National Forum

The Dubs, The Monies & The Prejudices

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post


Replying To Joxer:  "Massive asterisk over those titles. Dublin had to play nearly twice the amount games to win the same amount of titles in an era were dedication levels are supreme and we're not housed in a hurling only province. Munster counties need to start campaigning to get Kerry out. Ulster would be the logical choice."
Yawn !!! If that's an attempt at trolling it's poor . If it's a genuine comment it's stupid .

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 04/07/2019 20:49:01    2205614

Link

Replying To GeniusGerry:  "Your attempt to run down one of the sports great teams is pathetic Jim. Every team played less games then and Kerry won titles right throughout the 00's when they had to play 6,7,8 games just as well.

That late 70's / 80's possibly wasn't the greatest era in football but now is arguably worse where you have one great team and everyone else struggling for one reason or another. It's not 'competitive' if one team is winning everything, usually not having a glove laid on them until the final, if even. This is a great Dublin team but they are also the most privileged side in any sport that I know of ever, getting a massive leg up in every way imaginable year after year.

And you regularly go on about Kerry having a weak province and all these extra games Dublin have to play. Leinster over the past five years has been an embarrassment and the extra games are against really poor opposition and you know it. It's conceivable that Dublin May never again be beaten there. Some players on opposing teams are actually suggesting strikes such is the imbalance in the province and the glaring gap in resources and standards, others have already walked away quietly with the result many county teams cannot depend on having their best 15 available any more.

And you want to claim Dublins success is worth more than another counties? Pull the other one Jim"
That's a fair assessment Gerry.

baire (Galway) - Posts: 1785 - 04/07/2019 20:49:23    2205615

Link

Replying To Joxer:  "Massive asterisk over those titles. Dublin had to play nearly twice the amount games to win the same amount of titles in an era were dedication levels are supreme and we're not housed in a hurling only province. Munster counties need to start campaigning to get Kerry out. Ulster would be the logical choice."
Dublin are a province playing intercounty football teams in an intercounty championship.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 04/07/2019 20:51:53    2205619

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Exactly and they're trying to say money doesn't matter :-)"
The Dubs are amateurs. They have jobs. They are not professional at least not ij the sense that certain Kerry players were in the past. I know one of their parents supported them while they 'devoted their time' to GAA but wasn't it well for them?
All the Dubs are either studying org are in gainful employment.

avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1974 - 04/07/2019 20:52:22    2205620

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Exactly and they're trying to say money doesn't matter :-)"
Ah listen Kid , with your 37 All Irelands and 81 Munsters , Theres no shortage of money with your lot , stop the whinging now -:)

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2837 - 04/07/2019 21:04:17    2205629

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "Dublin are a province playing intercounty football teams in an intercounty championship."
What a load of nonsense Kid.

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2837 - 04/07/2019 21:12:28    2205632

Link

Replying To avonali:  "The Dubs are amateurs. They have jobs. They are not professional at least not ij the sense that certain Kerry players were in the past. I know one of their parents supported them while they 'devoted their time' to GAA but wasn't it well for them?
All the Dubs are either studying org are in gainful employment."
Will you go away with that hearsay nonsense. A lot of players are in jobs and areas that support their inter county careers. The days of lads coming off the building site at 6pm and training at 7pm is gone. Didn't Paul Flynn go back to college and change careers because it was too difficult to work a physical job and play for Dublin?

Many IC players are teachers, students etc and have the summer off as another example. There was a report in recent years suggesting an inter county career was a 30hr per week commitment. Very few players are doing that without some sort of dispensation from their employers.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 04/07/2019 21:21:21    2205638

Link

Replying To superbluedub:  "What a load of nonsense Kid."
It's not a load of nonsense ye have the population of a province and ye get the funding of a province thereby ye are in fact a province.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 04/07/2019 21:27:11    2205642

Link

The GAA President says rural counties receive money through provincial councils and Dublin receive their gigantic portion through the GAA. Dublin GAA are being given the funding of a province, and more, for themselves. Surely provincial funding brings a provincial responsibility? Dublin are the province to revive the Railway Cup.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7826 - 04/07/2019 22:08:40    2205659

Link

Replying To GeniusGerry:  "Will you go away with that hearsay nonsense. A lot of players are in jobs and areas that support their inter county careers. The days of lads coming off the building site at 6pm and training at 7pm is gone. Didn't Paul Flynn go back to college and change careers because it was too difficult to work a physical job and play for Dublin?

Many IC players are teachers, students etc and have the summer off as another example. There was a report in recent years suggesting an inter county career was a 30hr per week commitment. Very few players are doing that without some sort of dispensation from their employers."
Where was the hearsay? Please identify what exactly was false in what I wrote.,

avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1974 - 04/07/2019 22:16:40    2205666

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "It's not a load of nonsense ye have the population of a province and ye get the funding of a province thereby ye are in fact a province."
Nope , it is a load of nonsense , we always had the population , never stopped your lot winning 37 All Irelands, you saying Dublin is a provence means diddly squat , stop the whinging , yea cant be top dogs all the time COYBIB -:)

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2837 - 04/07/2019 22:18:43    2205670

Link

Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "It's not a load of nonsense ye have the population of a province and ye get the funding of a province thereby ye are in fact a province."
We had the population of a Province when ye lads were lording it in Croke Park. Ye had no problem heading up to Croke Park then - oh but now that the shoe is on the other foot it's all different now isn't it.

avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1974 - 04/07/2019 22:19:17    2205672

Link

Replying To legendzxix:  "The GAA President says rural counties receive money through provincial councils and Dublin receive their gigantic portion through the GAA. Dublin GAA are being given the funding of a province, and more, for themselves. Surely provincial funding brings a provincial responsibility? Dublin are the province to revive the Railway Cup."
Yea Right keep making a right tool of yourself lol...

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2837 - 04/07/2019 22:29:47    2205676

Link

Replying To GeniusGerry:  "Will you go away with that hearsay nonsense. A lot of players are in jobs and areas that support their inter county careers. The days of lads coming off the building site at 6pm and training at 7pm is gone. Didn't Paul Flynn go back to college and change careers because it was too difficult to work a physical job and play for Dublin?

Many IC players are teachers, students etc and have the summer off as another example. There was a report in recent years suggesting an inter county career was a 30hr per week commitment. Very few players are doing that without some sort of dispensation from their employers."
What report was that ? link ?

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2837 - 04/07/2019 22:32:42    2205678

Link

Replying To GeniusGerry:  "Will you go away with that hearsay nonsense. A lot of players are in jobs and areas that support their inter county careers. The days of lads coming off the building site at 6pm and training at 7pm is gone. Didn't Paul Flynn go back to college and change careers because it was too difficult to work a physical job and play for Dublin?

Many IC players are teachers, students etc and have the summer off as another example. There was a report in recent years suggesting an inter county career was a 30hr per week commitment. Very few players are doing that without some sort of dispensation from their employers."
There's no hearsay here. These are facts.
Another fact, Darran O'Sullivan and Kieran Donaghy both left their jobs to focus on their footballing careers.
I know for a fact that many Kerry players and ex-players drive around in nice cars like Audis for instance. I don't think they took out a loan for them.
Now will you got away and check you're facts.

This is a list of Dublin players' occupations.
Steven Cluxton - Teacher.
Philly McMahon - Business.
Cian O'Sullivan - Tax Consultant PWC.
Michael Fitzsimons - Physiotherapist.
Jonny Cooper - Student recruitment, DCU.
John Small - Account officer, Digicom Office technology.
Eric Lowndes - Teacher.
Brian Fenton - Physiotherapist, Beaumount Hospital.
James McCarthy -Bank rep.
Ciarán Kilkenny - Student St Pat's Drumcondra.
Con O'Callaghan - Student, UCD.
Jack McCaffrey - Student, UCD.
Paul Mannion - Digital innovation student, UCD.
Paddy Andrews - Dealer in stockbrokers.
Dean Rock - Leisure centre executive, Stewarts sports centre, Palmerstown.
Kevin McManamon - Sports psychology consultant.

avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1974 - 04/07/2019 22:43:19    2205682

Link

Replying To superbluedub:  "Nope , it is a load of nonsense , we always had the population , never stopped your lot winning 37 All Irelands, you saying Dublin is a provence means diddly squat , stop the whinging , yea cant be top dogs all the time COYBIB -:)"
Population of a province + Funding of a province =

Dublin v Ulster
Connaught v Dublin
Dublin v Munster
Leinster v Dublin

Seems a fairly competitive fixture list for an inter-provincial round robin. Fairer population balance. Fairer provincial funding spread as well. Vienna is 1 of 9 provinces in Austria. Dublin has evolved. It's the Ireland we live in.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7826 - 04/07/2019 22:47:05    2205685

Link

Replying To avonali:  "Where was the hearsay? Please identify what exactly was false in what I wrote.,"
You said that you know a players parents looked after him while he concentrated on football, I'd call that hearsay unless you can substantiate it which I doubt very much. Even if you can it is one player and hardly the norm as your post was implying. It is also not professionalism btw.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 05/07/2019 00:26:13    2205712

Link

Yez are some Craic lads :)

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 05/07/2019 05:32:09    2205722

Link

Replying To superbluedub:  "Yea Right keep making a right tool of yourself lol..."
You do realize he is winding you up?

For the record, if the idea of putting massive funding into Dublin's underage structures is to "grow the game" it has worked. The problem with this growth is that there is now a bottle neck at age 18 as there is not enough clubs and facilities to accommodate them playing at adult level.

You now have huge growth of Astro leagues, tag rugby and the like as all the lads pour out of juvenile but end up playing in a clubs 5,6 or 7 team where the commitment to training is high but the rewards are few. They drop away from GAA to something less demanding but still keeps them active.

The expansion of GAA in south Dublin from 2002 has been incredible. The problem is there are no new clubs or new facilities to keep the expansion going.

The natural step is to stop funding games development and fund new clubs and facilities, or else increase funding into Dublin. Should a further increase happen then the Natural progression is in creating new county teams within Dublin.

As the population drifts to cities across the country the GAA needs to adapt to it by creating new clubs and city teams, and amalgamation of rural clubs and counties.

If we want a fair and competitive inter county championship the future will be

Northern Championship
Belfast, Derry City, Donegal/Fermanagh, Tyrone, Derry, Cavan/Monaghan, Down, Belfast, Armagh, Antrim

Eastern Championship
Louth, North Dublin, West Dublin, Dublin City, South Dublin, East Meath, Meath, North Kildare, South Kildare, Wicklow, Wexford/Carlow,

South Western Championship
Mayo/Sligo, Leitrim/Roscommon/Longford/Westmeath,
Galway County, Galway City, Cork, Cork City, Kerry/Limerick, Limerick City,Clare/Tipp/Waterford, Kilkenny/Laois/Offaly,

tirawleybaron (Mayo) - Posts: 1105 - 05/07/2019 06:12:44    2205726

Link

Replying To Greengrass:  "Wonderfully articulate but entirely self serving . Nowhere do you mention Dublin receiving €21.6 million and counting whilst Cork who were next on the list in terms of games development money received between 2008-2019 were given €1,680,000 by The GAA. Dublin hurlers have improved immensely and are now a very competitive force . Just ask Galway . They have won a league and Leinster title . This from a county that were absolutely nowhere a decade and a half ago . The football equivalent would be Louth winning a league and Leinster title . Can you seriously see that happening ? The references to Kilkenny and Kerry are ridiculous . People didn't panic during those eras because they knew those teams had a life cycle . They don't compare because they hadn't colossal financial advantages bestowed upon them by The GAA . You talk about socially deprived areas in Dublin and the influence of soccer . The exact same can be seen in Dundalk but hey where's the money ? Town teams with large schools in their areas can't field underage teams. Do The GAA give a damn ?
You have drawn up lists of successful teams achievements in Gaelic Games. Most of them are hurling teams which is still very much the second sport in Dublin GAA despite the recent success of their schools, minor U21 and senior teams . At minor level since 2010 Dublin hurlers have won 4 Leinster titles and been runners up 4 times . During that time they have played in more Leinster finals than any other county including Kilkenny . At U21 level since 2010 Dublin hurlers have won 3 Leinster titles and been runners up once . That's a serious record for a county that according to you is not successful and that was nowhere a decade and a half ago . But hey money doesn't matter. Dublin ladies have played in the last 5 All Ireland finals winning the last two . They won it for the first time in 2010 eight years after the SRC report recommended significant GAA investment in Dublin . But hey money doesn't matter. You spoke about Dublin minor footballers lack of success . Since 2009 they have won 1 All Ireland and five Leinsters . But hey money doesn't matter. I wonder why you didn't speak about Dublin's U 20/21 footballers . Since 2010 they have won 4 All Irelands and 6 Leinsters . You didn't speak about Dublin's senior footballers either . Since 2010 they have won 6 All Irelands and 9 Leinsters . Do you notice the improvements as the young players are going up the grades ? But sure hey according to you money doesn't matter You never mentioned Dublin receiving €21.6 million in games development grants between 2008-2019 from The GAA whilst Cork who are next on the list got €1.68 million . But sure hey that shouldn't matter because according to you money doesn't matter. YEAH RIGHT !!!"
Excellent post Greengrass. Those in favour of Dublin's funding levels and, or who say it has in no way contributed to their success love to point out the modest success at minor level. Of course we know the true grade that delivers Senior success is U20/21 and Dublin have been hugely successful here. Multiple wins for Kerry and Tyrone in the late 90s and early 2000's underpinned their multiple senior All Ireland's in the 2000's. To support the point Tyrone have won a number of minor's since 2008 but only one team has converted to U20/21 success, many of who are now underpinning their senior team. Laois in the 1990s are another example of why minors do not guarantee senior success. But Dublin have been the most successful U20/21 football team of the last decade - coincidently.

The likes of Tommy Lyons etc like to point to minors and forget about U20/21. Suits him perfectly. Then trotting out that he nearly lost the one footed Paul Mannion to soccer as he was a school's boy international. Jason McGee of Donegal was also a schools boy international but we managed to hold on to him. Unlike Seamus Coleman. But would appear that's the best example Tommy Lyons can muster, one which no doubt applies to other counties and not just poor Tommy and Dublin. Maybe the money and commercial opportunity has stopped Dublin loosing players to Aussie Rules - they seem to loose few relative to other counties.

It is self evident that Dublin's success in football and now emerging success in hurling is materially linked to the significant funding they have received. If not then (1) Give back the excess over average money received, (2) the GAA need to acknowledge it was money poorly invested, or (3) Acknowledge it and split the county.

DonegalAtlantic (Donegal) - Posts: 111 - 05/07/2019 08:40:39    2205745

Link