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"Leinster Venue Decision A Sign Of Falling Football Crowds"

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Replying To royaldunne:  "Really?? Just drawing on recent form or lines of form. Kildare humiliated mayo last year. Meath beat Kildare this year, last time we played Galway we beat them, and last year Roscommon needed a dodgy penalty and a free both in extra time to DRAW with Meath at HOME. so can't understand how you'd be so confident. Really there is nothing to suggest otherwise."
RD how can you make a case that in any way implies the Kildare team that beat Mayo are on par with the Kildare team that played the league this year? You'll be the first one talking about how much we've regressed when it suits your argument another day..

Sweetspot (Kildare) - Posts: 127 - 16/05/2019 11:14:30    2184528

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Replying To Jack_Goff:  "If you took any of these leinster teams they'd at least have a chance in connaught or ulster."
Behave yourself, The Mayo team of the last few years was every bit as good as Dublin & only for Croke Park being a home venue for Dublin would have won All Ireland titles while Galway are in a different league to them at the moment. In Ulster, any of Tyrone, Donegal or Monaghan would have hammered Meath out the gate in an Ulster final these past 10 years.

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 4919 - 16/05/2019 11:22:33    2184531

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Replying To royaldunne:  "Really?? Just drawing on recent form or lines of form. Kildare humiliated mayo last year. Meath beat Kildare this year, last time we played Galway we beat them, and last year Roscommon needed a dodgy penalty and a free both in extra time to DRAW with Meath at HOME. so can't understand how you'd be so confident. Really there is nothing to suggest otherwise."
A few little FYI's

1) "Recent form".. isn't .."last year" chief. In sporting terms last year is an age ago. "recent form" would suggest you should

2) Your logic on why he shouldn't be confident is fundamentally flawed. Quelle surprise

3) You have a neck like a giraffe for having a go at someone for being confident without foundation when you are the embodiment of confident without foundation.

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13486 - 16/05/2019 12:09:31    2184549

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Replying To MuckrossHead:  "Behave yourself, The Mayo team of the last few years was every bit as good as Dublin & only for Croke Park being a home venue for Dublin would have won All Ireland titles while Galway are in a different league to them at the moment. In Ulster, any of Tyrone, Donegal or Monaghan would have hammered Meath out the gate in an Ulster final these past 10 years."
Leinster teams have regressed massively since the Dublin slaughter began. Any county in Leinster will tell you the best 30 players are not signing up. In Meath there are a lot of players who turn down call ups. The reason being they have no provincial honours to play for. If Donegal or Monaghan were in Leinster getting hammered every year I believe the same would happen.

Likewise if Leinster counties were in Ulster or Connaught I believe they'd be in a stronger position from a more competitive province.

Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2784 - 16/05/2019 12:14:28    2184554

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Replying To Sweetspot:  "RD how can you make a case that in any way implies the Kildare team that beat Mayo are on par with the Kildare team that played the league this year? You'll be the first one talking about how much we've regressed when it suits your argument another day.."
Well upto that game. Kildare has lost nearly every match they played in, what was it? In all competitions obc league championship Kildare hadn't won a single game in 11 months. This year they had

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 15918 - 16/05/2019 12:23:28    2184560

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Replying To waynoI:  "A few little FYI's

1) "Recent form".. isn't .."last year" chief. In sporting terms last year is an age ago. "recent form" would suggest you should

2) Your logic on why he shouldn't be confident is fundamentally flawed. Quelle surprise

3) You have a neck like a giraffe for having a go at someone for being confident without foundation when you are the embodiment of confident without foundation."
Look a fellow Meath man such as yourself , well done btw to cilles having 3 players on senior Meath team last week and that could expand to 4 v Carlow some achievement for ur club Wayne. You must be proud even if you are a plastic dub at this stage .
Confidence is a weird thing. I have never gone into a game not been confident, I'm very much a glass half full man.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 15918 - 16/05/2019 12:27:49    2184561

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A lot of moaning going on as usual on Hoganstand.

galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 1583 - 16/05/2019 12:44:31    2184568

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Replying To Jack_Goff:  "Leinster teams have regressed massively since the Dublin slaughter began. Any county in Leinster will tell you the best 30 players are not signing up. In Meath there are a lot of players who turn down call ups. The reason being they have no provincial honours to play for. If Donegal or Monaghan were in Leinster getting hammered every year I believe the same would happen.

Likewise if Leinster counties were in Ulster or Connaught I believe they'd be in a stronger position from a more competitive province."
In fairness Meath's woes go far deeper than just Dublin's dominance.

It's been discussed many times here so I won't be brining anything new to light here but we really didn't help ourselves so we have no right to blame anybody else.

We fell away from being an elite team after 2001 for some of the following reasons:

1. We made a balls of our club championship in 2003 going from 4 groups of 4 to 2 groups of 8 and evenutally 3 groups 6, this is only being sorted now.

2. We fell way behind Dublin, Kerry, Tyrone etc in terms of youth development, this cost us dearly and we finally started addressing this issue 4-5 years ago, but it takes time.

3. We chopped and changed managers too often, Eamon O'Brien in particular done well in 2009 & 2010 but was then inexplicably axed and to be honest we haven't had a good summer since!

4. Our time was just uo, we had a spell of 15-20 years as a top team, which is more than most but very hard to keep that going. However we could have remained more competitive if we'd have gotten our house in order.

One other thing, look we're not in Ulster or Connacht, we're in Leinster, that should be our focus. Also it's worth nothing that we haven't beaten an Ulster team in championship football since Tyrone in 2007!

Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8215 - 16/05/2019 13:03:28    2184578

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Replying To royaldunne:  "Well upto that game. Kildare has lost nearly every match they played in, what was it? In all competitions obc league championship Kildare hadn't won a single game in 11 months. This year they had"
We'd beaten Derry well and Longford (who knocked Meath out of Leinster) in the run up and had many very strong performances and narrow league defeats en route to Carlow which was a car crash, but a stand-alone in that regard, in terms of Kildare's 2018 performances. This year isn't close to being the same.

Sweetspot (Kildare) - Posts: 127 - 16/05/2019 13:57:06    2184599

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Replying To royaldunne:  "Look a fellow Meath man such as yourself , well done btw to cilles having 3 players on senior Meath team last week and that could expand to 4 v Carlow some achievement for ur club Wayne. You must be proud even if you are a plastic dub at this stage .
Confidence is a weird thing. I have never gone into a game not been confident, I'm very much a glass half full man."
Thanks for addressing the post all the same ..

So what you're telling me is you personally can be confident cause confidence is "a weird thing and you're a glass half full man", but if someone else is confident in their team and is also a glass half full man, you will forensically dissect their reasons to be confident because of results a year ago dictate that they can't possibly win?

Cool.

Makes perfect sense

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13486 - 16/05/2019 14:13:23    2184604

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Replying To Jack_Goff:  "Leinster teams have regressed massively since the Dublin slaughter began. Any county in Leinster will tell you the best 30 players are not signing up. In Meath there are a lot of players who turn down call ups. The reason being they have no provincial honours to play for. If Donegal or Monaghan were in Leinster getting hammered every year I believe the same would happen.

Likewise if Leinster counties were in Ulster or Connaught I believe they'd be in a stronger position from a more competitive province."
An now don't be blaming the Dubs for Meath being shite for years.

Dubsfan28 (Dublin) - Posts: 2146 - 16/05/2019 15:07:35    2184633

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Replying To waynoI:  "Thanks for addressing the post all the same ..

So what you're telling me is you personally can be confident cause confidence is "a weird thing and you're a glass half full man", but if someone else is confident in their team and is also a glass half full man, you will forensically dissect their reasons to be confident because of results a year ago dictate that they can't possibly win?

Cool.

Makes perfect sense"
:-)

Dubsfan28 (Dublin) - Posts: 2146 - 16/05/2019 15:09:29    2184634

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Replying To Kurt_Angle:  "Here's the first round results from that period:

2005 v Longford - Dublin by 19
2006 v Longford - Dublin by 2 (in Longford)
2007 v Meath - Dublin by 4 (after replay)
2008 v Louth - Dublin by 13
2009 v Meath - Dublin by 2
2010 v Wexford - Dublin by 7
2011 v Laois - Dublin by 8

The close games were 2006 (in Longford where Longford really should have won), 2007 (where Meath should have won the first game) and 2009 (where Dublin should have won by more, though they had a scare in the last minute where Sheridan could / should have equalised). I don't think many people would disagree that Dublin should have played more games outside Croker in that period but I'd be interested to hear which ties they would have lost playing in the opposition's venue?"
Westmeath 2008. We lost in February in Parnell Park in the league by 2 points. We beat Dublin in the Div 2 final in Navan that season by 5 points and lost by 2 in Croke park in the Leinster championship. Had that game been Tullamore, Navan or Cusack park..... but we will never know.

The_Biler (Westmeath) - Posts: 84 - 16/05/2019 18:06:08    2184683

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Royal Dunne... dont you live in westmeath or something like that ,?

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13486 - 16/05/2019 18:38:40    2184687

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Replying To royaldunne:  "Really?? Just drawing on recent form or lines of form. Kildare humiliated mayo last year. Meath beat Kildare this year, last time we played Galway we beat them, and last year Roscommon needed a dodgy penalty and a free both in extra time to DRAW with Meath at HOME. so can't understand how you'd be so confident. Really there is nothing to suggest otherwise."
Go on keep looking in the mirror and tell yourself "we are brilliant"!!

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4135 - 16/05/2019 23:28:26    2184760

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Replying To The_Biler:  "Westmeath 2008. We lost in February in Parnell Park in the league by 2 points. We beat Dublin in the Div 2 final in Navan that season by 5 points and lost by 2 in Croke park in the Leinster championship. Had that game been Tullamore, Navan or Cusack park..... but we will never know."
You said it, we will never know nor do we care! The best thing to say about this thread is to do away with the provincial competitions and then we wouldn't have to put up with this psychotic revisionism.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4135 - 16/05/2019 23:30:46    2184761

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Replying To The_Biler:  "Westmeath 2008. We lost in February in Parnell Park in the league by 2 points. We beat Dublin in the Div 2 final in Navan that season by 5 points and lost by 2 in Croke park in the Leinster championship. Had that game been Tullamore, Navan or Cusack park..... but we will never know."
You're right, that was a close if slightly odd game. Westmeath scored a goal in the first minute and Dublin spent the rest of a very tight game chipping away at that lead. Who knows how that would have played out in a different venue as a very tidy Westmeath team pushed Tyrone a lot closer in the qualifiers than Dublin did in the quarter finals. My post was in response to first round games in Leinster, though several teams pushed Dublin very close in that era:

2005 - Meath by 2, Wexford by 4 (Dublin only pulled away towards the end with Wexford leading for a large part of the game), Laois by 1
2006 - Longford by 2 (daylight robbery that Dublin won that one)
2007 - Meath draw (where they should have won the first game - Dublin scored a square ball goal while Meath had a goal disallowed for a push in the back, though these aren't always given)
2008 - Westmeath by 2 (as above)
2009 - Meath by 2 (though Dublin should have won that by more), Kildare by 3 (smashing game with a great Cahill goal)
2010 - Meath win
2011 - Kildare by 1 (disputed free at the end), Wexford by 3 (better team lost - Dublin had to rely on an OG to get back into it)

Any or all of those results could have gone against Dublin in that era if they were played away from Croker. However, Dublin might have been freed a bit from the expectations of the Hill, which was a positive when on the front foot but a negative when things were going against Dublin. It's all speculation, though, cos we'll never know.

Kurt_Angle (Dublin) - Posts: 510 - 17/05/2019 11:56:45    2184872

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Replying To waynoI:  "Royal Dunne... dont you live in westmeath or something like that ,?"
He's gone very quiet all of a sudden.

The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts: 1689 - 17/05/2019 12:21:52    2184883

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Replying To Kurt_Angle:  "You're right, that was a close if slightly odd game. Westmeath scored a goal in the first minute and Dublin spent the rest of a very tight game chipping away at that lead. Who knows how that would have played out in a different venue as a very tidy Westmeath team pushed Tyrone a lot closer in the qualifiers than Dublin did in the quarter finals. My post was in response to first round games in Leinster, though several teams pushed Dublin very close in that era:

2005 - Meath by 2, Wexford by 4 (Dublin only pulled away towards the end with Wexford leading for a large part of the game), Laois by 1
2006 - Longford by 2 (daylight robbery that Dublin won that one)
2007 - Meath draw (where they should have won the first game - Dublin scored a square ball goal while Meath had a goal disallowed for a push in the back, though these aren't always given)
2008 - Westmeath by 2 (as above)
2009 - Meath by 2 (though Dublin should have won that by more), Kildare by 3 (smashing game with a great Cahill goal)
2010 - Meath win
2011 - Kildare by 1 (disputed free at the end), Wexford by 3 (better team lost - Dublin had to rely on an OG to get back into it)

Any or all of those results could have gone against Dublin in that era if they were played away from Croker. However, Dublin might have been freed a bit from the expectations of the Hill, which was a positive when on the front foot but a negative when things were going against Dublin. It's all speculation, though, cos we'll never know."
my god reading that it shows how lucky we were to get out of Leinster in those years

haha give me a break

ConnollyDub (Dublin) - Posts: 1766 - 17/05/2019 12:52:57    2184901

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Replying To waynoI:  "Royal Dunne... dont you live in westmeath or something like that ,?"
Haha have to say check mate on that one wayno. I know Mr Dunne is a glass half full kind of guy so looking forward to his positive spin on this one!

Lads on the other issue we will never know but my point is the GAA only started moving Dublin out of Croker when it was far too late. We all know they wanted Dublin into every Leinster final post 2005 as the crowds you could draw were huge. But those crowds were only huge because the championship was competitive. It they were in any way partial Dublin wouldn't have played every Leinster match in Croker post Longford scare. It sickens me with the way they treated the province as it was by far the best in Ireland. Talk about killing your brand.

Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2784 - 17/05/2019 13:16:14    2184908

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