National Forum

The Super 8

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Replying To Soma:  "Except Armagh (or whoever it might be) would say how come all other teams in the Super 8 get a game in Croke Park but they dont, it's totally unfair and a real kick in the teeth for the smaller county etc etc. Remember Roscommon and Mayo both wanted to play their replay in Croke Park last year despite it being a 2nd weekend of both counties having to drive across the country."
The only two ways all teams can get a game in Croke Park are i) if Dublin play their home games in Parnell Park (and neutral in Croke Park) or ii) if Dublin play twice in Croke Park. Both of these create difficulties (attendance in the first, Dublin advantage in the second (and first, maybe)). If all teams insist on playing in Croke Park at least once, then one of the above pills must be swallowed.

Kurt_Angle (Dublin) - Posts: 427 - 16/04/2018 10:14:43    2093210

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Replying To Kurt_Angle:  "The only two ways all teams can get a game in Croke Park are i) if Dublin play their home games in Parnell Park (and neutral in Croke Park) or ii) if Dublin play twice in Croke Park. Both of these create difficulties (attendance in the first, Dublin advantage in the second (and first, maybe)). If all teams insist on playing in Croke Park at least once, then one of the above pills must be swallowed."
Then let option 1 be the way it's run. Dublin play a home game in Parnell Park and a neutral game in Croke Park. The Super 8 was sold as everyone playing one game home and away and one game in Croke Park. If this wasn't feasible to start with why was the Super 8 ever thought up of and voted through? The whole thing will have been a farce.

kildare73 (Kildare) - Posts: 772 - 16/04/2018 15:10:51    2093313

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Replying To kildare73:  "Then let option 1 be the way it's run. Dublin play a home game in Parnell Park and a neutral game in Croke Park. The Super 8 was sold as everyone playing one game home and away and one game in Croke Park. If this wasn't feasible to start with why was the Super 8 ever thought up of and voted through? The whole thing will have been a farce."
I don't think many fair minded Dubs would have a problem with that setup (or with the home game being in Croker and the neutral game being in Thurles / Clones / Port Laoise etc.). I'd feel that a lot of teams with grounds with more modest capacity would prefer to play their home game actually at home. God help who decides the actual ticket allocation in those cases.

Kurt_Angle (Dublin) - Posts: 427 - 16/04/2018 15:38:19    2093321

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Replying To kildare73:  "Then let option 1 be the way it's run. Dublin play a home game in Parnell Park and a neutral game in Croke Park. The Super 8 was sold as everyone playing one game home and away and one game in Croke Park. If this wasn't feasible to start with why was the Super 8 ever thought up of and voted through? The whole thing will have been a farce."
Excellent post.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 7761 - 16/04/2018 15:40:26    2093323

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Let me make this clear, Dublin have ZERO problem playing in Parnell, its a garuanteed win.

I would put Dublin there and have it on SKY just to piss all the people off that are moaning about Dublin!

Just as a side note people do realise it is 3 years since we have been beaten away from home!!??

witnof (Dublin) - Posts: 1375 - 16/04/2018 16:26:57    2093337

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Replying To kildare73:  "Then let option 1 be the way it's run. Dublin play a home game in Parnell Park and a neutral game in Croke Park. The Super 8 was sold as everyone playing one game home and away and one game in Croke Park. If this wasn't feasible to start with why was the Super 8 ever thought up of and voted through? The whole thing will have been a farce."
Is playing In Parnell Park less of an advantage to Dublin?

That's a stupid solution and it won't happen.

For Dublin to not have an advantage a team they are playing has to forego a Croke Park fixture. Give that team the option of a properly Neutral venue or Croker.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 2147 - 16/04/2018 18:21:55    2093364

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Croke Park is not Dublin's home ground. It is as much our ground or Kerry's or Galway's as it is Dublin's. It holds no advantage as far as I can see in terms of the actual game.

The only real advantage is the pocket of their supporters and county board not having to fork out expensive travel and accommodation in peak summer months.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 9363 - 16/04/2018 19:54:50    2093383

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Replying To yew_tree:  "Croke Park is not Dublin's home ground. It is as much our ground or Kerry's or Galway's as it is Dublin's. It holds no advantage as far as I can see in terms of the actual game.

The only real advantage is the pocket of their supporters and county board not having to fork out expensive travel and accommodation in peak summer months."
I think it's more of an advantage than that yewtree.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 7761 - 16/04/2018 21:10:32    2093401

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "I think it's more of an advantage than that yewtree."
Ok maybe the fact the Dublin players get to sleep in their own beds and travel less. Outside of that....??

Don't give me the crowd and hill argument because that works against them when things go wrong...also in Mayo's cause we matched their support numbers wise and I oh look could have outnumbered them on one occasion and also shared the hill with them (much to their annoyance).

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 9363 - 16/04/2018 21:39:41    2093412

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Replying To Whammo86:  "Is playing In Parnell Park less of an advantage to Dublin?

That's a stupid solution and it won't happen.

For Dublin to not have an advantage a team they are playing has to forego a Croke Park fixture. Give that team the option of a properly Neutral venue or Croker."
I'm under no illusion that Dublin will play in Parnell Park in the Super 8s, of course they won't. But why go to the bother of constructing this whole concept of a Super 8 format if certain counties around the country are going to be told their particular home ground isn't going to be able to host a match? Isn't the home, away and Croke Park format and the centre of the concept? I'm using Parnell Park as an example but there will be other grounds ruled out too I'm sure. Then the whole idea falls asunder at the first hurdle. Like I said, farce. Two years ago Portlaoise was deemed not good enough to host Dublin when Laois drew them at home in the championship and they had to forfeit the home game in favour of Kilkenny but last year it could host Carlow v Dublin without an extra seat being installed. I'm not accusing Dublin of having anything to do with any of that, just using it as an example. So who will decide which grounds are up to holding Super 8 matches and what will the criteria be? So far the decision making hasn't exactly been consistent.

kildare73 (Kildare) - Posts: 772 - 17/04/2018 02:24:36    2093437

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Replying To witnof:  "Let me make this clear, Dublin have ZERO problem playing in Parnell, its a garuanteed win.

I would put Dublin there and have it on SKY just to piss all the people off that are moaning about Dublin!

Just as a side note people do realise it is 3 years since we have been beaten away from home!!??"
Why would putting Dublin on Sky piss people off?? They have already been on Sky and we all survived just fine. And just as a side note, Dublin haven't played an away Championship game in Leinster since 2006.

kildare73 (Kildare) - Posts: 772 - 17/04/2018 02:29:27    2093438

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Replying To kildare73:  "I'm under no illusion that Dublin will play in Parnell Park in the Super 8s, of course they won't. But why go to the bother of constructing this whole concept of a Super 8 format if certain counties around the country are going to be told their particular home ground isn't going to be able to host a match? Isn't the home, away and Croke Park format and the centre of the concept? I'm using Parnell Park as an example but there will be other grounds ruled out too I'm sure. Then the whole idea falls asunder at the first hurdle. Like I said, farce. Two years ago Portlaoise was deemed not good enough to host Dublin when Laois drew them at home in the championship and they had to forfeit the home game in favour of Kilkenny but last year it could host Carlow v Dublin without an extra seat being installed. I'm not accusing Dublin of having anything to do with any of that, just using it as an example. So who will decide which grounds are up to holding Super 8 matches and what will the criteria be? So far the decision making hasn't exactly been consistent."
Another excellent point.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 7761 - 17/04/2018 11:29:43    2093475

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Replying To yew_tree:  "Ok maybe the fact the Dublin players get to sleep in their own beds and travel less. Outside of that....??

Don't give me the crowd and hill argument because that works against them when things go wrong...also in Mayo's cause we matched their support numbers wise and I oh look could have outnumbered them on one occasion and also shared the hill with them (much to their annoyance)."
There are other little things like being a free taker and being able to judge the wind on a given day yewtree. but definitely being able to sleep in your own bed the night before a big game is massive in my opinion.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 7761 - 17/04/2018 11:51:52    2093485

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They had Ja Fallon, Ray Silke and Sean Og dePaor on Off The Ball at the weekend talking about 98 etc.

Fallon reckoned staying in the Berkeley (I think) the night before the final was good thing and made little of "sleeping in your own bed".

Breffni39 (Cavan) - Posts: 11502 - 17/04/2018 12:09:32    2093493

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Dub lads sleeping in their own beds hasn't been much of advantage until 2011... strange that

Never in my life did I hear one Kerry supporter talk about it..

It certainly wasn't spoken about from 1984-1995 or 1996- 2011

Lots and lots of snuggle sleeps in their own beds acroos years when Dublin were getting stuffed..

That's what I couldn't get my head around when we went so long without even reaching a final... matching Dublin's worst record ever across the 00's.. watching Dublin getting hammered in Croke Park..

I used to think while watching on with head in hands.. "But.. but.. we sleep in our own beds"

I was surprised it wasn't brought up more back then... but then again... why would it?

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 18663 - 17/04/2018 12:18:27    2093499

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "There are other little things like being a free taker and being able to judge the wind on a given day yewtree. but definitely being able to sleep in your own bed the night before a big game is massive in my opinion."
On the free-taking in Croke Park thing, are you suggesting teams that play there very regularly, let's say, I dunno, Kerry, for arguments sake, have a distinct advantage over those that don't?

Breffni39 (Cavan) - Posts: 11502 - 17/04/2018 12:22:43    2093503

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Replying To Breffni39:  "On the free-taking in Croke Park thing, are you suggesting teams that play there very regularly, let's say, I dunno, Kerry, for arguments sake, have a distinct advantage over those that don't?"
Yes I would say it helps.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 7761 - 17/04/2018 13:03:35    2093520

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Replying To Breffni39:  "They had Ja Fallon, Ray Silke and Sean Og dePaor on Off The Ball at the weekend talking about 98 etc.

Fallon reckoned staying in the Berkeley (I think) the night before the final was good thing and made little of "sleeping in your own bed"."
Everyone is different I guess, I know several Kerry players past and present that have trouble sleeping in strange hotels and other Kerry players like gooch had no problems .

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 7761 - 17/04/2018 13:06:40    2093523

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Replying To TheUsername:  "Anyone else really looking forward to them, i am a huge fan of the new Super 8 format for many reasons:

So here we go:

Group A - Connacht, Munster, Ulster loser/qualifier, Leinster loser/qualifier.
Group B - Leinster, Ulster, Connacht loser/qualifier, Munster loser/qualifier.

Order of fixtures in both groups

Round 1

Team 1 v Team 2. Croke Park

Team 3 v Team 4. Croke Park

Round 2

Team 1 v Team 3 or 4. Home advantage for provincial champions.

Team 2 V Team 3 or 4. Home advantage for provincial champions.

Round 3

Team 1 v Team 3 or 4. Home advantage for Team 3 or 4.

Team 2 v Team 3 or 4. Home advantage for Team 3 or 4."
so Dublin leaves croke park for a single match .....oooh major shake up that one

AnCeisCLG (Fermanagh) - Posts: 38 - 17/04/2018 13:23:28    2093534

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Didn't seem to be a problem with the unfamiliarity of the venue when Maurice Fitz kicked his point in Thurles.
Funny that though. Maybe he had a good nights sleep though.

Dubh_linn (Dublin) - Posts: 1804 - 17/04/2018 13:41:37    2093539

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