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Dublin Getting 2 Home Games In The Super 8s. Fair Or Unfair?

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Replying To TheUsername:  "Wouldn't be surprised to see Cork pull Armagh at home tomorrow, I've thought for a while they fancied sending us down to PUC for the S8s.

Be another classic trip!"
Well the place cost €80,000,000

Be good to have it full...

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 18336 - 01/07/2018 20:57:49    2117398

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Replying To JayP:  "Isn't the neutral venue an away game? If its not a home game, its an away game.

Its not rocket science!!!"
so according to you, Dublin playing Donegal in Croke Park is an away game but Dublin playing Roscommon/round 4 qualifier in Croke Park is a home game?!

NaomhNaille (Donegal) - Posts: 89 - 01/07/2018 20:58:32    2117400

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Replying To jimbodub:  "Listen Muck

If it's going to be a neutral venue then let it be neutral and Clones IMO just isn't.

So what about maximum attendance and Clones holds a few more. We learnt this week that more pressing factors have precedent over bums on seats and generating revenue.

A truly neutral venue wouldn't be in Leinster or Ulster. If the game (which was pencilled in for CP months ago) is to be moved for the benefit of neutrality then let it be played in a suitable venue otherwise what's the point?"
How is Clones not neutral? It's in Monaghan which is actually closer to Dublin for God's sake.

Dublin & Donegal supporters will fill the place so you should have no fears of Donegal loving Monaghan & Tyrone people swamping the place.

The other reason I favour Clones is that from a travelling point of view it is more or less equidistant i.e. fair. Thurles isn't.

However as a peace offering or olive branch if you will, how about Castlebar?

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 4677 - 01/07/2018 21:43:16    2117416

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Replying To NaomhNaille:  "so according to you, Dublin playing Donegal in Croke Park is an away game but Dublin playing Roscommon/round 4 qualifier in Croke Park is a home game?!"
Right I'll break this down so your brain can get this......

If Dublin weren't in the Super 8's, every team would play in Croke Park (Neutral Venue), play at home, and play away. That means all Super 8 teams play 2 away games. The only exception to that is Dublin in the Super 8's. Dublins home game game will be moved to Croke Park. Away game happens. And Dublin play a Croke Park game (Neutral Venue). Now even if they move Dublin to Thurles (Neutral Venue) in the interest of "fairness", all teams will still play 2 away games!

Because of the whining, I'd want Dublin to play in Cork or Limerick for a good night out!!! But Thurles is the best option for capacity. Capacity rules out the venues out West and I'd rule out an Ulster venue because how could that be fair/neutral when Donegal are far more used to playing there will get the home dressing room yada yada yada.......

Same argument Donegal have with the Croke Park game Dublin could have with Clones.

Reality is "the rules" say its a Croke Park game!!!

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1758 - 01/07/2018 22:20:01    2117430

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I'm baffled by some of the logic here, how in the mother of God could Clones not be considered neutral? It doesn't matter what province it is in.

Going by this logic, hypothetically, if Kerry were to play Dublin at a neutral venue, it would need to be played in Clones or Castlebar or Galway? Is this correct? Somewhere in Ulster or Connacht? Thurles could not even be considered as it would not be seen as truly neutral and Kerry would be at an advantage.

Or if Cork were to play Galway at a neutral venue, Limerick would not be an option as this wouldnt be seen as truly neutral either and would be an 'advantage' to Cork. Screw the fact that it is equidistant to both counties!

HandballRef (Donegal) - Posts: 427 - 01/07/2018 23:49:16    2117458

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I think some Dubs here need a short lesson in the concept of neutrality. Understanable considering that HQ have done everything possible to smooth their path in recent years.

What is hard to understand though is how fellas can come on here, with a straight face, wittering on about how this Dublin team are the greatest ever when everything from venues to resources is stacked in their favour.

The times they are a changing folks, Kevin McStay & Cian O'Neill have burst the Croke Park balloon & Dubs will have to get used to it.

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 4677 - 02/07/2018 08:02:31    2117483

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Replying To MuckrossHead:  "I think some Dubs here need a short lesson in the concept of neutrality. Understanable considering that HQ have done everything possible to smooth their path in recent years.

What is hard to understand though is how fellas can come on here, with a straight face, wittering on about how this Dublin team are the greatest ever when everything from venues to resources is stacked in their favour.

The times they are a changing folks, Kevin McStay & Cian O'Neill have burst the Croke Park balloon & Dubs will have to get used to it."
I presume that's tongue in cheek Muck. This is an exceptionally gifted and hardworking group of players. Hard work wins you Sams not shiny dumbells. The GAA aren't doing everything to assist Dublin (do you really think all of our country cousins sitting at the top table want the Jackeens to hoover up all of the silverware for eternity?), they simply want to line their pockets. No Dublin fan would have a problem playing any championship game outside of the capital, as long as the venue is large enough. You know that of course.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 3167 - 02/07/2018 08:48:25    2117495

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Jesus we have the Donegal rattled before we have even taken the field

witnof (Dublin) - Posts: 1305 - 02/07/2018 08:49:26    2117497

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Replying To witnof:  "Jesus we have the Donegal rattled before we have even taken the field"
I think we have Dublin rattled, sure poor Alan Brogan had a full page article in the Indpendent yesterday about how Dublin should have their games in Croke Park, you could feel the nerves. Wait till we get you to Clones, the culchies will be waiting with pitch forks and straw hats ha ha.

I see this group will also contain Cork/Tyrone and Armagh/Rosocommon. You would have to fancy Dublin to top the group and the other 3 teams to fight it out for second spot. Who are Dublin away to? With the exception of Cork, can't see any of these home grounds being able to cater for the expected crowd, are we going to have the same issue again?

Green_Gold (Donegal) - Posts: 1245 - 02/07/2018 09:22:24    2117518

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Replying To Green_Gold:  "I think we have Dublin rattled, sure poor Alan Brogan had a full page article in the Indpendent yesterday about how Dublin should have their games in Croke Park, you could feel the nerves. Wait till we get you to Clones, the culchies will be waiting with pitch forks and straw hats ha ha.

I see this group will also contain Cork/Tyrone and Armagh/Rosocommon. You would have to fancy Dublin to top the group and the other 3 teams to fight it out for second spot. Who are Dublin away to? With the exception of Cork, can't see any of these home grounds being able to cater for the expected crowd, are we going to have the same issue again?"
Yes because like many Dubs getting tired of the bs from counties who have their hands out looking for money and then complaining they us in CP to make up this money.

Dublin away to Cork or Tyrone.

Funny people forget but when was our last defeat away in the League?........Despite the bs here Dublin do not mind and do well on road trips.

witnof (Dublin) - Posts: 1305 - 02/07/2018 09:52:52    2117537

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Some amount of nonsense in here coming from all angles.

My biggest issue is that our home game is the last game, which for provincial winners is ridiculous. I liked the idea of Super 8s as bringing teams to Ballybofey for a big championship match is great, we have a great home park in my opinion and it's a shame that it only gets a championship game once or twice a year if we're drawn at home in Ulster. So I was excited by that prospect - but now there's the possibility of that match being a dead rubber from our POV. My understanding is that the GAA wanted the provincial winners to play each other in Croke Park, to be honest I'm fine with that. But set that as the second match - all provincial winners should have their first match in the Super 8s at home. Otherwise where is the advantage for winning your province?

Playing the Dubs in Croker in Championship is a great occasion and from a Donegal perspective, I'm very much looking forward to it. I think our younger players will benefit massively from the experience. There's a wider conversation about the structure of the Super 8s and where the Dubs play but that's not really down to Dublin is it. The GAA will milk that cash cow for as long as they can. I don't see the point in suggesting Dublin's legacy will be tarnished or whatever it is Jim said. In fact I think that's quite harsh. I can understand the idea of asking the Dubs to come out and say they will support the neutral match being moved out of Croker. But to suggest that this squad, which is probably the best we've ever seen, will have their legacy tarnished because they played the majority of their matches in Croker is ridiculous in my opinion. Croke Park was no advantage to Dublin when they were getting beat in both Leinster and the All-Ireland series consistently for 15-odd years.

JoeSoap (Donegal) - Posts: 685 - 02/07/2018 10:04:15    2117543

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Ha ha ha. This thread is having me rolling around in laughter! Clones not a neutral venue for a game between Dublin and Donegal! What are you smoking cos I would love some...

Termon (Tyrone) - Posts: 50 - 02/07/2018 10:07:37    2117545

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GAA PRESIDENT JOHN Horan has confirmed that any county that qualifies for the Super 8s next month will have a home game, regardless of their venue size.

Horan, speaking on Morning Ireland after the draw for the round 4 of the All-Ireland SFC was made, added that Kildare will play their home game at Newbridge if they beat Fermanagh to make the last eight.

"It is in rule that each team in the Super 8s get a home game and that will be stood over," Horan said. "It was agreed at Congress and we won't be going back on that."

So there we are, St Conleths will be fit for the Super 8's with a capacity of 8'200, surely that means Parnell Park with its meaty 13'000 capacity will be fit to hold Dublin's home game?

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3214 - 02/07/2018 12:59:33    2117664

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Replying To Richieq:  "GAA PRESIDENT JOHN Horan has confirmed that any county that qualifies for the Super 8s next month will have a home game, regardless of their venue size.

Horan, speaking on Morning Ireland after the draw for the round 4 of the All-Ireland SFC was made, added that Kildare will play their home game at Newbridge if they beat Fermanagh to make the last eight.

"It is in rule that each team in the Super 8s get a home game and that will be stood over," Horan said. "It was agreed at Congress and we won't be going back on that."

So there we are, St Conleths will be fit for the Super 8's with a capacity of 8'200, surely that means Parnell Park with its meaty 13'000 capacity will be fit to hold Dublin's home game?"
I'm sure if you ask any county would they rather play Dublin in Croke Park in a half full stadium, with the crowd some distance from the pitch and on a pitch that your players are familiar with OR play the Dubs in Parnell, a compact ground where you can feel the Dub fans' spit in your ears when they're roaring, where your players have never played before and a ground that is the spiritual home of Dublin GAA, then that county would choose Croke Park all day long. I just hope that the top brass have done the maths in guaranteeing a home match for every county. Dublin must have about 10K season ticket holders who are guaranteed a ticket for the super 8s.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 3167 - 02/07/2018 13:51:50    2117704

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Dublin fans more than anyone else are up for a road trip and like going down the Country. An occasional Day out brightens peoples lives.
Home advantage at inter county level with longer travel logistics is worth between 5 to 8 points depending on who makes the estimate. This was shown by the Kildare result and can be seen by looking at league results checking away wins v home wins.

Players who put in big efforts want and deserve a fair competition. This could be done by having league on home/away
draws and the more serious championship at neutral venues ,unless agreed otherwise BY PLAYERS.

Ashrules (Dublin) - Posts: 166 - 02/07/2018 14:23:35    2117722

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Replying To Joxer:  "I'm sure if you ask any county would they rather play Dublin in Croke Park in a half full stadium, with the crowd some distance from the pitch and on a pitch that your players are familiar with OR play the Dubs in Parnell, a compact ground where you can feel the Dub fans' spit in your ears when they're roaring, where your players have never played before and a ground that is the spiritual home of Dublin GAA, then that county would choose Croke Park all day long. I just hope that the top brass have done the maths in guaranteeing a home match for every county. Dublin must have about 10K season ticket holders who are guaranteed a ticket for the super 8s."
Is that a fact you have 10k season tickets holders?
If this is the case the gaa and dublin county board have fuc..d up badly, greed has taken over, this has been done as you were promised Croke Park as your home ground, i think the gaa now need to revise this and only have season ticket holders getting a ticket for home games which is grand in Croke Park but not anywhere else.
The Gaa need to confirm to everyone the Croke Park is Dublin's home ground and stop this bullshit that gives them 2 home matches in the super 8s its the only fair thing to do.

Yourjoking (USA) - Posts: 431 - 02/07/2018 14:32:33    2117727

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Replying To Joxer:  "I'm sure if you ask any county would they rather play Dublin in Croke Park in a half full stadium, with the crowd some distance from the pitch and on a pitch that your players are familiar with OR play the Dubs in Parnell, a compact ground where you can feel the Dub fans' spit in your ears when they're roaring, where your players have never played before and a ground that is the spiritual home of Dublin GAA, then that county would choose Croke Park all day long. I just hope that the top brass have done the maths in guaranteeing a home match for every county. Dublin must have about 10K season ticket holders who are guaranteed a ticket for the super 8s."
Max number if season ticket holders allowed per county is 5000 I'm informed, now I believe you also have Parnell Passes but that is an internal scheme and really shouldn't affect the decision on venues

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3214 - 02/07/2018 14:52:33    2117736

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Replying To Joxer:  "I'm sure if you ask any county would they rather play Dublin in Croke Park in a half full stadium, with the crowd some distance from the pitch and on a pitch that your players are familiar with OR play the Dubs in Parnell, a compact ground where you can feel the Dub fans' spit in your ears when they're roaring, where your players have never played before and a ground that is the spiritual home of Dublin GAA, then that county would choose Croke Park all day long. I just hope that the top brass have done the maths in guaranteeing a home match for every county. Dublin must have about 10K season ticket holders who are guaranteed a ticket for the super 8s."
I don't know about that, the unfamiliarity would extend to the Dublin players too but that fact that it's the spiritual home of Dublin GAA is exactly why it deserves, the odd time, to have a big game. The GAA president has said home games will be played irregardless of venue capacity, Dublin's home spiritually and otherwise is Parnell Park so why, given what the president had said, will Dublin's home game be in Croke Park? Once again it shows how the hierarchy in the GAA have a wonderful ability of putting their foot in it and swiftly following with the other foot, these things add fuel to the fire if those who think the GAA is elitist and money driven although I like John Horan and think he's a really decent man and will make a good president he had left himself open with that statement

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3214 - 02/07/2018 14:59:18    2117739

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Replying To Richieq:  "Max number if season ticket holders allowed per county is 5000 I'm informed, now I believe you also have Parnell Passes but that is an internal scheme and really shouldn't affect the decision on venues"
I think the Gaa season ticket is 3500 and 1500 for internal county board schemes i think Dublin and Mayo are the only two counties fully subscribed through the GAA and County Board schemes, i think both schemes are fair enough as fans who go to every game are guaranteed a ticket and your loyalty rewarded per attendance at league games home and and away. Im open to correction on that.

The season ticket thing being part of this debate is a non event really, if Mayo had the max number of season ticket holders in Newbridge last week its really a non issue for any other venue. Its really a matter of the GAA just limiting the amount of tickets on general sale. 5000 season tickets can be accommodated at any ground in the country.

The choice really is changing venue Vs limiting tickets on sale.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 1589 - 02/07/2018 15:52:56    2117770

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Replying To TheUsername:  "I think the Gaa season ticket is 3500 and 1500 for internal county board schemes i think Dublin and Mayo are the only two counties fully subscribed through the GAA and County Board schemes, i think both schemes are fair enough as fans who go to every game are guaranteed a ticket and your loyalty rewarded per attendance at league games home and and away. Im open to correction on that.

The season ticket thing being part of this debate is a non event really, if Mayo had the max number of season ticket holders in Newbridge last week its really a non issue for any other venue. Its really a matter of the GAA just limiting the amount of tickets on general sale. 5000 season tickets can be accommodated at any ground in the country.

The choice really is changing venue Vs limiting tickets on sale."
If it's 5000 between the two that's fair enough, wouldn't have any issue there

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3214 - 02/07/2018 16:11:40    2117780

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