with their players and coaches. Of course he has his own sponsor. It's difficult to get kids to do anything these days, so a bit of coverage, be it Sunday Game, highlights on the Player, interview on YouTube with some faces from the county teams might get them involved and some pride in the county jersey. Even if none of that happens can the GAA just do one thing? Publicise the Cúlcamps better. The TV ad looks great but put a bit more in the newspapers, county players in the local papers etc. The camps are great but they can, and I think should, make better use of this great opportunity to get more kids involved and shine a big shiny positive light on the GAA." You'd penalise those not declaring sponsorship money, harshly to be honest. Potentially dismissal from the championship. Those counties work hard for their money. They still get to keep a lot of it. Maybe 50% is too high a tax. Maybe there should be a cap on spending. Counties aren't in it on their own by the way. For successful competitions, resources have to be shared around. It's competition that breeds interest. Yes Dublin maybe lose out early on but they probably win long run if there's a better competition. Sponsors are drawn in if there's more bums on seats. Fewer people care about Leitrim v Roscommon in a Connacht semi final than Tipperary v Cork. Why would we actually want more of Leitrim Roscommon shown. Fewer people care so fewer people's interest would be provided for when lower tier competitions are shown. The Sunday Game's roundup show should deprioritise covering the games they aired live. Otherwise though the viewing figures should dictate what is shown. Why is it important that the second tier isn't shown anyway, these counties aren't getting much air time anyway under the status quo. It shouldn't stop their players from being able to compete in a proper schedule of games each year. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4239 - 19/05/2019 16:57:06 2185515 Link
Replying To Jack_Goff: "Instead of taxing sponsorship how about the GAA stopped giving Dublin the LIONS share of funds and redistribute them to counties with lessor sponsorship. The big counties like Dublin, Kerry and Mayo with their huge sponsorships will be even more motivated to get good deals and continue their fundraisers as the GAA gives them less." The money that the GAA gives to Dublin is development money. It is spent on coaching juveniles. You literally want to take money away from Dublin's children. Money is already being redistributed to Meath, Wicklow, Kildare, Louth and Belfast. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4239 - 19/05/2019 17:05:58 2185518 Link
The McDonagh Cup is part of the McCarthy Cup race. It'll probably take a big result from a McDonagh Cup team against a third placed provincial team to put the competition in the spotlight. Many people forget that Limerick played a preliminary quarter-final last year. legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7871 - 19/05/2019 17:17:22 2185523 Link