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Um what? Everybody has been bleating on about consistency. Whole point of consistency is everyone receives the same treatment. Doesn't matter if you're a Dublin God or a junior F player waiting for Jim Gavins call. Minor physical inference means he will play no gaa football at any level: training or matches. Because Louth are knocked out should have no relevance to the suspension. The punishment is the punishment no matter who you are.
SamandLiamSoon (Galway) - Posts:196 - 27/06/2017 21:02:43
Um what??
The point Liam made is that the punishments, although technically the same, are not consistent. It's nothing to do with what county either player plays for or who they are.
The suspensions should be game based and not time based.
Say Bernard Brogan was to commit the same offence as either Connolly or Burns in whatever is Dublin's final Championship game this year. He would rightly receive his 12 weeks suspension but seeing as his club is already out of the Club Championship he'd only miss a couple of League games for Plunketts. Whereas Connolly is going to miss possibly the bones of or even an entire inter-county Championship summer. Burns could well miss club Championship games through his suspension. When looked at above you can clearly see that the punishment based on time is stupid and inconsistent as the severity of your punishment is entirely based on the time of year that you commit the offence.
Basically pushing a linesman is worse at the start of the Championship as opposed to pushing the linesman in the All-Ireland Final. The punishment should be as consistent as possible no matter who you play for and no matter when you commit the offence.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13709 - 28/06/2017 08:07:45
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Replying To Liamwalkinstown: "And how many IC games will he miss in this 12 week ban ......but how many will DC miss with the same punishment....... Fair??" Clearly a good point.
The severity of Connolly's punishment was dictated by the time of year he committed the offence.
Burns gets done on a similar offence and will miss no inter-county games. In fairness though he'll probably miss some club championship. However if Brogan does the same thing in Dublin's final Championship game he's punishment, though technically the same, would in reality be an awful lot less severe than either Burns or Connolly as all he'd miss would be a couple of club League matches.
How people think that time based suspensions are fair is beyond me.
Minor physical interference with an official during Championship should warrant a 3/4 Championship game ban.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13709 - 28/06/2017 08:14:40
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Replying To MesAmis: "Clearly a good point.
The severity of Connolly's punishment was dictated by the time of year he committed the offence.
Burns gets done on a similar offence and will miss no inter-county games. In fairness though he'll probably miss some club championship. However if Brogan does the same thing in Dublin's final Championship game he's punishment, though technically the same, would in reality be an awful lot less severe than either Burns or Connolly as all he'd miss would be a couple of club League matches.
How people think that time based suspensions are fair is beyond me.
Minor physical interference with an official during Championship should warrant a 3/4 Championship game ban." The rule carries a ban on training also. If we were to apply your match ban to Burns, then he would be unable to train with his club or county until after the 3rd or 4th League game next year. Is that fairer?
I believe in match bans for infractions not involving officials. That's fair. Time bans are correct for more serious infractions. Burns was frustrated when he kicked the ball in the general direction of the umpire. He was looking in the same direction so he can't say he didn't see him. He didn't intend to hit the ball off the umpire but, any reasonable person would not blast a ball in the general direction of someone with their back turned to you and be aghast that you get punished.
I've seen one poster in this thread blaming the umpire for not being in his natural position. The umpire moved closer to the scene to see if the ball went over the line. He was trying to do his job and was returning to his natural position when he got hit. Respect officials lads, is this too much to ask?
CletusVanDamme (Kerry) - Posts: 63 - 28/06/2017 09:17:52
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the rulebook should state match bans
kicking the ball and hitting an umpire and putting your hands on an official are two completely different things!
valley84 (Westmeath) - Posts: 1890 - 28/06/2017 09:26:51
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Replying To MesAmis: "Clearly a good point.
The severity of Connolly's punishment was dictated by the time of year he committed the offence.
Burns gets done on a similar offence and will miss no inter-county games. In fairness though he'll probably miss some club championship. However if Brogan does the same thing in Dublin's final Championship game he's punishment, though technically the same, would in reality be an awful lot less severe than either Burns or Connolly as all he'd miss would be a couple of club League matches.
How people think that time based suspensions are fair is beyond me.
Minor physical interference with an official during Championship should warrant a 3/4 Championship game ban." Absolutely not a good point, as anyone who has played would know. The nature of our championship means that many counties may only get 2 championship games a year. Are you seriously suggesting that he not be allowed play county football for maybe 3 years.
The point is that his punishment is probably harsher, as not being able to play in his club champ and represent his home club, would be worse, especially as Louth are probably not going to be challenging for honours.
DC could miss the inter county champ but still get a great deal of football with Vincent's as Dublin will nearly certainly go the full inter county season. Burns may get very little football this year if his club get knocked out. If anything, his punishment is far more severe.
Anyway, rather than complaining about the punishment, the best way for these lads to be sure of playing as many games as possible is to stop behaving like spoilt brats and play the football they are so privileged to be able to play.
BaldyBadger (Cork) - Posts: 311 - 28/06/2017 09:56:34
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Dan Shanahan complaining about the TV coverage as well. Getting Bennett banned. What do they want to happen? Unsee what we see. These guys live in dream world. Things happen on the pitch that 10 years ago you would get away with, however with so much to now, you can't. Get over it! The simple answer is to stop committing petulant offences and play the game.
BaldyBadger (Cork) - Posts: 311 - 28/06/2017 10:03:12
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Replying To BaldyBadger: "Absolutely not a good point, as anyone who has played would know. The nature of our championship means that many counties may only get 2 championship games a year. Are you seriously suggesting that he not be allowed play county football for maybe 3 years.
The point is that his punishment is probably harsher, as not being able to play in his club champ and represent his home club, would be worse, especially as Louth are probably not going to be challenging for honours.
DC could miss the inter county champ but still get a great deal of football with Vincent's as Dublin will nearly certainly go the full inter county season. Burns may get very little football this year if his club get knocked out. If anything, his punishment is far more severe.
Anyway, rather than complaining about the punishment, the best way for these lads to be sure of playing as many games as possible is to stop behaving like spoilt brats and play the football they are so privileged to be able to play." Do you actually know how many games he's going to miss for his club?
keithlemon (Australia) - Posts: 920 - 28/06/2017 10:05:50
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Absolutely not a good point, as anyone who has played would know. The nature of our championship means that many counties may only get 2 championship games a year. Are you seriously suggesting that he not be allowed play county football for maybe 3 years.
The point is that his punishment is probably harsher, as not being able to play in his club champ and represent his home club, would be worse, especially as Louth are probably not going to be challenging for honours.
DC could miss the inter county champ but still get a great deal of football with Vincent's as Dublin will nearly certainly go the full inter county season. Burns may get very little football this year if his club get knocked out. If anything, his punishment is far more severe.
Anyway, rather than complaining about the punishment, the best way for these lads to be sure of playing as many games as possible is to stop behaving like spoilt brats and play the football they are so privileged to be able to play.
BaldyBadger (Cork) - Posts:49 - 28/06/2017 09:56:34
I don't see at all what is wrong with a player being banned for games and missing 3 Championship matches for getting involved with an official. 99.99% of players do not get involved with officials in such a manner so it isn't like we're asking them to perform brain surgery. If you don't want to miss games don't behave like a petulant child.
I'm not saying that Burns suspension is worse or better than Connolly's but highlighting that they've both fallen foul of the same rule, received the same sanction but in reality the two sanctions are very different. There is no consistency.
Rather than Championship bans maybe it could be inter-county league and Championship. It's still inconsistent but much less inconsistent than the frankly ridiculous time based sanctions that are completely inconsistent.
At least with game based sanctions a semblance of consistency exists.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13709 - 28/06/2017 10:15:16
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Replying To Liamwalkinstown: "And how many IC games will he miss in this 12 week ban ......but how many will DC miss with the same punishment....... Fair??" Connolly going to miss the Leinster final and the fourth round of the back door
Royal.Legend (Meath) - Posts: 665 - 28/06/2017 10:19:10
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The rule carries a ban on training also. If we were to apply your match ban to Burns, then he would be unable to train with his club or county until after the 3rd or 4th League game next year. Is that fairer?
I believe in match bans for infractions not involving officials. That's fair. Time bans are correct for more serious infractions. Burns was frustrated when he kicked the ball in the general direction of the umpire. He was looking in the same direction so he can't say he didn't see him. He didn't intend to hit the ball off the umpire but, any reasonable person would not blast a ball in the general direction of someone with their back turned to you and be aghast that you get punished.
I've seen one poster in this thread blaming the umpire for not being in his natural position. The umpire moved closer to the scene to see if the ball went over the line. He was trying to do his job and was returning to his natural position when he got hit. Respect officials lads, is this too much to ask?
CletusVanDamme (Kerry) - Posts:36 - 28/06/2017 09:17:52
I wouldn't have a ban on training for these instances at all. Really don't see the point in that for minor altercations. Something more serious yes. A time ban could only the implemented if it were for a year or over for very serious offences.
Time based bans are completely inconsistent. There will still be inconsistencies no matter what but with game based bans at least there can be some consistency.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13709 - 28/06/2017 10:20:45
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Replying To MesAmis: "Absolutely not a good point, as anyone who has played would know. The nature of our championship means that many counties may only get 2 championship games a year. Are you seriously suggesting that he not be allowed play county football for maybe 3 years.
The point is that his punishment is probably harsher, as not being able to play in his club champ and represent his home club, would be worse, especially as Louth are probably not going to be challenging for honours.
DC could miss the inter county champ but still get a great deal of football with Vincent's as Dublin will nearly certainly go the full inter county season. Burns may get very little football this year if his club get knocked out. If anything, his punishment is far more severe.
Anyway, rather than complaining about the punishment, the best way for these lads to be sure of playing as many games as possible is to stop behaving like spoilt brats and play the football they are so privileged to be able to play.
BaldyBadger (Cork) - Posts:49 - 28/06/2017 09:56:34
I don't see at all what is wrong with a player being banned for games and missing 3 Championship matches for getting involved with an official. 99.99% of players do not get involved with officials in such a manner so it isn't like we're asking them to perform brain surgery. If you don't want to miss games don't behave like a petulant child.
I'm not saying that Burns suspension is worse or better than Connolly's but highlighting that they've both fallen foul of the same rule, received the same sanction but in reality the two sanctions are very different. There is no consistency.
Rather than Championship bans maybe it could be inter-county league and Championship. It's still inconsistent but much less inconsistent than the frankly ridiculous time based sanctions that are completely inconsistent.
At least with game based sanctions a semblance of consistency exists." Fair point, it is certainly not an ideal system and I think the nature of our games does not help this.
BaldyBadger (Cork) - Posts: 311 - 28/06/2017 11:11:42
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Fair point, it is certainly not an ideal system and I think the nature of our games does not help this.
BaldyBadger (Cork) - Posts:51 - 28/06/2017 11:11:42
The structures of the competitions make it difficult and that is why I suppose time based suspensions have been the way.
However I think you could limit the inconsistencies by using game based sanctions instead.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13709 - 28/06/2017 11:43:15
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Replying To MesAmis: "Absolutely not a good point, as anyone who has played would know. The nature of our championship means that many counties may only get 2 championship games a year. Are you seriously suggesting that he not be allowed play county football for maybe 3 years.
The point is that his punishment is probably harsher, as not being able to play in his club champ and represent his home club, would be worse, especially as Louth are probably not going to be challenging for honours.
DC could miss the inter county champ but still get a great deal of football with Vincent's as Dublin will nearly certainly go the full inter county season. Burns may get very little football this year if his club get knocked out. If anything, his punishment is far more severe.
Anyway, rather than complaining about the punishment, the best way for these lads to be sure of playing as many games as possible is to stop behaving like spoilt brats and play the football they are so privileged to be able to play.
BaldyBadger (Cork) - Posts:49 - 28/06/2017 09:56:34
I don't see at all what is wrong with a player being banned for games and missing 3 Championship matches for getting involved with an official. 99.99% of players do not get involved with officials in such a manner so it isn't like we're asking them to perform brain surgery. If you don't want to miss games don't behave like a petulant child.
I'm not saying that Burns suspension is worse or better than Connolly's but highlighting that they've both fallen foul of the same rule, received the same sanction but in reality the two sanctions are very different. There is no consistency.
Rather than Championship bans maybe it could be inter-county league and Championship. It's still inconsistent but much less inconsistent than the frankly ridiculous time based sanctions that are completely inconsistent.
At least with game based sanctions a semblance of consistency exists." The issue with game bans is that it would never be clear. Both of Burns and Connolly have been banned for offences committed during inter county games. The suspension they have received prevents them from playing for there clubs as well. If either got say a three/four match ban, what does this consist of, is it just inter county matches? do club games count? does hurling count? etc. This is why a timed suspension should be implemented in these instances.
The only way that a match ban would work is if they only played for one or the other, which is not going to happen in the short term at least.
juicy (Meath) - Posts: 399 - 28/06/2017 12:33:27
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The ban was last week but was appealed, I don't know why it's only in the media now. Maybe citing by the gaa needs to be done sooner after a game so pundits won't get blamed for highlighting the incident. There was a difference in the media coverage both incidents got but that's just what goes with the profile of a high profile player and a lesser one. If two players are sent off in the premier league, MOTD will analyse the higher profile player more without a doubt. Jim gavin is simply trying to create a siege mentality or else is showing a personal loyalty towards Connolly.
Brolly is just being Brolly and Spillane simply analysed it in an anti dubs manner, but to say he is the reason for the ban is astonishing and the proof is that Byrnes got banned even though the incident did not get a mention on The Sunday game.
On the incident, only Byrnes can say whether it was deliberate or not, he is quite accurate though.
Ironic to think Connolly presented Byrnes with new balance boots when he burst into the scene with a goal v Westmeath and now they're both getting 3 month bans.
Is a huge loss to his club.
Frederick (Louth) - Posts: 479 - 28/06/2017 13:14:47
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Look he kicked the ball in the direction of the umpire out of frustration and connected with the umpire. Now I don't think he meant to do it but if we want consistency then a ban is deserved (For utter carelessness). He could have simply picked the ball up and kicked it over the umpire to the keeper.
As for this 12 week ban for club and county it is a JOKE!! Lads should be allowed train away with their club/county. I don't think the CCCC will be all that strict enforcing the training ban i'm sure Connolly will be training away with Dublin and Burns with his club. I don't think the CCCC will be going up to Hunterstown twice a week to make sure Ryan isn't training.
I would however make an amendment to the ban:
- No games for 12 weeks at intercounty level.
- No games for 6 weeks at club level.
- Still allowed train away with both club and county
UsernameInvalid (Meath) - Posts: 355 - 28/06/2017 13:18:28
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Replying To westkerry: "Spillane's fault again... Oh wait..." Sure, why would Pat bother getting involved? It's only a Louth player after all...
Gavvygavgav (Dublin) - Posts: 382 - 28/06/2017 13:40:04
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Replying To Liamwalkinstown: "And how many IC games will he miss in this 12 week ban ......but how many will DC miss with the same punishment....... Fair??" Surely this is a more severe ban than DC.
Conolly misses 3 county matches.
While Burns misses all his club campaign - which is probably more than 3.
Dr.Watson (Kildare) - Posts: 208 - 28/06/2017 13:46:53
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Replying To BaldyBadger: "Dan Shanahan complaining about the TV coverage as well. Getting Bennett banned. What do they want to happen? Unsee what we see. These guys live in dream world. Things happen on the pitch that 10 years ago you would get away with, however with so much to now, you can't. Get over it! The simple answer is to stop committing petulant offences and play the game." Thank God, someone is finally talking sense.
Dr.Watson (Kildare) - Posts: 208 - 28/06/2017 13:50:56
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Replying To maroondiesel: "The GAA is being fair because an official was hit, hitting officials is a 12 week ban minimun, it could be way more. There should be an anger management training course sponsored by the GAA? This might be a way for first offenders to move forward. Punks do not rule the GAA" Anybody remember the ref getting a belt of a hurl and a bloodied nose in a championship hurling match not so long ago? I don't believe the player was sanctioned and proper order too. Common sense must be applied.
DannyMcA (Dublin) - Posts: 260 - 28/06/2017 15:35:20
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Replying To Liamwalkinstown: "And how many IC games will he miss in this 12 week ban ......but how many will DC miss with the same punishment....... Fair??" If DC was lucky enough to be born in louth he'd miss none. Maybe he can get a transfer?
Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 29/06/2017 08:00:35
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